Was in a foul mood yesterday. So browsed through this talk again. Seems I was too critical of Z. Still, the main conflict between Z and Ecce wasn’t enlightening. You had Ecce presenting a perhaps worthy idea weakly, and Z presenting the supposed opposite with force. Both action-plans were necessarily vague. A strong moderator was needed. And a non weirdo combatant. Someday maybe the D-Right will have a seat at professionally conducted mainstream discussions and debates. As entertainment in getting to hear Z extrapolate freely, it was cool.
“What are you going to do?”
Well, for one you guys are doing a podcast that will raise awareness in other people. Peter Brimelow wrote a book in 1997, which arguably led straight to the Trump presidency, through Ann coulter’s book. I am completely pessimistic, believing that the cause is lost by the way, but I still want to struggle! If you fight defeat is likely, if you do nothing, it’s certain!
“I am completely pessimistic, believing that the cause is lost by the way” Respect to you, Harmonium.
Brimelow tells a story about courting his first wife in the 1970s, when he explained to her that he was an anti-Communist and that his side was probably going to lose, but he had to do his duty. The punch line is the entirely unexpected collapse of Communism in 1989.
I joined WN in the early 2010s, before the rise of the Alt Right, when there was little hope of success. I joined the losing side out of duty!
Good job on Luke’s show. You sniffed out that soy boy with the black pills within seconds. It was hilarious! I think you would do well on the internet blood sports circuit!
But that’s the thing Nick. Z can’t go full black pill in these discussions because it would be too dark. So his action plan seems vague. He sort of has to stop at “tell your fellow whites to be proud.” When he really wants to say “we need to start hating like motherfuckers.” He can’t go into the violent implications of that either.
This conversation affirms that group discussion isn’t optimal for understanding. If anything it furthers misunderstanding.
Anyone with such a bizarre conversational demeanor as this Ecce fellow, really shouldn’t be invited to these things. Though it was great for a laugh. “Sorry, my phone is ringing…umm…I’m not going to answer it.”
As for aggression, Ecce was actually first to be prickly. He asks Z a pointless question about Ms. Cortez in New York, then cuts Z off with an autistically bitchy, “that’s fine, it doesn’t really matter, the point is…” He threw the shield of decorum aside with that little snip, and paid for it for the rest of the show.
Z tends to be an either/or type guy and a dominating generalizer. This can make for difficult, unfruitful conversation. On questions of strategy, one is left wondering, as the saying goes, “why can’t we have both?”
Z never made clear why we can’t work to influence demographics (Ecce) and identity (Z) at the same time. Z’s stance: “either focus on one…or waste our time like idiots”, wasn’t convincing. In essay form it might be. Not in disjointed conversation.
And if he did it as he says to “shake someone into reality”. Fine, but he didn’t make a fluent case.
Which is why one should listen to discussions more as a way to pass the time than anything serious. Contrary to memory, even Buckley’s Firing Line was an annoying mess.
When pressed Z will often divert with metaphorical imagery/scenarios, then when we’ve all forgotten the question, slip into a long pet theory.
He has a tendency to cut people off, borne of disdain for differing views. The impulse being “I know where you’re coming from and I don’t even wanna hear it.” Fine for Z, and he’s nearly always big-picture correct. But bad for a listener who actually wants to hear someone else’s take.
The thing is, Z’s never been challenged in these public discussions by a top guy, who’d force him to be on point. Who’d force him to be as good as he surely would be.
Sharp analysis Frip. Z won through force of personality, which is what matters most, but not on the intellectual plane. Most people follow the dominant personality but we must be intellectually rigorous. Although I side with Z, I believe Ecce is correct about Texas turning blue and the significance of that change.
Z went up against Enoch, who has at least as much fire power as Z, but Enoch kicked over the table instead of debating Z on the awkward points of the JQ.
I can’t find the Z/Enoch talk anywhere. Could you give me a link? Thanks.
Its Daily Shoah EP: 295 “Z Paywall Spess” from May 18, 2018. It’s a paywall episode. I listened on youtube when it was new, but I can’t find there now.
Ecce came off as odd and on the spectrum, but no offense Z, you’re not an effective bully. It comes across (IMHO) as cantankerous/”get off of my lawn.”, and a bit contemptuous/sullen.
I’m also GenX, and although we do not bear as much responsibility for the current disaster as Boomers, being dismissive of demographic concerns could easily interpreted by Millennials/GenZ as “Whatever, I’ll be dead before South Africa happens.”
You’re an especially adaptable White person to be able to live in Baltimore, and doubt most Whites would learn to function as well as you apparently have in that environment. Using yourself as an example of “See, I’m my corpse isn’t rotting in an alley yet.” isn’t comforting to anyone. Wouldn’t telling someone with a fatherly tone of, “I understand your concerns. They are valid.” do more to foster our people feeling part of a collective identity that you claim is key? Vs. “I demand you solve the immigration/demographic crisis in a 3 minute segment of a conversation on the internet.” Even if you’re 100% right, humiliating someone publicly should be reserved for enemies.
You were vague as to what your plan actually entails – make normie Whites see themselves as White. I agree that’s very important. Maybe you have written a detailed strategy document on how to accomplish this, but besides mentioning things other people have done (“It’s ok to be White”/pool parties) I don’t remember hearing anything specific or novel from you on how to accomplish what you claim is key and crucial. Ecce could have easily turned around the demands for specifics on you…..”The price of a successful attack is a constructive alternative.”
We all know there are no easy answers to demographics. If there were, we’d already have done them. Whites are increasingly going to need a place to turn when they wake up to the fact the (((system))) wants them dead. Hectoring others for not sharing the exact set of beliefs we favor is not an effective strategy for building a coalition of race-aware White identitarians. Enoch bullies leftists, it’s not friendly fire.
Faced with the choice, “Those people want me dead, and these people – my people have my back.” they will be ours forever.
My two cents.
translation: “low-number troll” = O.G.
I know that the zman is a fan of James Lafond. I highly recommend his interview with the myth of 20th century podcast. I’m hardcore and pretty knowledgeable about our side, but the red pills almost chocked me! Lafond has hit his stride. http://jameslafond.com/article.php?id=10598
+1 for the “We need a Pinochet” moment. +1000 .
The solution I propose to the impending racial imbalance is to encourage our white youth to have more sex! (more white babies). But then, that’s my answer for nearly everything 🙂
I tend to lay low and not comment, but I have to say, Z took that whiny goofball to school. And I don’t even mean it pejoratively. Good job of trying to pry that guys eyes open with a crowbar. That monotonistic drone made me tune out with a half hour left.
The phrase “petulant child” comes to mind.
I’ll finish it off in the next couple of days.
In the meantime, keep up the good work.
Good God A-L-M-I-G-H-T-Y!
The mere fact that you didn’t LITERALLY reach out and smack the shit out of this guy at the 1:45:00 ish mark, is a fereakin’ miracle, Z.
This is one of your best efforts IMHO. You’re really good on Fridays alone, but with the Q’s and spontaneous quick answers, even better.
Holy crap, lose that whiner!
Luke Ford is an amazing troll, in spite of himself. Through neurotic persistence, he wormed his way in to the J*wish community, although he is a goy. Now, due to his goyish interest in truth, he spends his time discussing J@wish subversion. But they can’t easily throw him out, because it would lay bare the ethnic nature of the religion.
Luke is a nice guy but broken. He has given enough insight into his past that explains himself. This Jewish conversion is hopefully a stepping stone to something more fulfilling.
On another note, Jim Goad’s interview of Mike Enoch is on Jim’s Group Hug page.
Ecce homo. Emphasis on homo.
“where the boomers inherited a world of order and then set about destroying it, replacing it with a world of disorder and irrationality, without ever explaining why they did it.”
Except that the baby boomers did not inherit a world of order. We inherited relatively stable families, true. But we also inherited a Jewish controlled media hellbent on spreading cultural Marxism, a perpetual war machine/industrial complex, a Deep State, the sexual revolution with playboy and the pill, feminism and the immigration act of 1965.
The first boomer mass vote was when the voting age dropped to 18 and Nixon, not McGovern, won that vote. While the hippies got all the press, most boomers were relatively conservative.
The reason that boomers didn’t stop this onslaught of culture wars was because:
+most Americans have never been very political. They have always wanted to just be left alone to do their thing. That then, as now, doesn’t make them prepared to diligently fight a culture war unlike the left, especially Jews, who take it as a reason to live
+ Feminism started almost entirely by Jews
+ A Global elite that ran both parties. We never really had an option of a nationalist and populist, however flawed, before Trump. Buchanan had no chance.
+ Only traditional media. The rise of the internet has enabled other ideas to spread and like minded people to more easily find one another which is why the Jews (ADL and SPLC especially) are cracking down on it. That is why boomers were the core block during Trump and Brexit.
+ Misguided/brainwashed version of patriotism.
Z Man bullied Ecce and I hope Ecce toughens up. When his every sentence contains an apology, he has to become stronger. It goes against my nature to say it, but bullying of the soft is necessary. Our grandfathers knew this.
He claimed Z cut him off before he could answer a single pointed question. Z did cut him off, twice in fact, after only ten minutes of rambling. This fellow thinks he is going to run for some office or another in a popular election and he can’t get to the point before laying siege to Stalingrad. Although it was an annoying experience it was also very useful in undstanding what we should actually be doing and how to go about it.
I did cut him off. I asked a direct question and he wanted to tell me about his emotional journey. Frankly, the guy sounded like a middle aged feminist.
Anyone who keeps trying to talk about their feelings is going to get bullied. I have no patience for that stuff.
What you said to him about Texas political culture squares with things I’ve read from in-the-know people. Another factor: So far, hispanic turnout tends to be low. They may vote 70% Dem, but mostly they don’t vote. I live around a lot of Mexican-Americans myself. Nice people a lot of the time, but they really don’t care that much about politics. This whole “Texas is gonna turn blue!” thing is a big deal for a subset of Alt-Right YouTube personalities.
Do you dispute that Texas will turn blue in the next, say, 10 years?
Sean Trende specializes in political statistics with a rightward lean. This is from a few years ago, but I don’t think he’s changed his mind.
I’m always looking for white pills. We can’t let the leftist narrative of inevitability demoralize us!
The no patience section was the best part of the show. I felt no sympathy for him because this juvenile need to be right blinds him from his faults.
I checked Ecce’s YT channel and dipped into a few bits of vidoes/streams with other people He wasn’t having an especially bad day by his own standards when Z encountered him. Best avoided.
I listen for about 2 hours. The faceless blogger(not Zman) who kept kvetching about “demographic change and WE should do sumthing” caused me to hit the X upper right.
Holy heebie jeebie who’s this guy popping in at 1:04:30???????????
Did we just get a brief glimpse of the Z Man at the very beginning of the YT clip ? Time index 0:01-0:02
Nope. There were four people on the piece, only two were shown.
The person in question was Dennis Dale, a frequent guest of Luke Ford and sometimes blogger of the subject of local poz in Seattle.
Nice work. I enjoy the give and take of your conversations vs. a monologue.
As to the “It’s OK to be white” cards, I suppose what we are going for here is “Its OK to think white” or “Its OK to act white”, because the way we beat the demographic decline is by creating a lot of honorary white people who understand and subscribe to the white way of thinking and living. That is the point that Ecce totally blinded himself to.
The “negative definition” of being a black American is important. Being gay, trans or feminist (especially feminist) is essentially a negative definition. Without the white males to bounce off of, what is feminism?
Hey Z – I’ve followed you enough to know you’re one uncannily smart dude… don’t have 2.5 hr to listen to all of this now but will check it out… I’ll say, though, when you’re speaking and the “Z” appears on the screen it’s a little like watching a segment of an original Star Trek like when they’ve beamed down to a planet the local authorities are issuing a public message… Hehe – Ahhh… it’s also not entirely unlike The Twilight Zone ep “Black Leather Jackets”
Not meant to be a negative comment. Written in the spirit of humor. Z is a tremendous thinker and content producer and I simply wonder if anything might be more visually appealing for the listener (new listener?) while he speaks. Maybe the signature painting from the website?
I don’t have any control over the image. I think it comes from the Google profile. I should probably put a picture of Kevin Williamson on my profile, just for laughs.
Oh, please do.
Should be good. If you haven’t been contacted already, consider a chat with Doooovid on his channel. He is the yin to Luke Ford’s yang.
Serendipity when I was out for a walk and got Luke’s notification. Will watch later, hope Kevin Michael Grace shows up, a definite match for you Z. Luke’s livestreams are getting better all the time.
I watched a bit of it. If Luke Ford is the English fellow, I wasn’t impressed. He appeared to be bored and disinterested in what Z had to say. His bouncing around, glancing at the ceiling, turning around, drinking, etc. were disrespectful to his guests.
Luke Ford doesn’t sound English. I understand he grew up in Australia.
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