Andrew Tate

Note: Behind the green door is a post about Ukraine, a post about Covid and the Sunday podcast. You can sign up at SubscribeStar or Substack.


Andrew Tate is a former professional kickboxer who transformed himself into an internet personality by mixing ghetto culture with manosphere memes. He offered courses to young males in the art of being a pickup artist. He gained widespread attention after his banning from social media platforms. He is currently in a Romanian prison awaiting trial for a number of sex crimes. Despite his predicament, he remains boastful about his abilities and what lies ahead for him.

Tate’s penchant for display items and cartoonish misogyny have not only made him famous, but it has also put the spotlight on the internet manosphere. Tate is viewed as the extreme expression of a lifestyle that is free of all cultural coercion. It is not that the pickup artist lives solely to sate his appetites. It is that he rejects all of the conventions of society with regards to how a man should live. By conventions, they always mean the highly feminized rules and the modern West.

It is more than a bit ironic that the people who have been gnawing away at conventional sex roles in order to liberate women are now up in arms over men doing the same thing, but for the purpose of liberating men. It also speaks to the feminization of Western societies that the people seeking liberation from cultural norms are young males hoping to prey on women raised on feminism. Women were liberated so that liberated males can treat them like prostitutes.

To further add to the irony, much of the modern left-wing liberation movement is about freeing nonwhites from cultural coercion. You see, according to woke theory, nonwhites can never truly be free until they eradicate white power structures. These are defined as the norms of Western society. Of course, one of those norms used to be how males should behave toward females. It looks like the woke would like to keep some of the old white power structure they claim to oppose.

That gets to the heart of the matter. Andrew Tate is not a man. He is a caricature of what it means to be a man. He is what second wave feminist called a chauvinist, a male who defines himself by minimizing women. Back in the heyday of second wave feminism, such men existed mostly in the agitated imaginations of recently divorced women, but now thanks to the miracle of the internet, they are legion. Feminism literally created what it claimed to oppose.

The reason these internet personalities specializing in the art of exploiting women have grown in number is they appeal to the young male’s natural rebelliousness. Those old white power structures used to have systems for young males to “sow their wild oats” and then settle into the normal routine of being a responsible man. Those have been wrecked by feminism. It turns out that there is little point in being a responsible man when the women are not good at being women.

In fairness, feminism would never have gone anywhere if ruling class males had done their duty and maintained the old ways. The bourgeois society that arose in the 20th century, especially in America, brought bourgeois degeneracy with it. Over the course of the 20th century, America and then the West has come to be defined by the coffee house radical seeking new ways to stand out from tradition and custom. Feminism and the pickup artist are two manifestations of this process.

Interestingly, both Andrew Tate and his woke feminist critics are right. From his perspective, the hedonistic lifestyle built around the exploitation of liberated women is completely rational. If modern society has no rewards for playing the traditional male role, if in fact it punishes those who play that role, then logic says the male should reject that role and seek profit where he can find it. Biologically that means getting as much high status stuff and as many females as possible.

The woke feminists are also correct in pointing out that males living outside the feminist cultural norms are a direct threat to their existence. Modern bourgeois society depends upon males playing the traditional roles in key areas, while the ruling class free rides off of their efforts. It is a parasitic relationship that can only work if the males among the Dirt People play along with it. The lifestyle of Andrew Tate threatens the balance between the host and the parasite.

Of course, no society can survive if the males are like Andrew Tate and the females are like his woke feminist critics. To be a man is to be trusted by other men to keep safe that which is important to men. Andrew Tate cannot be trusted around your women or your belongings, so he is not a man. In a crisis, the first thing that happens is the men in charge kill the guys like Andrew Tate. It is addition by subtraction. Not having to worry about him leaves time for important matters.

Similarly, the woke feminists will disappear in a crisis. In fact, all forms of feminism will disappear as soon as things get serious again. For starters, the men in charge will have no patience for it. Like Andrew Tate, some nag complaining about the unfairness of biology is an unnecessary distraction. The responsible females will quickly move in to put a muzzle on these women. When the crisis comes, look for mobs of middle-aged mothers reviving the ducking stool.

In the end, Andrew Tate and his woke feminist antagonists are both products of the carny morality that springs from bourgeois society. Free to indulge in their worst instincts, a bourgeois ruling class will do their worst and then seek to normalize it among the people over whom the rule. Like the people who live the life of excess, a society ruled this way ends in physical and mental despair. Like the man of excess, a society of excess eventually needs an intervention.


If you like my work and wish to kick in a few bucks, you can buy me a beer. You can sign up for a SubscribeStar subscription and get some extra content. You can donate via PayPal. My crypto addresses are here for those who prefer that option. You can send gold bars to: Z Media LLC P.O. Box 432 Cockeysville, MD 21030-0432. Thank you for your support!


Promotions: We have a new addition to the list. Above Time Coffee Roasters are a small, dissident friendly company that makes coffee. They actually roast the beans themselves based on their own secret coffee magic. If you like coffee, buy it from these folks as they are great people who deserve your support.

Havamal Soap Works is the maker of natural, handmade soap and bath products. If you are looking to reduce the volume of man-made chemicals in your life, all-natural personal products are a good start. If you use this link you get 15% off of your purchase.

Minter & Richter Designs makes high-quality, hand-made by one guy in Boston, titanium wedding rings for men and women and they are now offering readers a fifteen percent discount on purchases if you use this link. If you are headed to Boston, they are also offering my readers 20% off their 5-star rated Airbnb.  Just email them directly to book at sa***@mi*********************.com.


201 Comments
Most Voted
Newest Oldest
Inline Feedbacks
View all comments
Anti-Gnostic
Anti-Gnostic
2 years ago

Roissy/Heartiste was the one and only, and always more reflective about it than the book-sellers. Then, of course, he turned 40, grew up and moved on. And that whole genre moved on with him; it was a specific time and place and won’t be replicated.

mmack
mmack
2 years ago

Hey Z Man,

Before you upload your next post and close this one, here’s a link for you. Don’t worry, the Brits have a plan for handling Andrew Tate:

https://nypost.com/2023/01/07/uk-schools-re-educating-teens-brainwashed-by-andrew-tate-report/

“Teachers in the United Kingdom are creating lesson plans to re-educate teenage students who have been brainwashed by misogynistic influencer Andrew Tate, according to a report.”

Humdeedee
Humdeedee
2 years ago

One of your best, Z-Man.

miforest
Member
2 years ago

Oh ;look! its an intervention ofr the whole world! https://rumble.com/v14382h-the-great-reset-explained-in-their-own-words-gates-musk-harari-schwab-and-g.html soon and very soon there will be a lot less of us to play any sex role , old or new.

Pozymandias
2 years ago

“Women were liberated so that liberated males can treat them like prostitutes.” Sounds about right. Seriously though, the basic tension in modern society and the reason it seems to be getting less stable is probably just derived from the fact that you’ve got all these people whose natural roles have become impossible or irrelevant. Most women would do best in the same roles they always had, as wives and mothers. The modern ruling class felt that there “wasn’t a need for that job description” as much and set about trying to contrive all these new places to put them. They… Read more »

Jack Dobson
Jack Dobson
Reply to  Pozymandias
2 years ago

It may be a way to get out of not charging Trump because “both sides do it.” Of course, there will be no trashy Gestapo-style raid of Biden’s home in Delaware whatever happens. We can say for certain the Junta will not charge a fellow gangster with anything.

Bartleby the Scrivner
Bartleby the Scrivner
2 years ago

This just in

Apparently President Poopy 💩 Pants is supposedly being investigated by the DOJ regarding classified document handling.

Is this how the deep state gets rid of the Potato in Chief?!

ProZNoV
ProZNoV
Reply to  Bartleby the Scrivner
2 years ago

Zman has it right.

Biden will be the first President re elected with over 100 million votes.

Between “fortification” and the Republican amnesty, it’s uniparty forever.

Steve
Steve
Reply to  Bartleby the Scrivner
2 years ago

Expect a dawn raid on his house by SWAT storm troopers. Oh, I forget. He’s a democrat.

B125
B125
2 years ago

I really dont know what to think about Tate. At first glance hes just another coloured hustler angling for some white p*ssy by any means necessary (thats 100% of them). Hes also a muslim which makes him more sketchy or perhaps even saudi funded. He came out of nowhere. However he has said some very good things about women and unplugging from the matrix in general. Once somebody starts thinking too much in one area, it spreads to others. Almost every man on the Dissident Right is well versed in manosphere and PUA. Personally its helped me alot, although its… Read more »

Wolfhouse
Wolfhouse
Reply to  B125
2 years ago

Tate is a con man, but he is right about women. However, those Maxim teachings were all laid out from, Chateau Heartiste, (back in 2014 or even earlier for free) Of course the wordpress got shut down due to some feminazis. The comment section on CH did go down the gem rabbit hole too much so, yet again the special people were involved. Anyway, the dissident right should have an arsenal of PUA knowledge, and use for dealing with everday beta males and women. Christianity is dead, the old ‘noble’ man traditionnis are dead because clown world has killed a… Read more »

Kevin
Kevin
2 years ago

Gen Y men turned to the manosphere not to get laid, or to become ideologues. If you came into the scene early, it was filled with mostly latch-key kids and divorced dads looking for answers. They wanted to know they were hated so much, despite doing what society told them to do. After learning many bitter and salty truths, most left the manosphere. They left because they realized nothing would be changing anytime soon. The divorce/family courts are as corrupt as ever, but still men are blamed for not wanting to get destroyed by them. Women spend their youth sleeping… Read more »

Bourbon
Bourbon
Reply to  Kevin
2 years ago

Kevin: “After learning many bitter and salty truths, most left the manosphere. They left because they realized nothing would be changing anytime soon.” As the Playaz say, you can know women, or you can love women, but not both. PRO-TIP: Move immediately to get her pregnant, and then keep her pregnant & pushing out babies until menopause. Making a family is nothing but glorified animal husbandry, and a chad looks at a woman in the same way that a farmer looks at a tractor. She has one job, and one job only, and that job is to push out your… Read more »

Jay Fink
Jay Fink
2 years ago

Just wanted to say this was by far the best take on Andrew Tate that I have seen.

Bourbon
Bourbon
Reply to  Jay Fink
2 years ago

Z: “In a crisis, the first thing that happens is the men in charge kill the guys like Andrew Tate. It is addition by subtraction. Not having to worry about him leaves time for important matters.” I’m a little surprised that Z posted something quite as honest and forthright as what he just wrote there. Maybe I better leave it at that; further discussion of the phenomenon would quickly devolve into Fed Poasting. However, on the question of addition & subtraction, for quite a while now, PA, at “PA World and Times”, has posited a dichotomy of “Additive Game” versus… Read more »

Whiskey
Whiskey
2 years ago

In related news, the pr0n star “legend” Ron Jeremy has been found unfit to stand trial for multiple sexual assaults on various women due to advanced dementia. If you have a strong stomach you can see the story on Yahoo, “the wages of sin are death” is pretty well spelled out with “the legend.” That being said, I do think there is something to the hate hate hate most White women have for most White men. If you accept Steven Pinker’s assertion of massive selection away from Alpha male outlaws to obedient beta males by every Lord, Count, Duke, Prince-Bishop,… Read more »

David Wright
Member
Reply to  Whiskey
2 years ago

No offense Whiskey but why does everything cultural and natural sound like a convoluted science project with guys like you.

Glenfilthie
Glenfilthie
Member
Reply to  David Wright
2 years ago

Indeed. I am reminded of Jim over at Jim’s Blog. He too is a comedian of sorts as are his fanboys. They talk of women as being little more than predictable instinctual, hormonal animals…and who knows? With the trailer park queens that may or may not be true. Jim and is fans are, of course, intellectual alphas on the internet but in real life? Most likely cellar dwelling soys and incels… I believe our host got it exactly right when he says these people will need to be killed by the tens of thousands in the post prosperity era. Just… Read more »

Hemid
Hemid
Reply to  Glenfilthie
2 years ago

Whiskey and Jim aren’t much alike, but they do both proceed from an understanding that what matters most right now is who hates you.

Girls in the trailer park are accustomed to being stuck living among their enemies, so they understand this too.

Chimeral
Chimeral
Reply to  Hemid
2 years ago

Uh, yeah, some chosenite sasquatch defiles shiksas, that’s entertainment!

Somewhere they were laughing at you goy for paying to see that.

TripleV
TripleV
Reply to  Glenfilthie
2 years ago

And even worst comrades in arms.

Christard Hater
Christard Hater
Reply to  Whiskey
2 years ago

“the wages of sin are death”

Everyone dies you dumb Christard. What about the boy who dies at age 7 from leukemia? Did he commit worse sins than Ron Jeremy?

That is what your retard logic would imply.

Now screw off with your retard fairy tales.

Compsci
Compsci
Reply to  Christard Hater
2 years ago

Come now, you really don’t think that adage compares in the two examples you cite do you? Jeremy’s *sins* (bad actions according to standard Christian believe) is causing a premature, and painful death in the one. In the other an unfortunate young boy’s life is cut short—but not necessarily stemming from his own sinful nature—but by a terrible disease, which certainly was in no way his own doing.

Now, of course, the above can lead to adiscussion of why “bad things happen to good people”. But that’s another issue with other aspects of God and his relationship to the world.

Chimeral
Chimeral
Reply to  Compsci
2 years ago

Haha, now you’re on a first name basis with “Jeremy”?

Chosenite sasquatch defiles shiksas, best to refer to it as “it”.

Fakeemail
Fakeemail
Reply to  Whiskey
2 years ago

It’s white women in particular who are very difficult to handle for betas. Asian, latina, and even black women are MUCH more amenable and approachable to beta white dudes.

Jeffrey Zoar
Jeffrey Zoar
Reply to  Whiskey
2 years ago

Did this illiterate, non media fed medieval woman even know that she was supposed to be aroused? With most of the men being landless serfs, how often did she encounter an “alpha”?

Millions of decent people suffer from dementia every day. Or were they not really decent, and are all being punished for sin?

P.S. Women’s “fury” tends to be about loss of or lack of status. Lack of arousal merely produces scorn.

Getreal
Getreal
Reply to  Jeffrey Zoar
2 years ago

“….medieval woman even know that she was supposed to be aroused?”

Yeah, ‘aroused’ by a man that could put some meat in the pot, aka beta provider game for the PUA crowd.

Bourbon
Bourbon
Reply to  Whiskey
2 years ago

Whiskey: “the wages of sin are death”

Somebody got taken out back, behind the woodshed, and ordered to bone up on the New Testament.

Fascinating that it’s Saul of Tarsus.

Still waiting for juicy gossip on the Barnea/Cohen catfight.

Whitney
Member
2 years ago

“When the crisis comes, look for mobs of middle-aged mothers reviving the ducking stool.”

No children but I would make addition to this mob.

Ploppy
Ploppy
2 years ago

The thing to remember about the manosphere is that it exists as almost a perfect mirror image of feminism, which is why each movement hates the other one with such passion. The feminist strong woman is a ridiculous phony self-presentation compared to a traditionally strong woman, just as an Andrew Tate is an insecure little boy hiding it with his clown version of a strong man. Both movements do their utmost to demoralize the youth from doing anything that would lead to a family and long term happiness, mainly via angry divorcees who want everyone else in the world to… Read more »

Jeffrey Zoar
Jeffrey Zoar
Reply to  Ploppy
2 years ago

Feminism came onto the scene a long time before the manosphere stuff did. Traditional masculinity was already out of favor before the manosphere became influential. Which is why it did. If traditional masculinity was something that produced good outcomes for men, they never would have looked to the manosphere.

Ploppy
Ploppy
Reply to  Jeffrey Zoar
2 years ago

Yeah but it’s the same problem as “Actually black people are the real racists”. Trying to copy the enemy doesn’t always work.

Jeffrey Zoar
Jeffrey Zoar
Reply to  Ploppy
2 years ago

I’ve never seen the “philosophies” associated with the “manosphere” advocate anything that “works” or pretend that anything can work. More like they accept the fact that things don’t work, that there’s nothing you can do about that, and proceeding from that axiom tries to help you navigate clown world. The manosphere (what of it that I’ve seen anyway) is about saving yourself, not about saving the world.

Ubiquity
Ubiquity
Reply to  Jeffrey Zoar
2 years ago

Feminism promises the world for women if they ignore how the world works.

The manosphere explains how the world works and the costs of ignoring it for the average man.

These two projects are quite different ,Mr Ploppy.

Stephen Dowling Bots, Dec'd
Stephen Dowling Bots, Dec'd
Reply to  Ploppy
2 years ago

“The thing to remember about the manosphere is that it exists as almost a perfect mirror image of feminism”

This may be the *******, most ******** and **** — ******* comment I have ever read on this site. I strenuously disagree, and submit that it calls into question the judgment of the person who posted it in toto.

Stranger in a Strange Land
Stranger in a Strange Land
2 years ago

Not a movie buff per se, but circa 2000 movie – Magnolia – has a character named TJ Mackey played by Tom Cruise. This Tate character seems to be something of the real life version of that character. Long movie, but quirky enough (especially the weather scene towards the end) to hold one’s interest.

Bartleby the Scrivner
Bartleby the Scrivner
Reply to  Stranger in a Strange Land
2 years ago

Saying “Magnolia” is quirky, is like saying Mars has a harsh environment.

It is an interesting ride. When you think about it, it’s rather dark.

Stranger in a Strange Land
Stranger in a Strange Land
Reply to  Bartleby the Scrivner
2 years ago

Quirky – till the frog storm – then it was weird.

fakeemail
fakeemail
2 years ago

Pick-up artists/game CREATED the alt-right. Without the manosphere, there is no dissident right, there is no waking up, there is no Trump 2016. There is no Z-Man without Mystery, Style, and Roissy. Seeing the matrix on women/feminism inevitably lead to seeing the Matrix on EVERYTHING. For men of a certain age, the early/mid 2000s was an ENLIGHTENMENT. So many clueless “nice guy” young men spent their lives as incels placing women on pedestal and expecting to be paired off with a nice girl for marriage by a society that no longer existed. They raged not understanding why women would slut… Read more »

Marko
Marko
Reply to  thezman
2 years ago

$1000 to anyone who can locate Z’s PUA Geocities site from 1998

Ploppy
Ploppy
Reply to  Marko
2 years ago

Zman, in his folksy avuncular voice, casually describing how to neg an hb10 for a ons…

mmack
mmack
Reply to  Ploppy
2 years ago
mmack
mmack
Reply to  thezman
2 years ago

I had to go to the Internet Wayback Z, but I think 🤔 I found it:

comment image

fakeemail
fakeemail
Reply to  thezman
2 years ago

What I mean is that a lot of people wouldn’t have found you (or Dalrock or Porter Kakistocracy or Spandrell, or Roosh, etc) without Strauss’ “The Game” and Chauteu Heartiste.

usNthem
usNthem
Reply to  fakeemail
2 years ago

I don’t even remember how I stumbled onto Chateau Heartiste, or even Z’s site – maybe links to each other on their pages. I still follow CH (now king of all nads) on Gab. He’s a good spokesman and observer for the DR for sure and still sprinkles in words of wisdom on the female psyche here and there. He’s definitely a plus to have on our side.

Tars Tarkas
Tars Tarkas
Reply to  usNthem
2 years ago

I was turned on to both Heartiste and Z on Vox Populi, VD’s blog. Z has been a daily read for me. Great comment section too.

Tired Citizen
Tired Citizen
Reply to  fakeemail
2 years ago

I found Z because I was in a chat group with a guy named Noah Palmer. He wrote the book, “Why sane people do crazy things”. He would post Z’s stuff in the chat. I read the first one I saw he posted and realized that these are my people. This guy writes very intelligently and articulately my thoughts on most things far better than I could describe them to someone. Also, once you experience the comment section here, you can’t go back to any other comment section. Even the AmRen comment section isn’t what this place is. I am… Read more »

Compsci
Compsci
Reply to  Tired Citizen
2 years ago

This is very true. The comment section here has become addicting—perhaps too addicting. Surely there is something better I should do with my time, but I’ve not found it. 😉

imnobody00
imnobody00
Reply to  fakeemail
2 years ago

Many years ago, I visited the Wikipedia page for Bachelor, intrigued by this English term. Somebody had left a link to the Eternal Bachelor blog, which was the prehistory of the manosphere, way before Flossy. From blog to blog, I ended up being a regular visitor of the manosphere. Some years later, Ferdinand Bardamu ran a blog (In Mala Fide) with a periodical list of links to manosphere posts. He mixed everything: manosphere, alt-right, neoreaction… These communities ended up becoming a single community. Roissy mixed PUA and alt-right stuff. Most of these people have moved on from the manosphere topics… Read more »

imnobody00
imnobody00
Reply to  imnobody00
2 years ago

Roissy, not Flossy. Damned autocorrect

LineInTheSand
LineInTheSand
Reply to  thezman
2 years ago

Why is it nonsense on stilts that it took a decade or two for the methodology of the PUAs to spread? That methodology is to observe the behavior of the objects and not be distracted or confused by what the objects say. I strongly dislike most PUAs and I’m annoyed by the fact that a lot of dissident politics, even the tired term “red pill,” came from their methodology. Roissey’s header was, “Where pretty lies die.” This methodology and attitude would spread to politics and soon we were angrily mocking civic nationalism. The king of that world right now is… Read more »

Ploppy
Ploppy
Reply to  LineInTheSand
2 years ago

The problem is that the PUA stuff never directed the men to channel that into settling down with a family. Precisely the opposite as they incessantly railed about how every single woman is going to use a divorce lawyer to steal all your money at the first opportunity. If all these guys had actually gotten married and had kids, the dissident movement would be in a much stronger position now.

Jeffrey Zoar
Jeffrey Zoar
Reply to  Ploppy
2 years ago

Isn’t PUA based on the idea that your odds of being successful at settling down and raising a family are small? That the deck is stacked against you from the outset.

However much that was true when PUA started, it’s certainly more true now

Compsci
Compsci
Reply to  Ploppy
2 years ago

As to the odds of finding the “right girl” to marry and settle down with, I can’t say. You really only get one chance here, right? Afterwards you have been burned and as they say, “twice shy”. I avoided the first misstep and it’s now been 45 years on. I will say however, that the manosphere “advice” I read seems to tend on the side of not making good choices in ones relationship to the other sex. Maybe a little bit less on how to pick up women in clubs or off of Tinder and some more emphasis on finding… Read more »

Felix Krull
Member
Reply to  Ploppy
2 years ago

Always get to know the mother before you do anything drastic. Blood will through, and in 25 years, your fiancee is going to be just like her mother.

Never marry the daughter if you don’t love the mother.

c matt
c matt
Reply to  LineInTheSand
2 years ago

That observational strategy has been around since at least 30 AD “by their fruits you shall know them.”

LineInTheSand
LineInTheSand
Reply to  c matt
2 years ago

They didn’t invent the strategy. They applied it with a vengeance at a time when everyone else had forgotten it, including the people who would be inclined to quote the verse that you cited.

Felix Krull
Member
Reply to  c matt
2 years ago

The King of Kings had a prostitute literally washing his feet, drying them off with her hair.

Tate roll over!

Compsci
Compsci
Reply to  c matt
2 years ago

Felix, the story you cite is one of redemption and forgiveness. It is one of the more powerful ones in the New Testament. Really has little to do with women and prostitution. The “King of Kings” here was teaching through example what was to become the defining aspect of Christianity.

I suspect you know this and are just tweaking our nose a bit. 😉

Felix Krull
Member
Reply to  c matt
2 years ago

Yeah, well, “by their fruit shall thee know them” is not about game either, is it?

Milestone D
Milestone D
Reply to  thezman
2 years ago

My path to the DR started exactly as described here – trying to understand why I found myself divorced at 35 while society celebrated the woman who left me while I was in Iraq. I first started questioning what I had been told about dating/women/etc and that led me to start questioning many other assumptions, including politics. So while the “without CH there’d be no DR” might be hyperbole, it’s sentiment is closer to right than wrong. But … the PUA stuff us an empty vessel. It sure works, and it is a great example of people responding to incentives,… Read more »

RealityRules
RealityRules
Reply to  fakeemail
2 years ago

Men don’t sit around and blame people. They are willing to be alone in the woods for as long as it takes if that is what it takes until time and conditions are right to restore order. Tate is another manifestation of the depraved and degenerate hip-hop culture. Kickboxing replaced pant hooting over digital samples. A porn cam replaced a glock. It is the same thing. Tate is mild and he was raised middle class by a white woman. Still, he can’t comport himself. Nature is nature. There is another reason why Tate and his ilk will be dealt with… Read more »

Wolf Barney
Wolf Barney
Reply to  fakeemail
2 years ago

QUOTE: “Pick-up artists/game CREATED the alt-right. Without the manosphere, there is no dissident right, there is no waking up, there is no Trump 2016. There is no Z-Man without Mystery, Style, and Roissy.” That’s a pretty big statement. While the pickup guys had a big role in the understanding of biological wiring, there were plenty of elements outside of that scene that went into the alt-right movement. The alt-right was more about things like mass immigration, moving factories and jobs overseas, stupid foreign wars, along with who has been behind those policies, than it was about looking under the hood… Read more »

karl von hungus
karl von hungus
Reply to  fakeemail
2 years ago

no. you are conflating completely separate phenomena, because they both involve “discovery”. there is some overlap between the two groups, sure, but that’s as far as it goes. the PUA drifted over to politics because it was losing audience. and the manosphere seems to be about avoiding women altogether!

Apex Predator
Apex Predator
Reply to  fakeemail
2 years ago

Quoting the original Z-Man article above: “The woke feminists are also correct in pointing out that males living outside the feminist cultural norms are a direct threat to their existence. Modern bourgeois society depends upon males playing the traditional roles in key areas, while the ruling class free rides off of their efforts. It is a parasitic relationship that can only work if the males among the Dirt People play along with it.” Said another way, and quoting a Great Prophet: Alpha Fux, Beta Bux! (ZLZLOLZZOOLLZ, Da Great Books For Great Men (GBFM), PBUH) I toplined this reply because as… Read more »

Bourbon
Bourbon
Reply to  Apex Predator
2 years ago

Peace Be Upon The Great Books For Men. =============== CH had a Gab yesterday with which I strongly agreed: https://gab.com/kingofallnads/posts/109657453189086140 CH: ‘I think a lot of White men were caught off-guard by the rabid disloyalty and apparatchik viciousness of White women, and by how quickly White women have changed from “normal” to “raging psychocunt for the Regime”. Sure, discernment in everything, and many White men deserve blame for allowing their thirst, apathy, and supplicating cowardice to blind them to the red flags of Globohomo-captured White women, but tbf to the men the betrayals of the women were neither expected nor… Read more »

Big Dissident
Big Dissident
Reply to  fakeemail
2 years ago

I agree that many in the manosphere eventually funneled over to the dissident right when they realized hooking up with random women is boring and unfulfilling. Until Andrew Tate became a thing, most of the manosphere scene was Arab or Indian (for not feather) looking to score with white girls. I think Tate’s appeal was that he was the PUA closest to ever walk the talk. Most PUA gurus look and act like the guys who got stuffed into lockers in school. Tate was different. I’m not defending him as I’ve long since disregarded the scene but compare him to… Read more »

Jack Dobson
Jack Dobson
Reply to  fakeemail
2 years ago

“Without the manosphere, there is no dissident right, there is no waking up, there is no Trump 2016. There is no Z-Man without Mystery, Style, and Roissy.” Not to play semantics games, but the dissident right has been a thing since at least an opposition of sorts formed against the New Deal and the Second World War, which predate no-fault divorce by about two generations. You may be correct if you are using “dissident right” interchangeably with “alt-right,” although the latter is sort of a modern variation that had some overlap with the former and piggybacked off it. Zman and… Read more »

bob_oso
bob_oso
Reply to  fakeemail
2 years ago

What is happening here is that the PUAs and dissident-right both share the same reality.

They’re not wrong in their observations, and they exist in actual reality. The problem is that many of them are a bunch of total degenerates. They’re not serious people.

Tars Tarkas
Tars Tarkas
2 years ago

All of the weirdness, man hating and sexual degeneracy we generally associate with “2nd Wave Feminism” were present in the suffragettes and even before. Feminism has always been cancer.

There is a woman called Janice Fiamengo who has a youtube channel with a man named Steve Brule’ who does short videos highlighting many of these problems. Well worth checking out.

Andrew Tate is indeed a clown. He’s also a mulatto.

karl von hungus
karl von hungus
Reply to  Tars Tarkas
2 years ago
Tars Tarkas
Tars Tarkas
Reply to  karl von hungus
2 years ago

The channel is called studio B. Here is a video on anti-whiteness by Janice.

/watch?v=dm7lvNRlQHQ

David Wright
Member
Reply to  Tars Tarkas
2 years ago

The mulatto distinction seems to go unnoticed a lot. The man’s visage really has strong pimp vibes.

Cruciform
Cruciform
Reply to  David Wright
2 years ago

Seriously, no one needs to ‘teach’ dusky folk like this Tate how to ‘treat women like prostitutes…’ Go back to Margaret Mead, and a certain interaction males and females allegedly had in the bushes by the side of the path. Any males and any females. Any time. Say, like we shake hands. I am suspicious of the ‘man-o’ types that go hard at never marrying or having children. They seem to be bookends to the Feminists — in terms of serving a depopulation, anti-Christian agenda. Like pornography, made flesh. Who cares what their rationales are. One Man-o guy pitches replacing… Read more »

Felix Krull
Member
Reply to  Cruciform
2 years ago

Seriously, no one needs to ‘teach’ dusky folk like this Tate how to ‘treat women like prostitutes…’ We have quite a pimp problem in our own ranks. A recurring gripe is dusky girls winning beauty pageants in white countries, and “oh, noes, they’re replacing white wommens.” If you are pro-beauty pageants, you’re part of the problem: beauty pageantry is prostitution, ersatz slave auctions where fat Jews can gloat over white sluts dancing naked for the price of a cheeseburger. Public decency laws need to be rolled back to before cheesecake: no shoulders, no knees, no cleavage or you’re a Commie… Read more »

Compsci
Compsci
Reply to  Felix Krull
2 years ago

Yeah, I suspect we’ve taken individual liberty and freedom waaay too far in this society. We have taking such so far, we (and the West in general) are now a freak show. Another Z-man recurring theme.

Pozymandias
Reply to  Cruciform
2 years ago

I upvoted you for your point but also “Maple Syrup Lockdownville” (Canada I presume).

Stranger in a Strange Land
Stranger in a Strange Land
2 years ago

Seems to asking the age old question: what do women want?
When they figure it out, are able to articulate it, and then actually live according to what they say – then let me know.

Disruptor
Disruptor
Reply to  Stranger in a Strange Land
2 years ago

Start with an alpha man who is aloof and untamed, a wild stallion roaming the plains.

The woman loves using her love and feminine charm to tame said man, IE the taming in and of itself.

Once tamed, his value is lessened.

Felix Krull
Member
Reply to  Disruptor
2 years ago

Antoine de Saint-Exupery likened a man to a cliff and a woman to a wave. The wave throws itself at the cliff, frothing and booming, beckoning “Come down to me! Be with me”

As long as the cliff remains, the wave will never stop frothing and beckoning, but gradually, the cliff is undermined by the wave and falls into the sea.

Now the wave has nothing to break against, no froth nor boom. and it will go in search of another cliff.

Mike
Mike
Reply to  Felix Krull
2 years ago

Saint-Ex reference for the win, he’s pretty much forgotten now but he had a remarkable life.

fakeemail
fakeemail
Reply to  Stranger in a Strange Land
2 years ago

“what do women want?”

They want to be dominated.

Eloi
Eloi
Reply to  Stranger in a Strange Land
2 years ago

“Real” women want a man who handles his business like a man. He stays busy, maintains the technical aspects of the home, keeps in shape due to this activity, gives her a good seeing-to at least two times a week, and acts like a man.

Walt
Member
Reply to  Eloi
2 years ago

She especially wants that man if he is with another woman who is better looking and smarter than her.

Steve
Steve
Reply to  Eloi
2 years ago

Two times a week? Jeez, I’ll have to up my game.

Steve
Steve
Reply to  Stranger in a Strange Land
2 years ago

Never try to understand women. Women understand women and they hate each other.

Range Front Fault
Range Front Fault
Reply to  Steve
2 years ago

No. Women don’t Trust each other. Hate is secondary. Women stab each other in the back, heavy intra-female competition (does that mean for fat women?), play head games and use shame to make women submit to their herd. Man, did I burn out on that. That’s why I dropped working with or for other women. Moved to working in technical fields (water treatment/distribution) with mostly men, grew up and enjoyed the men and learned so much from generous, knowledgeable men. Some women truly like men. Few.

karl von hungus
karl von hungus
Reply to  Steve
2 years ago

the only way to win, is not to play.

mmack
mmack
Reply to  Stranger in a Strange Land
2 years ago

“Seems to asking the age old question: what do women want?” From observations, I’d posit three things: 1) Social Dominance, especially of other women 2) Attention. Good (from the “right” people) preferred, other types will be taken 3) Plausible Deniability They all work in concert. Every gal wants to be the Queen Bee, or at least higher up the social hierarchy than she is. If she can snag a man of higher status or stature than herself and her peers husbands or boyfriends, that’d work too. If she gets more attention (especially from guys she WANTS attention from) that can… Read more »

Paintersforms
Paintersforms
2 years ago

I’m reminded of something a friend once told me. He said the black thug is a product of the black single mom— a feminine caricature of masculinity. Basically an Amazon. Re: Tate, whites becoming blacks. Don’t get me wrong, I have a reputation as a woman-hater, but the PUA thing has never appealed to me. As for the reputation, I maintain that there has to be a reaction. You can’t reason with a harpy any more than you can with a bully. Thankfully, you don’t have to hit women. Being an ‘asshole’ and not backing away is good enough in… Read more »

David Wright
Member
Reply to  Paintersforms
2 years ago

It has long been stated that American black men are feminine in nature. Mother centered and vain. Add to that the intellectual maturity of a fourteen year old.

Eloi
Eloi
Reply to  Paintersforms
2 years ago

“You don’t have to hit women”
Sean Connery would disagree. Please, if you never have seen it, check out “Sean Connery and Barbara Walters.” She didn’t see that answer coming!

fakeemail
fakeemail
Reply to  Eloi
2 years ago

Connery was right. Sometimes women get so hysterical even letting them have the last word is not enough for them. That’s when it’s proper for the SLAP. Rational patriarchy asserting itself through the truth of superior force. Good for the man, good for the woman.

The Wild Geese Howard
The Wild Geese Howard
Reply to  fakeemail
2 years ago

This is why I always say, search, “Victorian-era cures for female hysteria.”

They knew the score back then.

Paintersforms
Paintersforms
Reply to  Eloi
2 years ago

I’ve never had to, wouldn’t ever want to, but once or twice I had to break something to snap her out of it.

Felix Krull
Member
2 years ago

Tate’s penchant for display items and cartoonish misogyny have not only made him famous, but it has also put the spotlight on the internet manosphere.

It probably didn’t hurt him that Tucker Carlson had him on his show, billing him a manosphere icon. Nothing spells edgy dissident as being invited onto Fox.

Evil Sandmich
Evil Sandmich
Reply to  Felix Krull
2 years ago

I’d read his posts on Gab and was later shocked that he actually existed as his posts were so cartoonish that I thought it was some humorous clown’s idea of a fun LARP (not quite as funny when it’s real).

Captain Willard
Captain Willard
2 years ago

Well, there’s a good reason that the Marquis de Sade features so prominently in Camus’ classic “The Rebel”. Tate is really the archetype for the modern male rebel. However, the next stop on that train is Nihilism, as Camus observed so well.

The sex part is just a feature of the Nihilism and is of course an essentially self-destructive impulse. He mocks Creation while making a mockery of procreation. It’s just sad. Destroying yourself is a weird way to demonstrate the absurdity of feminism.

Wkathman
Wkathman
2 years ago

We’re all supposed to embrace boundless hedonism, until some schoolmarmish woman objects — at which point it is demanded we veer into abject Victorianism. Quite a schizophrenic culture. As Zman suggests in different words, both feminism and pick-up artistry are luxury items of a society that has grown exceedingly fat and decadent. In a survival scenario, the Andrew Tates will be run out of the community on a rail and the feminists will soon learn to keep their mouths shut. One thing prosperity buys us is a lot of gratuitous absurdity that we could not afford under less favorable conditions.… Read more »

ornery cuss
ornery cuss
Reply to  Wkathman
2 years ago

Amen and Amen-I have noticed in almost every instance of dire emergency, we revert to our traditional roles, men go out to confront and rescue, women huddle together and comfort.

Steve
Steve
Reply to  ornery cuss
2 years ago

Exactly. It’s no coincidence that the militaries of the West are at their lowest ebb at a time when women are filling their ranks. Every image I see online about British infantry has a woman in the foreground. As if a woman can hump 100 pounds on her back and lead men into combat.

3g4me
3g4me
Reply to  Wkathman
2 years ago

Wkathman: Excellent summation. No excuses for something like Andrew Tate, but just as with the “Me too” movement, the women ‘victims’ deserve just as much scorn, if not more so. Passage from a book I was just reading – written by a woman – about modern women as viewed by a hedonistic pick-up artist man (From the Green Fields super-soldier serum turned zombie world series by Adrianne Lecter): “I don’t hate women. Actually, I’m a huge admirer of the female form. I’m also not as much of a misogynist asshole as I love to pretend to be, no thanks to… Read more »

Jack Dobson
Jack Dobson
Reply to  Wkathman
2 years ago

“We’re all supposed to embrace boundless hedonism, until some schoolmarmish woman objects — at which point it is demanded we veer into abject Victorianism. Quite a schizophrenic culture.”

Great comment. That description encapsulates women, feminist and otherwise, quite well. A feminist culture by its very nature is a schizophrenic culture.

mmack
mmack
Reply to  Wkathman
2 years ago

“We’re all supposed to embrace boundless hedonism, until some schoolmarmish woman objects — at which point it is demanded we veer into abject Victorianism. Quite a schizophrenic culture.”

Great observation, yet note which sex takes the approach “I have a problem with something therefore nobody can have it/do it”.

See alcohol, tobacco, guns, now internal combustion engines, COVID masking, etc.

Wkathman
Wkathman
Reply to  mmack
2 years ago

mmack: No doubt that women make up a significant majority of those who thrive on killing other people’s fun. Still, don’t shortchange all the hyper-feminized men of today who demonstrate the same party-pooper tendencies. Masculinity is in woefully short supply these days.

Xman
Xman
Reply to  Wkathman
2 years ago

“We’re all supposed to embrace boundless hedonism, until some schoolmarmish woman objects”

Yeah, funny how the official doctrine of our society is that everybody is supposed to be able to fuck everyone else all the time without consequence or responsibility… but if you actually try to do it, you get accused of sexual harassment.

Jeffrey Zoar
Jeffrey Zoar
Reply to  Xman
2 years ago

The main difference between harassment and flirting is whether or not she finds you attractive

Mr. House
Mr. House
Reply to  Wkathman
2 years ago

“gratuitous absurdity”

Ah yes, i’d like to return this to the kitchen, its not what i ordered. Also i don’t want “store credit” i want my cash back 😉

TomA
TomA
2 years ago

The wars of the 19th and 20th Centuries resulted in the mass slaughter of alpha males all across Europe, and this fundamentally altered the natural evolution of our species in this region. Those chickens have now come home to roost and the West is dominated by butch females and a plague of beta males; which is a recipe for disaster. And you cannot vote your way out of this kind of DNA contagion. And this is why colony collapse is the only road to redemption. The process must be reversed and fitness selection must return to the ancestral purpose of… Read more »

RealityRules
RealityRules
Reply to  TomA
2 years ago

What happens when the Tates and worse are given preference and promotion in the military, and at the same time the better men, in this case actual men, are purged?

We are going to find out.

TomA
TomA
Reply to  RealityRules
2 years ago

The Ukrainian military command is sacrificing (genociding) its most societally competent males (husbands and fathers) as cannon fodder in the meatgrinder of the Eastern Front. I think part of the reason they are doing this is because they want them dead rather than return to KIev at the end of the war and get revenge on the assholes that did this.

Good ol' Rebel
Good ol' Rebel
Reply to  TomA
2 years ago

Hmm. At some point, TPTB nees to lose bigger rather than cut losses, just to save their own skin. Interesting principle-agent problem.

Jason Knight
Jason Knight
2 years ago

Andrew Tate is a useful man, not a good man. He should be defended solely on the basis that he pushes young men towards our cause. For instance, there’s a great clip of him urging men to stay away from the military because there’s no point going and risking your life in Iraq if some Iraqi can just migrate over the border and blow himself up in a synagogue.

If he really is a sex trafficker, it’s a good thing the Right isn’t closely associated with him. Fortunately, I don’t think he’s guilty of any crime.

Mike
Mike
Reply to  Jason Knight
2 years ago

Had to downvote you, Tate shouldn’t be defended. He has no redeeming qualities and deserves more punishment than he will ever get on this earth. I refuse to defend a half-jogger who is the very definition of n***** rich. That was one of the two worst insults in the pre-integration South. It’s a shame it has fallen out of favor because it’s so appropriate to modern GAE.

Glenfilthie
Glenfilthie
Member
2 years ago

Spectacular, Z. It nicely bolsters my own contention that if you do something wrongful and harmful to one gender, it inevitably hurts them both. But – we have to remember some things and have some modicum of sympathy for our women. Consider the birth of feminism – it did not occur in a vacuum. (Or maybe it DID, depending on your assessment of bad puns): electricity literally made women obsolete in the 50’s. Their work was done away with in a couple years. Dish washers, electric stoves, vacuum cleaners, refridgerators – in the space of a decade, women went from… Read more »

Chet Rollins
Chet Rollins
Reply to  Glenfilthie
2 years ago

> Their work was done away with in a couple years. Dish washers, electric stoves, vacuum cleaners, refridgerators – in the space of a decade, women went from being overloaded with work to having none at all. The biggest change was children being sent to school for nine months between the ages of 5-18. That being said, there is prime opportunity for a sort of renaissance for women staying home in terms of localism and division of labor. As your average food becomes slop, clothing becomes all degenerate, and standard education becomes useless, there’s a need for stay at home… Read more »

Glenfilthie
Glenfilthie
Member
Reply to  Chet Rollins
2 years ago

Just so, Chet. Around here, home schooling is going nuts. The local ‘professional public educators’ are running scared.
It is truly good to see. We are seeing more young people scoping out our little chapel in the country too. They are seeking something better and many stay. Light is at the end of the tunnel.

Owlman
Owlman
Reply to  Glenfilthie
2 years ago

“Just so, Chet. Around here, home schooling is going nuts…”

I live near a blue shitlibopolis and as of late, more and more people echo, “you can’t send your kids to public schools, you have to home school..”

They are correct, and my wife and I feel the same way and have for a while. Public school = child abuse.

Steve
Steve
Reply to  Glenfilthie
2 years ago

Agreed. Homeschooling is even booming in many parts of Europe, even though it’s been banned by France and Germany. The best way to defeat the globalists is not to fight state elections, but to build alternatives from the ground up. Who would have thought that our cultural heroes and role models would be the Amish?

3g4me
3g4me
Reply to  Chet Rollins
2 years ago

Chet: Your comment echoed what I was thinking. Despite labor-saving devices, there was plenty for women to do still re cooking and cleaning. The biggest change and vacuum in their lives was the removal of children from the home to mass indoctrination and ‘government’ care.

Compsci
Compsci
Reply to  Chet Rollins
2 years ago

Chet, you’re on to something—child rearing. All the above comments regarding women as “obsolete” or having nothing to do given modern technology fail to appreciate this inalienable aspect of feminine behavior/biology. Unfortunately males are as responsible for this great failure in this division of labor as much—or more—than the odious philosophy of Feminism. Single males welcomed “free” sex and husbands quickly learned to enjoy the aspect of a second source of household income from an employed spouse. Free sex relieves/delays the male’s responsibility to grow up and provide security for a female in which she can breed and raise children.… Read more »

Jack Boniface
Jack Boniface
Member
2 years ago

In the first season of “The Walking Dead” (after which it got boring), there’s a scene where the women are washing clothes by hand. They gripe something like, “I used to be a head of HR. You used to be a university prof. Now we’re reduced to women’s work while the men go out and kill zombies.” Zombies are fake. But that’s our future.

Maniac
Maniac
2 years ago

I’ve often quipped that PUA should stand for Pussy Usurps All. Here’s to hoping that more of them wander into “Book of Ecclesiastes” territory like Roosh did.

Wkathman
Wkathman
Reply to  Maniac
2 years ago

Roosh has gone a bit overboard in his puritanism. It’s akin to the alcoholic who abandons booze and ends up a rabid teetotaler. I like Roosh and believe he’s on a better track now than he was originally, yet much of his current material suggests that he’s taking life too seriously and needs to chill out some. There’s a spergy aspect to it. One gets the impression that he suffers from a profound sense of alienation. While that’s certainly not uncommon these days, a man should do his best to overcome it. Sometimes Roosh seems to be succumbing to it.

Ploppy
Ploppy
Reply to  Wkathman
2 years ago

I used to post regularly on his forum, it was really something to see when he found Jesus. Talking about sex and cursing were banned, and a cadre of religious nuts quickly dominated every thread. The forum itself had largely drifted from pussy over to dissident politics already, but people dropped off from the loss of having any liberty to voice a dissenting opinion of any kind.

It does show that religious people can be just as bad as SJWs when they want to be.

Apex Predator
Apex Predator
Reply to  Maniac
2 years ago

RooshV is NOT a good example of where you want people to end up. He is an absolutist and that is bad in any regard. He went ‘all-in’ on being an utter manwhore, and literally wrote the book (several in fact) on it. Once he had his “Rode to Damascus” moment largely precipitated by the untimely death of his kid sister from cancer then he took that same intensity & absolutism and inverted it completely. Now he is a monastic and ascetic who has completely retreated from the world & society. Is that a better life than being a PUA… Read more »

3g4me
3g4me
Reply to  Apex Predator
2 years ago

Apex Predator: I may be reaching here, but I wonder if Roosh’s genetic background (half Iranian/half Armenian if I recall) has contributed to that careening from one absolute to another. Granted, I knew a woman in college – of complete White AngloSaxon heritage – who did the same. But I think that perhaps coming from and being raised in a non-White Western culture and then being offered the panoply of choices offered by license disguised as freedumb leads to excess. Sort of like the Amish who leave their faith after Rumspringa.

KGB
KGB
Reply to  Apex Predator
2 years ago

It brings to mind the mid-20th century Catholic theologian, Thomas Merton. If you read his autobiography, The Seven Storey Mountain, written just after he’d entered a Trappist monastery in Kentucky in the 1940’s, you come away believing he was a man who had journeyed from the hedonistic, atheistic left of the 1930’s to a religiously contemplative life of peace, and that he was content to live out his days in blissful silence. Instead, he became a prolific writer, battled with his abbots, fell in love with a nurse, and became enraptured with Eastern religion and the hippie-driven peace movement. In… Read more »

ProZNoV
ProZNoV
2 years ago

Feminism went completely off the rails when normal, mainstream women could no longer answer things like: “Can you name five positive aspects/traits of masculinity? Unique to men and men alone?” “How do mothers and women encourage young girls to prepare to be excellent wives?” “Can you name 5 negative traits of femininity that women always struggle with, and what are the best ways to do so?” And so on. Tate exists because every possible duty and virtue men aspire to are mocked; literally every bad behavior women exhibit is celebrated as a virtue or an unstoppable consequence of things outside… Read more »

La-Z-Man
La-Z-Man
2 years ago

After Katrina, I read about a group of Australian tourists who were in the Superdome for shelter. We all know of the mayhem that happened in there. This group, the girls sat in the middle of a circle, and the men stood on the outside of the circle keeping watch. None of these women, to paraphrase the man relating the events, ‘seemed interested in playing boss’.

Apex Predator
Apex Predator
Reply to  La-Z-Man
2 years ago

This is a large part of why I pray daily for AWFL (affluent white female leftists) who are a VERY large part of the engine that drives the on-going slow motion collapse of society, to get in extremely close proximity to their favored pets.

Nothing will disabuse you of your kumbaya ‘all people are the same’ horsesh-t as a few weeks around feral n-ggers. It is shockingly educational, if you survive. Nothing would solve our problems faster than these utter retards having direct and painful feedback related to their consequences of their voting, beliefs, and actions.

3g4me
3g4me
Reply to  Apex Predator
2 years ago

Apex: Very much regret that I have to disagree. We’ve seen too many past instances where they (or their husbands) rush to excuse and forgive whoever raped or savaged them or murdered their children, all in the name of holy diversity (often posturing as Christianity). I don’t think even direct engulfment by said diversity would disabuse them, because they’re always focused solely on what they feel and their own perceived social standing.

Apex Predator
Apex Predator
Reply to  3g4me
2 years ago

Touché! Very cogent counterpoint, totally (and sadly) true. However, my glass half full self still says that, on the balance, it would be better to expose them. Some serious true believers will die smiling as their feral pets open their throats thinking “at least I wasn’t rayciss!” but I don’t think that is the majority. There is an astonishing amount of evidence though for what you are saying some nationally famous (Molly Tibbits and family) some anecdotally so. I remember seeing a dumb lefty girl in DC who was literally punched in the face in broad daylight at a street… Read more »

Lettie
Lettie
Reply to  3g4me
2 years ago

I consider this bizarre manifestation/demonstration of warped Christian morality to be one of the most, (if not the most), twisted and aberrant trends in our twisted, demented, and degenerate society. It’s much worse than the virtue signalling like kneeling, masking, yard signs, etc., which are just the coward’s way of fitting into the group and deflecting any potential criticism. This is publically absolving someone who has killed,raped or injured your child. Nobody, including the perpetrator of the outrage, expects you to do this. In fact, they have contempt for you if you do. Is this what the Christian churches are… Read more »

Steve
Steve
Reply to  Lettie
2 years ago

Christian churches are run mostly by women. I read a puff piece about the new female head of our church here in Europe. It could have been about any left-wing NGO. All the usual blather about equity, diversity, etc. Nothing whatsoever about the teachings of Jesus – especially the dread word “sin”. As one might guess, the numbers of people still attending the national protestant church are fewer and fewer each year. Women screw up any organisation that used to be a traditional preserve of men: police, military, firefighting, churches.

Cwenhild
Cwenhild
Reply to  Apex Predator
2 years ago

You can see this in real time in the country that used to be Sweden. The wahmen there have traditionally responded by glueing themselves to runways to prevent their once and future rapists’ deportations. Make it make sense.

Compsci
Compsci
Reply to  La-Z-Man
2 years ago

How observant. I can think of any number of herd animals that do the same thing in the wild. Has “mankind” transcended their basic biological roots? I don’t think so.

Citizen of a Silly Country
Citizen of a Silly Country
2 years ago

“Free to indulge in their worst instincts, a bourgeois ruling class will do their worst and then seek to normalize it among the people over whom the rule.” I remember some years back reading Charles Murray’s Coming Apart. It showed very clearly that white society starting breaking down in the late 1960s as traditional norms were thrown first by upper middle class and then by the working class. However, what was interesting was that the upper middle class started to change direction in the late 1970s and 1980s. The upper middle class could see what divorce and no community involvement… Read more »

btp
Member
Reply to  Citizen of a Silly Country
2 years ago

I live on one side of a big street – the working class side. The other side is ruling class, closer to the river. It’s like living in an ’80s John Hughes high school. I walk the dog on the ruling class side of the street for obvious reasons.

Anyway. Working class side has Pride flags, but no Ukraine flags. Pink-haired girls and women running households. Ruling class side has Pride flags _and_ Ukrainian flags, but no pink hair and no women running households. Lots of women out with the new baby walking around.

Jack Dobson
Jack Dobson
Reply to  Citizen of a Silly Country
2 years ago

The primary difference between the upper middle and working classes during that time frame was economic pressure. Working class jobs were targeted successfully for destruction and lives were subsequently destroyed. The upper class also suffered a few hits but they were nowhere near as severe and they eventually recovered. As an aside, economic deindustrialization was one of the cruelest and frankly evil things ever done to a large segment of society. I see two possibilities now. The first is that the upper middle class begins to suffer greater and greater economic pressure and starts to fray. The second is there… Read more »

Jack Dobson
Jack Dobson
Reply to  Jack Dobson
2 years ago

“several economists who claim it will be the former”

The latter.

Xman
Xman
Reply to  Citizen of a Silly Country
2 years ago

My observation is that feminism and “liberation” has always been an affectation of the educated elites and was imposed upon the working classes at great cost. It’s one thing to be a feminist who slept with thirty guys as an undergrad, and then became a prim monogamous mommy sending her fertility-treatment children she birthed at age 40 to private school after making partner in the law firm and marrying a Jewish orthodontist. It’s quite another thing to have slept with thirty guys if you’re living in trailer park and working at Walmart for $12 an hour while the bastard children… Read more »

pixilated
pixilated
Reply to  Citizen of a Silly Country
2 years ago

Prior to 1940 a girl of 12 would have been required to have at least a working knowledge of how to bake bread, prepare a simple meal, wash clothes, sew on buttons and patches, iron clothing, mop and sweep floors, mind a baby, and process garden vegetables. From 1940 to about 1970, there were still home ec classes in high school that required girls to learn to sew a dress, plan, prepare and serve a meal using correct china and appropriate flatware (have you noticed that people tend to eat more with their hands?), learn basic hygiene practices, learn manners,… Read more »

joeyjünger
joeyjünger
2 years ago

Even when Chateau Heartiste was new and the bloom wasn’t quite off the rose, I knew being a cocksman was a dead end. Counting sexual coup (rather than sowing and tending a seed) is a recipe for reaping the whirlwind. Thinking sex is a solution or end in itself for some kind of transcendence is only excusable when you’re very young and a virgin and have built it up to be something more than it is. Men who fashion their identity around their sexual prowess always end up as bathetic cautionary tales, no matter their wealth or status. Think of… Read more »

Citizen of a Silly Country
Citizen of a Silly Country
Reply to  joeyjünger
2 years ago

Ramsey Paul called it early that the guys like Chateau Heartiste would move from picking up women to being dissident right. Once you realize that feminism is a joke, you realize that you’re being lied to about everything.

Also, didn’t Roosh (or however you spell his name) become a born again Christian or something like that? He came to the same realize that you talk about.

btp
Member
Reply to  Citizen of a Silly Country
2 years ago

Roosh is Orthodox, with an intense eastern-style beard and everything. He, also, is very much on the dissident right, it seems to me. Story as old as Augustine.

Marko
Marko
Reply to  btp
2 years ago

Yes he’s based Orthodox. Contributes to Patristic Faith Ministries with a bunch of other based Ortho bros.

Steve
Steve
Reply to  btp
2 years ago

I wish he’d just gotten married, settled down and had some kids. The strongest act of rebellion there is in today’s society.

I.M.
I.M.
Reply to  Citizen of a Silly Country
2 years ago

I remember reading Roosh’s blog after he’d been a pickup artist for several years, and you could really feel the shift in his thinking/mood coming through. He was sleeping with as many women as he wanted but it was destroying his soul. He couldn’t stand to be anywhere outside of eastern Europe for very long; he proclaimed the women there to be far more feminine than anywhere western. Even there you could feel his self-loathing growing as he was increasingly just going through the motions of bedding women. At that time, he couldn’t make that final leap to understand that… Read more »

karl von hungus
karl von hungus
Reply to  I.M.
2 years ago

seems like he has swung from one extreme to the other. is he married now?

Chet Rollins
Chet Rollins
Reply to  joeyjünger
2 years ago

> Thinking sex is a solution or end in itself for some kind of transcendence is only excusable when you’re very young and a virgin and have built it up to be something more than it is. The men who never get over this stage will eventually gravitate to more and more disgusting acts. Everyone probably has had an experience talking to a dirty old man who openly fantasizes about doing grossly illegal and depraved acts. On the other end, there’s no doubt our elites have networks to sate their increasingly vile appetites, hence why there are people like Epstein… Read more »

Götterdamn-it-all
Götterdamn-it-all
Reply to  joeyjünger
2 years ago

Mozart wrote an opera about the Andrew Tate of his time. It was “Don Giovanni.”

joeyjünger
joeyjünger
Reply to  Götterdamn-it-all
2 years ago

I forget the exact Bukowski quote, but it’s something like: “It may be true that Casanova bedded a thousand women in his day. But it’s certainly just as true that I could spit on his grave today without thinking twice.” Sex with reproduction is the closest thing to eternity/cheating death our species has. Sex for its own sake may be the most ephemeral, transitory. Those who’ve tried to freeze a moment—using sex as “rocket fuel” as Colin Wilson once put it—basically blow themselves up. Aleister Crowley’s “sex magick,” the “free love” of the hippies. It’s like fire. You respect it… Read more »

LineInTheSand
LineInTheSand
Reply to  joeyjünger
2 years ago

Roissey, later Chateau Heartiste due to being doxxed, had one of the instructive evolutions that I have ever witnessed.

From hedonistic, present-oriented cocksman to hardcore white nationalist. A lesson for us all.

Apex Predator
Apex Predator
Reply to  LineInTheSand
2 years ago

One other thing I find fascinating and it may be merely a coincidence but two of the biggest early progenitors of the Manosphere where literally my neighbors. Roissy (Heartiste) and Roosh are geographically quite proximate to me in the DC area. I feel like that is not a coincidence because the turbo b-tch mode here went into high gear in the early 00s because everyone who wanted to be someone was flooding into DC. Try hard undergrad chicks with their “poli sci” degrees, lawyers, and general social climbers all started to appear in larger and larger numbers. NYC was more… Read more »

William Corliss
Member
Reply to  joeyjünger
2 years ago

Pat’s wife Shelley was unable to conceive — likely as a result of a childhood illness — and Pat, as a Catholic, wasn’t about to divorce her.

I’ve heard this put-down of Pat before and it’s a shame. He never shared anything about this (I worked for Pat in the 1990s) with anyone, but he’s a man of faith, and he accepted it as God’s will 50 years ago.

Compsci
Compsci
Reply to  joeyjünger
2 years ago

“ An organism’s main responsibility is to reproduce. ”

Not completely correct. An organism must reproduce and do whatever it takes to see that its offspring successfully reproduce! This is not trivial. In the example you respond to, you get “step one” correct, but if “step two” is missing…well, then you only have delayed extinction a generation.

I’m thinking we have both problems besetting us.

usNthem
usNthem
2 years ago

Feminism has pretty much been a disaster across the board – life has just been too easy since the end of WWII. I don’t know what kind of tough times it’ll take to reverse the mess or at least put us on a track to reverse it, but it probably won’t be pretty and I doubt I’ll be around to witness it. Traditional roles and the desire to live by and perpetuate them needs become the norm again.

Götterdamn-it-all
Götterdamn-it-all
2 years ago

“In a crisis, the first thing that happens is the men in charge kill the guys like Andrew Tate.”

I have lived more than half my life waiting for this event. I may be too feeble to do much more than wave a salute with my walking cane when the time comes, but I do want to see the day arrive.

imbroglio
imbroglio
2 years ago

I live in the heart of wokedom where Boomer and Gen X feminists have done very well and will likely pay little or no price for their conceit and good fortune. The next generation — in their teens and twenties — are the non-binaries. You might call them the trans-normies. I’d like Z to opine further on this transition as, at least around here, it’s widespread and growing.

Chet Rollins
Chet Rollins
2 years ago

The old manosphere was a powerful gateway to the dissident realm, where angry men with weak to nonexistent father figures gave up on mainstream advice for attractive women. They found out the advice of expressing your feelings, being vulnerable, deferring to the lady, ask explicitly asking permission was only a gateway to bitter disappointment. It’s no coincidence the change Heartiste made in his blog before being thrown into the void. The reason why Tate is even a thing is because mainstream dating coaches keep doubling down on this terrible advice, and encourage awful behavior in women. That and he’s very… Read more »

Xman
Xman
Reply to  Chet Rollins
2 years ago

Aristotle wrote that the ideal age for marriage was 36 for men, 18 for women.

He also said “the male is by nature superior, the female inferior.”

Compsci
Compsci
Reply to  Xman
2 years ago

In his time probably true. In modern times, perhaps too late in years. We can also substitute for age accomplishments or achievements meet—a timeline so to speak. Both men and women need to grow up and physically/psychologically mature, but men need to establish themselves in some sort of productive societal position, so that makes them the older of the two sexes as men must work to establish themselves.

Odd how this was known in the West until a century or so ago. Parents would never allow their daughters to entertain marriage to a male without “substance”.

Xman
Xman
Reply to  Compsci
2 years ago

“Odd how this was known in the West until a century or so ago. Parents would never allow their daughters to entertain marriage to a male without “substance”.”

Well, that was prior to the establishment of the welfare state, which, coincidentally, was about 100 years ago…

Steve
Steve
Reply to  Chet Rollins
2 years ago

Barren, middle-aged women aren’t going to be prey to anything except cats.

Outdoorspro
Outdoorspro
2 years ago

“It turns out that there is little point in being a responsible man when the women are not good at being women.”

That, right there pretty much sums up the modern Western dynamic.

Dinodoxy
Dinodoxy
2 years ago

Exploitation of women was always a huge element of feminism.

When I was young, i used to say that Give a medal to the guy that convinced women that meaningless sex was the ultimate in female empowerment.

When I matured, I came to see that convincing women that working was more fulfilling than having children was another type of exploitation. Maybe a worse form.

The reality is that for most women, feminism has meant foregoing a family for the caricature of housewivery – mindless meaningless “work” and shagging drinks for strangers.

ProZNoV
ProZNoV
Reply to  Dinodoxy
2 years ago

Someone in Twitter wrote:

“Feminism was promoted largely so professors could sleep with their students. Now transgender is is being embraced so pedos can sleep with children (ie, grooming)”

LineInTheSand
LineInTheSand
Reply to  Dinodoxy
2 years ago

Dino, that sly dog, remembers wishing, “Give a medal to the guy that convinced women that meaningless sex was the ultimate in female empowerment.” Until the recent past, when I had thoughts like Dino’s, I would typically follow them with, “And those poor women! Being brainwashed by the media to abandon their true nature, which is monogamy and the raising of children.” The manosphere emphasizes observing female behavior, not what women say. The times in which we now live are an especially fertile time to observe women because nearly every constraint on their behavior and thoughts has been defeated. My… Read more »

Compsci
Compsci
Reply to  LineInTheSand
2 years ago

Point taken, but I still claim Nature developed over millennia is not changed over a century or two. Given your description, why is it a common observation of “successful” feminist women, who at the end of their reproductive years go to great ends to have their “one and done” offspring? Something is gnawing at them. Something is missing in their lives. That something is their innate biology.

Jeffrey Zoar
Jeffrey Zoar
Reply to  LineInTheSand
2 years ago

I have noticed that women, for time immemorial, through all eras and cultures, have dressed just as sluttily, or revealingly, as the standards of their time and place deem acceptable. As soon as it becomes socially acceptable to show more skin, they do. Every time. I’m not exactly sure what this means, but it definitely means something.

Compsci
Compsci
Reply to  Jeffrey Zoar
2 years ago

In the human species, women preen (advertise) for men. In the animal kingdom, this is often reversed. Women show off their fecundity. Women’s fashion at any particular time period can be understood in such mannerisms—display of breasts, buttocks and hips, lip and face coloring. Even the Muslims understand this and dress their women in bags for the opposite purpose.

Cwenhild
Cwenhild
Reply to  LineInTheSand
2 years ago

Excellent comment. One still occasionally reads things like, “If only the world was run by women. It would be a place of peace, fairness, niceness and justice.”

Well our bit of the world IS run by women, and from where I sit it looks more like a Heironymous Bosch painting.

Steve
Steve
Reply to  Cwenhild
2 years ago

“If women ruled the world, we would still be living in caves. But caves with beautifully decorated curtains”. The only true thing a feminist (Camilla Piaglia) ever said.

Dinodoxy
Dinodoxy
2 years ago

Similarly, the woke feminists will disappear in a crisis. In fact, all forms of feminism will disappear as soon as things get serious again.

Do you have anything to support this assertion. Because it sounds like wishful thinking.

Jimmy Buffet
Jimmy Buffet
Reply to  Dinodoxy
2 years ago

Makes perfect sense to me. When things get serious, living gets hard. When living gets hard, making it day to day requires more physical work, less sitting at computers and TVs (brainwashing), and a strong societal preference for practically. By extension, that last part means a lot less patience for bullshit. Suddenly, the marginal trance on society will be broken and people will, through necessity, get back to basics. That won’t include listening to pick up artists and feminists bloviate at coffee houses and it won’t include having a “national conversation” every time someone gets their feelings hurt. It also… Read more »

Jimmy Buffet
Jimmy Buffet
Reply to  Jimmy Buffet
2 years ago

practically = practicality, (you knew that)

Bartleby the Scrivner
Bartleby the Scrivner
Reply to  Dinodoxy
2 years ago

Many in the comments, and I think Z himself, have pointed out, quite correctly, that when shit gets real, women go for the strong horse, for protection.

One’s own eyes support this assertion.

Compsci
Compsci
Reply to  Bartleby the Scrivner
2 years ago

Yep. The wife here is pretty up and willing to do whatever she wants, whenever she wants. But when it goes “bump in the night” what she wants is to wake me up to go “handle it”. Intruders, both human and animal, are my job. She’ll hide inside while I shoot the damn thing, then and only then—possibly—take a peak at it. Oh, and I also get to bury it as well.

On the other hand, she gets to take care of the grandkids when they visit. That’s her forte. Works for me. I don’t speak “baby”.

Mow Noname
Mow Noname
Reply to  Dinodoxy
2 years ago

I’ll bite: a masculine society with a male military will crush and conquer a female society.

US security forces are overwhelmingly male. The replacement cohort in the security state is overwhelmingly female and diverse.

No individual, group, nation or group of nations would dream of engaging the US 25 years ago with any hope of prevailing. Now? How about in 10 years?

Diversity (division) and females are not strengths.

Jeffrey Zoar
Jeffrey Zoar
Reply to  Mow Noname
2 years ago

The geographic uniqueness of America in all likelihood makes it safe from military invasion even when it is feminized. A country like Belgium for instance is of course ripe to be overrun, except all its neighbors are feminized too, and all of them living under the security umbrella of the GAE, which is based in an unconquerable nation. Pretty slick setup tbh

Of course migrant invasion is another subject

Ubiquity
Ubiquity
Reply to  Jeffrey Zoar
2 years ago

Unconquerable…

Kinda looks conquered don’t it?

Jeffrey Zoar
Jeffrey Zoar
Reply to  Ubiquity
2 years ago

It’s certainly subvertable. Convergable. But not conquerable in the military sense.

Apex Predator
Apex Predator
Reply to  Dinodoxy
2 years ago

50,00 years of human evolution “supports this assertion”, you cannot really be this dim so I’m going to assume this is a troll attempt of some sort I’m not getting.

Steve
Steve
Reply to  Dinodoxy
2 years ago

Because when you’re starving and fighting for a crust of bread, and trying to keep yourself dying of hypothermia, you suddenly stop giving a damn about reporting the man who wolf-whistled you that time.

Richard Hurtz
Richard Hurtz
2 years ago

‘Women get the men they deserve.’ On the bright side, these women are not procreating. On the dark side, the other ones continue to do so and pour over the border/Mediterranean.

Thoughts on the Bolso/Lula happenings? I had a tiny inkling of optimism this time. Now his claim to fame is to be caught on camera eating fast food in Florida.

Mike
Mike
Reply to  thezman
2 years ago

It’s funny that their hatred of Trump made them install Lula when they had to know that Lula was a friend of Russia/China when he was president before. He was the B in BRICS and was an enthusiastic supporter of the multipolar world.

Once again, reflexive Trump hatred shoots the GAE in the foot. I was a fan of Bolsonaro but I can see Lula being better in the long run. Wonder if the neos will run a color revolution in Brazil soon?

karl von hungus
karl von hungus
Reply to  thezman
2 years ago

did you mean “*are* a warning”?

Marko
Marko
Reply to  Richard Hurtz
2 years ago

Yeah the “trad” people we tend to like are certainly the darker ones. East Asians are still trad, but I wonder if that will go away. They seem to have a penchant for weird sex stuff and girly-men.

The irony is, I think, that the Muslim invaders and the Latin invaders will teach the White man how to be men again. Whites will be outbred and displaced, but this might end up with a ethnic European renaissance…in a few generations, if we’re lucky. We just need to find a place to nurture the renaissance.

Pete
Pete
Reply to  Marko
2 years ago

White men will be enslaved, castrated, or murdered…or pick any 2 out of 3, and probably all 3.

The wombs of white women will be repurposed for the breeding of the conquerors. It has been this way for thousands of years, and will not change just for us.

karl von hungus
karl von hungus
2 years ago

it seems peculiar that tate would engage in sex trafficking, when he makes so much money off his “classes”. who knows what the real story is; stranger things have happened. maybe it is like that weird sex cult that blew up a couple of years ago, and had some b-level actresses in it. almost seems like you could do a remake of Conan The Barbarian set in modern times…

Redpill Boomer
Redpill Boomer
Reply to  thezman
2 years ago

I am also skeptical. The EU nations produce a lot of porn. I’d think he could afford to pay them. But who knows, pro athletes who should have no shortage of willing partners sometimes commit rape.

Hun
Hun
Reply to  thezman
2 years ago

“the females being exploited”

Those females knew very well what they were doing. Porn actresses are not some poor innocent exploited victims.
If anything, it’s the moronic male followers of Tate who are being exploited by him; and millions of porn-addicted men are exploited by the porn industry. Porn is mental heroin.

Ploppy
Ploppy
Reply to  thezman
2 years ago

“Most likely he was using the females being exploited as props in his “classes” about being a pickup artist.” This is the key part of the grift. You video yourself doing the cold approach but you’re actually talking to a woman you’ve hired. “Hey there sugar tits, cum here often? Would you be interested in some sex? I can do really good sex with my pee pee, right in your bagina. I’ve totally seen a bagina before so I know what I’m doing.” And then the woman pretends to swoon from the PUA’s honeyed words. The marks eat this up… Read more »

Dinodoxy
Dinodoxy
Reply to  karl von hungus
2 years ago

I’ve read that the “sex-trafficking” is nothing more than hiring a prostitute. IE almost completely contrived.

Bourbon
Bourbon
Reply to  Dinodoxy
2 years ago

Dinodoxy: “sex-trafficking” is nothing more than hiring a prostitute”. Unless the chick is moved through a nation where she’s beneath the age of legal consent. Then it’s a pretty serious felony. PS: Who precisely makes the babies [to preserve the future of our bloodlines] if all the chicks are on birth control and/or having abortions [from prostituting themselves to older men], and none of the chicks ever get around to producing actual live births of White children? You need to spend some time on /pol/ and learn what life is like for a young man of Klownworld, in his early… Read more »