Most people assume that you have a constitutional right to a “jury of your peers”, but no such right exists in the law or reality. The phrase does not appear anywhere in the text of the Constitution or the Bill of Rights. In the debates over the new Constitution, there was no use of this phrase. Like the phrase, “separation of church and state”, it is one of those ideas that snuck in long after the Constitution was adopted and people have come to accept it is a real thing that exists in the law,
The Constitution is rather vague on the matter of juries. Article II states that “the trial of all crimes, except in cases of impeachment, shall be by jury” but that is a far cry from requiring a “jury of your peers.” The closest it gets is the 6th Amendment which begins with, “In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury of the state and district wherein the crime shall have been committed.”
What the Constitution tells us about juries and jury trials is that they need to be speedy, local and impartial. Otherwise, it is up to the states and localities to sort out the mechanics of the trial and the nature of juries. The Framers could have been more specific but they either assumed it was not necessary, given the customs of the age, which had been handed down over many generations, or they thought it best for states and localities to work out the details.
In the 18th century, no one could have imagined a jury drawn from vagrants, imbeciles and lunatics, so there would have been no need to provide against it. Juries were composed of respectable people, almost always men. Since crimes were all state crimes, it made sense to defer to the states on the process. By the time the Constitution was adopted, every state had a court system, and they were generally modeled on the English system for obvious reasons.
This is one of the many flaws in the Constitution. It was created by men who lacked the imagination to provide for the rise of a universal and timeless moral code that included men pretending to be women and drug addicts having an unquestioned right to roam the streets, harassing the citizens. They failed to appreciate the need to have two-digit IQ people, barely able to dress themselves, sit on juries in cases involving complex technical issues in narrow technical fields.
Daniel Penny is on trial for his life in New York City and his fate will be decided by people who may not be able to read at a high school level. New York City is now famous for madhouse juries, lunatic judges and ideological prosecutors who use the former two conditions to persecute their ideological enemies. Everyone outside the ideological fever swamps understands that Daniel Penny is on trial because he is a white and the crackhead was black.
If Daniel Penny was getting a jury of his peers, the bare minimum requirement would be that the jurors be American citizens. We know that at least one juror is a recent migrant from South America. Of course, his peers would include those who have jobs and can read and write at a college level. Given the endless racial agitation, a jury of his peers would have to white or at least majority white. The jury sitting in judgement of Daniel Penny meets none of the qualifications.
This is not a New York City problem. Kyle Rittenhouse is celebrating the three-year anniversary of his acquittal. Everyone assumed he would be found guilty in a rigged trial by a crooked judge, because this has become the norm. He got lucky and was charged in a jurisdiction dominated by sensible white people, including the judge. He was also blessed with unusually stupid prosecutors. As a result, he got a fair trial, and the jury promptly acquitted him of the charges.
The Rittenhouse case is an exception to the general rule of the American legal system which is that you will never get a fair trial or a jury of your peers. Instead, you will face an ideologue for a judge and a jury of randomly selected simpletons. This is true on civil cases as well as criminal cases. Elon Musk is fighting the courts over his Tesla compensation because the Delaware judges hate him. Even the richest man is subjected to trial by ideological madmen.
This is not a new phenomenon. The corruption of the legal system that gave us the civil right revolution has also eaten away at the judicial system. The maxim that anything that hints of discrimination is immoral has resulted in jury selection becoming little more than drawing names from a hat. The names in the hat are composed of people too stupid or lazy to avoid jury duty. The peremptory challenge of prospective jurors has slowly disappeared from the system.
Like the phrase, “separation of church and state”, the right to a “jury of your peers” has become a sad joke. The state has become a weird secular theocracy rooted in the progressive lunacy that gave us the civil right revolution. The state now makes war on actual churches in the name of a religion it pretends is a set of timeless, universal moral principles rooted in reason. As a result, a “jury of your peers” is a threat issued by the clerisy running the system.
Destruction of the law is always the last phase of egalitarian ideologies. Because men are not naturally equal, they must be made unnaturally equal. For everyone to be a peer of everyone else, the tall must be made short and the strong must be made week, because the opposite is not possible. The law becomes a weapon in the war against the people who make society possible. The civil rights revolution was an act of revenge against the capable and it is reaching its logical end.
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Having served on a jury trial in NYC in the early 2000s for a medical malpractice case I can attest to the danger Mr Penny is in. To say the jury pool is drawn from the lowest dregs of NYC is an understatement. As Sebastian Mansicalco once said in his bit about jury duty “most of the potential jurors are one step away from being a defendant”. We spent 3 weeks on the jury and the judge restricted us from taking notes even though the medical testimony on both sides was ridiculously complicated. Comes the time to deliberate a verdict… Read more »
It is not just the juries. Judges are often bizarrely stupid. Jumanji Jackson worked her way up to the Supreme Court and she may not be able to read.
50-50 on Jumanji being able to read. We do know that she can’t give a definition of a woman. What’s just as bad is everyone in the room who sat in silence and then voted her in instead of ridicule and laughter and demanding someone serious and competent.
Sotomayor compared restricting the distribution of hormone blockers to restricting the use of aspirin. There is a strong case she is even dumber. I am surprised she isn’t still wearing a mask to protect herself from Covid like Taylor Lorenz.
Shanequa Jumanji Jackson just compared banning trans surgeries for minors to banning inter racial marriage.
however much you hate what this place has become, it is not nearly enough.
I can’t help but wonder if sitting next to the two of them has had a red pilling effect on Kagan
Or perhaps Kagan feels encouraged by the strength that her side is demonstrating in having two dumb supreme court justices who share her goals.
As I often repeat, to Z Man as well with his final sentence of this post, the battle is not between the capable and the incompetent or the producers versus the takers. It is traditional whites versus everyone else.
Some of the smartest and most capable people on the planet hate traditional whites. These people do not want to live and let with you in state of high productivity.
You get it – too many of Zman’s newer cuckservatard readers do not. I read (I think at Gayway Pundit) that Israeli-born dyke Dafna Yoran has referred to Penny, throughout the trial, as “the White man.” When they tell you they hate you, believe them.
Yes, she’s a Jew (holy cow, color me shocked!), who is gay and married to a blm activist. What a clown show.
How does the defense not object to that?
“the battle is not between the capable and the incompetent or the producers versus the takers. It is traditional whites versus everyone else.”
Well put, good insight. To say it’s the stupid vs the smart, or any of your other stated comparisons does not aptly describe the situation. Whites are not simply the bearers of a higher than average IQ and therefore education from the rest of the population—they are also imbued with various behavioral proclivities which make them better suited to deliberate in a court of law according to our heritage Anglo-Saxon, Christian tradition.
“It is traditional whites versus everyone else.”
Don’t think that’s quite what @Zman said, but it may well have been what he meant.
Hope you are not right, though. Non-white excludes about 40%, non-trad excludes about half the remainder. That’s still enough, but if you then throw out the derided grillers and sportsballers and cucks, we lose. They could take us just sending in their waterboys.
An apt comparison. What they have in common is they both should be illegal.
In a sane society, my friend.
As if banning interracial marriage is a bad thing…
I like to flip that. Maybe she is right. Trans surgery is an abomination. Maybe interracial marriage is, too.
Speaking of Lorenz, people should go read what she just wrote about CEOs on Bluesky.
Of course, as an employee of the CIA Daily, she won’t be touched.
Sotomayor doesn’t know the difference between “de facto” and “de jure”.
‘We Certainly Have De Jure Segregation’: Sonia Sotomayor Questions Lawyer On Affirmative Action
She must have gotten flummoxed by Jumanji intoning, “Ladies and gemmun o’ de jure!”
And the fix was in for her to be confirmed. Any sensible inquisitor would have asked her if she herself were a woman. If she said yes, the follow up would be how do you know?. No body ever seems to ask simple biological questions such as, do you have ovaries, no, born with a vagina, no, you are not a woman, do you have a prostate, yes, guess what you are a man. Easy stuff.
Yep:
Federal Judge confuses Constitution & Declaration of Independence
First name Arenda. Law degree from HBCU North Carolina Central. I bet it was rigorous.
If nothing else, it was niggorous…
I gave up long ago checking out credentials and race. Always the same thanks to DIE.
The dumbest of the lot by far is the Wise Latina Sonia Sotomayor. During oral arguments other justices frequently have to explain to her in a roundabout way what is being claimed in the moment. She has no grasp of simple and basic legal concepts. Jackson also is retarded, but she seems to grasp the argument from time to time.
There are numerous such judges at the trial level, and that is where the severest damage is done.
Yes ! The confirmation of the obviously unqualified Sotamayor to the SC was a watershed moment that I dreaded for years. Once the DEI agenda penetrated the supreme court and competence was sacrificed in favor of diversity it set a terribly dangerous precedent. It won’t be much longer before South African levels of corruption and malfeasance are SOP in every court, state and federal, in Amerika.
It was a shot in the foot. Souter (and brennan before him) whose seat Sotomayor holds, had similar views but seemed more capable. Obama should have picked someone with there firepower
Given a choice that your enemies be stupid or intelligent, be grateful when they are stupid.
It won’t be much longer before South African levels of corruption and malfeasance are SOP in every court, state and federal, in Amerika
Many places (south Texas for example) have already been there for generations.
Not just south Texas – I suffered through weeks of jury duty in DFW as an alternate. The juror pool was heavily black/brown/yellow with various head coverings. Did not register to vote in our new location for various reasons, including not getting called for jury duty.
We are already there, friend. Even if it’s not totally applicable in your locality, as a whole we live in a disintegrating country. My husband was reading the other day about the first heart transplant done in South Africa in 1967 (remember reading about it back then). And today the Whites who remain in that forsaken land have no reliable power or potable water, and are routinely slaughtered by friends of employees of ‘security companies’ they hire. And we can no longer build . . . just about anything (airplanes, bridges, etc.).
What a shithole the US has become.
Only the blue areas Jake.
The less White a country becomes, the more of a shithole it becomes.
Buh buh but . . . she’s female! And of color! Ergo, she must be righteous and wise. It’s in the Prog Charter.
Someone just flubbed the line. It was not supposed to be “wise Latina” but “wisest of the Latina”.
Sotomayor should be selling tacos on the beach.
i doubt she can cook
lol and sunglasses on a clipboard
And her origins are pretty much unknown…Much of her purported background does not check out….But to notice that would be….raycist!
I believe you can thank Bush The Elder for her. She began her legal career in Morgenthau’s office in Manhattan and at some point her name was put in front of Bush and he had her put on the federal bench in an attempt to show the left he wasn’t racist. I remember when barry put her up for consideration to SCOTUS and the SC struck down one of her signature rulings right in the middle of her confirmation hearings. Her decision to dismiss an appeal from (I believe) the city of Hartford firefighters union (Whites, as usual, were deliberately… Read more »
But she can yap on forever about nothing.
How did she get a clerkship? You have to be one of the top law students in the country to get one. Breyer rarely hired black clerks so it couldn’t have been aa. I will say that Breyer seems smarter than her though
Lance Ito, the OJ Simpson judge, was no Copernicus either.
I can attest to this – most of the judges in our area were HBCU grads who can barely read. Actors in lawyer/cop shows know more real law than these idiots. To top it off, many of them were female with all the baggage included.
The law schools mass-produced females the past 40 years. This is the proximate, and major, reason for corruption in the courts.
Women ruling over men always ends in desolation.
Its kind of incredible how something as byzantine as the legal system is piloted by people with minds comparable to gorillas.
The intellectual and lawyering savaging that Ted Cruz gave her in the Senate was shocking. She was rendered incapable. Unfortunately, in this age, it was just a vanity based cock strut by Ted Cruz. What the Ted Cruz’s of the world need to realize, and realize quickly, is that this cock strutting gets them nothing. In fact, it builds up enemies who seethe in resentment and desire for absolute destruction as revenge. The savaging did nothing to prevent her from being confirmed as a SC Justice. Someday she may be the chief justice and exact her revenge on us all.… Read more »
Chief Justice doesn’t have much more power than regular ol’ justices. The main thing they get to do is assign who writes an opinion.
White men must stop jumping in to help other people. Especially when those people are known to hate us. I know it’s hard for many white guys not to be heroic but please save that heroism for those who deserve it, especially other white guys and good white women. You have to assume other groups will stab you in the back right after you save them.
Whites are going through a learning phase. Our evolved high-trust, moral nature is no longer a fit in today’s increasingly brown society, full of distrust, cheating and antiwhiteism.
Well, I hope they learn very fast because we are fast becoming outnumbered.
Already are outnumbered; both literally and effectively. Get over it. You ain’t saving the white race by caring for all of them (Americans calling themselves “Europeans” are traitors). Sympathize, sure, but look out for your own – go local, family, neighbors, nearby communities. More than that a person spreads their effective concern too thin and renders themself impotent.
Enough with this defeatism, men! In South Africa, a handful of whites literally ruled hordes of illiterate, stupid blacks for generations. Things are getting so bad there and in other black African utopias that they are begging whites to return because that’s the only way to keep the lights on and the water flowing.
The only reason things are this bad is because WE let it slide.
But they were in control of the government back then. How is it working out now?
Ack… imagine having to be in charge of those people. Better to go extinct than doom my heirs to carry the white man’s burden for eternity. Perhaps after the worst of the stupids die out due to technological colapses a new white race will re-evolve in the cold regions. Hopefully one with stronger in-group preference.
And any foolish Whites who return will deserve their entirely predictable fate. How long do we make excuses for people who refuse to accept racial reality?
I hope those SA whites being begged tell nogs to FOAD.
I could say the same thing about charity, you give and give and it’s never enough.Even when Zelenskyy has all the lettuce in the world it still won’t be enough unless you also die. The sullen dark faces with outstretched hand, while in the other, a machete. At this point I donate to nothing (Thanks to the Salvation Army informing me I need to confess my guilt about being white) and I sit on my hands. Do not produce, protest or participate. If Fauci gets pardoned I hope to see more hoodie-wearing avengers.
I donated time & money to the SA, ‘rang the bell’ at kettles, in front of a Wal Mart, in the evening, and in cold weather, for years. Not since I too was castigated for my whiteness a few years back
Those kettles are a scam. I knew a couple who was involved in this activity and they kept almost all the money and it was perfectly legal. This was in the late 80s very early 90s. They made thousands of extra Dollars during the Christmas season. Almost all charities are scams including the Salvation Army and have been for a long, long time. Jack London wrote a book called People of the Abyss in 1903. In one of the chapters, the Salvation Army is the focus. They were pretty brutal to the homeless people they were “serving” in London. Just… Read more »
Like the Red Cross. Eff’em.
With some minor exceptions of local charities, I would not give money to any charity under any circumstances. Most charities are just flat out scams. Even the ones that aren’t almost never do their “work” where you can observe what they do, how they do it and most importantly, the effect of their charitable works in whatever ‘community’ they “serve”
Can’t say I agree with you about the Salvation Army. They only use 18% of the money they collect on administrative expenses, which is pretty good. They don’t have obscene salaries, either. The remaining 82% they spend on their programs and they do pretty good things with down and out people, druggies and drunks are what they are known for. The good stuff I throw out always goes to them, even though I have to drive all the way to downtown to donate it just because I happen to like that charity. It is also Christian based which I also… Read more »
Last I checked, the “commanding general” of the SA lives on basically poverty wages.
If I was going to give to a charity, I too would carefully chose a Christian charity which does local work. I have a bad taste in my mouth about the Salvation Army because of the kettles in the malls and outside of stores. Back in the late 80s, my best friend from high school and his wife both worked for a company that did those kettle collections. It wasn’t Salvation Army they worked for, but a contractor. They kept like 90% of what when into the buckets and it was perfectly legal. So based on my own personal experience,… Read more »
Look at the nutjobs on this page downvoting the Salvation Army. Who downloads the Salvation Army except for Christian-hating leftists and knuckle dragging antisocial troglodytes?
I don’t like that it doesn’t show who was downvoting, at least for the people who consistently use the same handle. I only ever do it to trolls and people are being an asshat, which is almost never.
I used to donate to the SA. I also thought they were fairly good “in a sea of grifters”. However, there was that VP in the organization who posted on their web page some BS about atonement of ‘Whites for their past sins against coloreds’, or some such. That was it, no more. Yeah, the main organization attempted to backtrack for this “slight”, but really they only regretted the financial loss—not the message. As to local charities, there was one in town. A rescue mission where bums could catch a meal, watch some TV, and sleep on a cot in… Read more »
Also, 75% of cash generated by the Salvation Army stays within the local community. See:
Answer to How much of the donations to the Salvation Army go to the needy? by James Bergen
https://www.quora.com/How-much-of-the-donations-to-the-Salvation-Army-go-to-the-needy/answer/James-Bergen-6?ch=15&oid=217319558&share=73bbc86f&srid=oGavD&target_type=answer
Hey Nick, I’ve got sympathy for the Salvation Army too, though I believe the anecdotes above. I was a recipient of SA charity when I was a small child and whether they’ve slipped or not I may not put money in the kettle but I won’t attack them. I like and respect the folks here who differ. I upvoted you but it adds to the downvotes, so you are not as downvoted as it appears
You may not be familiar, but there’s a certain segment of the population here that apparently hates me. I find it funny more than anything else. At one point I think I had 15 down votes on the first post. Who could hate the Salvation Army that much?
Whatever their deficiencies, they do good work. I have a soft spot for the sad sacks and lost puppies of the world and that’s who they are known for helping.
Big corporate charities are just as evil as all the other corporations because they share an identical anti-white ideology. I won’t give them the time of day.
There was a Salvation Army Christmas tree in the nearest Walmart right after Thanksgiving, in our 93% White county. Almost all the names on the ‘gift’ tags were obvious non-Whites. I stopped doing the Christmas ‘Santa” and toy drives years ago for the same reason. I donated three “Thanksgiving” meals from the local grocery store to the local food pantry, and I handed some cash to my usual cashier at the smaller local market. And we give monthly to the local church we attend. Otherwise I remain unapologetically Scrooge.
Penny’s first mistake was degrading and debasing himself with military service in the post-Obama era. He doesn’t look old enough to have enlisted earlier.
Very well said. Hear, hear.
“White men must stop jumping in to help other people.” Yep. This is something you learn real quick when you start carrying a gun in public. That thing is on your hip to protect YOU and NOBODY else. No white-knighting, no playing hero, no “helping” the cops. No saving the women and children or the banker’s money, LOL. Everyone else had a choice to get their own carry permit. if they didn’t, they can reap the consequences of their decision. It’s not up to you to save them. There are plenty of cases of dudes who got into trouble trying… Read more »
Wise counsel.
The best defense, at least for now, is to stay the F out of degenerate leftist strongholds least you get prosecuted and convicted for a thoughtcrime by a simpleminded DEI hire. Daniel Penny’s crime was believing that he could live or visit a third world city without repercussion. Add entire countries such as the UK and Germany to that list.
A decent rule of thumb is that if a place doesn’t allow for legal concealed carry, it should be thought of as enemy territory.
Germany and the UK are not nearly as violent or degenerate as NY.
Pam Bondi ,when you look at her record, is a Leftist but that does not mean Florida is as bad as NY.
A twice-divorced feminist with ties to Scientology. This is the best that Trump could scrounge-up for Attorney General?
My 90 year old dad was complaining about the same thing. He says this is an administration full of divorced people, meaning people divorced multiple times. There was a time and day when this would disqualify people.
I always enjoyed being asked why I was still single by divorced people
Once I found out she was divorced twice, I figure she’s either a dyke or must be a real shrew.
well we know one thing about her
she makes bad decisions
Interesting. A generational difference in marks of suspicion.
As a stereotypical Gen X guy, if I didn’t know these characters already, I’d know Trump’s picks are mostly bad because most of them look “dressed up,” in the costume sense. Can’t trust a man who doesn’t look right in his suit, a woman in Fox News makeup, a midlife crisis tattoo guy, etc.
The divorced—still on the prowl when they’re too old to signify it naturally—often look that way.
Different clue, same suspect.
Divorce is a negative signet of character, absolutely. With the proviso that 80% of divorces are initiated by women.
I am somewhat less than giddy about Donnie’s picks. Not as bad as his first (clueless) term, but nothing earthshaking aside from, perhaps, DOGE.
He needs asskickers, not empowered women running the justice department. America already has that and it’s not working for men and boys.
Instead of grabbing ’em by the puss for another four years, it looks like they are grabbing him by the scrote!
It’s fair to say his wife and daughter are overly operative in his political life, to the nation’s detriment.
Daughter for sure. Wife I am not so sure – seems she does her best to keep out of things.
100% this, especially now. It has only accelerated with time. You run afoul of a minority for ANY reason in a lefty bughive and you are well and truly f-cked because juries are FULL of virtue signaling white wahmen who would be more than happy to throw you under the bus as well as said aggrieved minorities. But as Z pointed out, that is only half your battle, the other half is the judge. You can be SURE the prosecutor in any leftist enclave will be looking for maximum damage to you if it’s a White vs. minority setup of… Read more »
I was a plaintiff in a civil trial once and the experience totally sucked. It was clear that the jury did not want to be there at all. It was an insouciant jury, not an impartial jury. I lost. I am certain I would have won if I had requested a bench trial instead. Of course like most litigants I was following my lawyer’s advice and he wanted a jury trial because he thought (wrongly) they would award more money and thus he would get a bigger contingency fee. The experience forever redpilled me on what a three-ring, bullshit circus… Read more »
The difference between having a talented lawyer and having a hack is night and day. Comfortable in a courtroom, equipped with a thorough knowledge of legal principles, the talented one stands a much better chance of winning your case. It reminds me of the movie The Devil’s Advocate, where the Keanu Reeves character plays an unbeatable lawyer. In the film, it makes sense that the devil would want to recruit him to the legal capital of the universe, New York City, and make him his heir apparent. What the film gets wrong is that the lawyer would resist the side… Read more »
You know the joke about the lawsuit between Heaven and Hell: the Devil mockingly asks God: “Where are you going to get a lawyer?”
I just laugh at the old movies now. The plucky, courageous cop battling the corrupt regime? The reporter that threatens powerful foes with exposure if they persist in their evil ways? The end of the world thwarted by a 200 IQ black hero?
Pbfbfbbfbfbbffffffttt!
Pull my other finger fellas. It has bells on it.
Freud famously said that all dreams were “wish fulfillment”. If he were alive today, I’m certain he’d extend that observation to modern motion pictures featuring Black hero’s.
As bad as most judges are, you are probably correct you would have been better off with a bench trial. Heck, binding arbitration probably would have been better.
In this day and age, the people who land on juries are double-digit IQ “Law and Order” viewers that are easily swayed by emotional rhetoric.
I actually had a really good judge, I’m not blowing smoke when I say I would have won a bench trial. The rulings he made and some of the statements he made in sidebar were very favorable.
Of course, he was a very experienced white guy.
I was slated for empanelment on a drunk driving case. The trial judge first lectured the potential jury pool, then he asked disqualifying questions of us—then the prosecutor, then the defendant’s lawyer. The defendant was a Hispanic—who’d have thunk? The odd part about this was that the White judge bent over backwards to explain to the jury pool aspects of the case and charge quite beneficial to the defendant. For example, that the law did *not* prohibit driving with alcohol in your system—only that you were impaired in driving ability by it. The questions of the jury wrt impartiality were… Read more »
Mercedes Carrera has been in jail awaiting her “swift” trial for about 5 or so years now. I’m not hopeful about Penny.
And Trek is right – men, especially White ones, shouldn’t be putting their asses on the line for a country and culture that openly despises them.
That case is what we used to accuse the Soviets of doing. Five years waiting for trial. Meanwhile, all of their assets have been liquidated, making a defense impossible, even if they get to trial. I have no sympathy for porn actors, but this is third world justice.
Says something about a society when an aerospace engineer quits her job to become a porn actress…
I guarantee you she did not complete one useful project or report in her time as an, “engineer.”
Of course not, no engineer ever does when just starting out. 50 years ago or so, the Hoechst-Celanese plant in, um, maybe Bishop, TX, had an inoperable distillation tower set up outside the parking lot. It was a disaster, designed by a team of newbies with stellar credentials from MIT, CalTech, and I don’t remember where all else, and it never worked. Never could have worked, except on paper. It was set there as a cautionary tale to n00bs and experienced engineers alike.
Eh, someone has to pay the karmic debt for the time the Oxford Union invited Mia Khalifa to give an hour-long lecture.
I thought it was insanely dangerous to interfere with diversity in new york city of all places but talking to the cops without a lawyer & even demonstrating the chokehold he used to the detectives demonstrates a severe lack of awareness. Part of me envies the fact he was somehow unaware of the extreme anarcho tyranny of the city he resides in. I can only imagine how pleasant it must’ve been to be so blissfully ignorant to what the country has become. That had some severe consequences though & even if by some miracle he gets off it was still… Read more »
I mean, he’s a jarhead, nobody said he was smart
Yeah, he fought for The System that would have gotten his legs blown off for Israel, so…
True, its just that every vet I know is extremely right wing & plugged into the conspiracy sphere if not full blown white nationalist. Goes against my typical experience but then again what do I know about people from new york. Every vet I’ve known is from the midwest or the south so in hindsight I was being a bit narrow minded being surprised by this. Still even within that framing its like my mind naturally wonders how the hell he didn’t notice this lol.
He waived his Miranda rights. A massive error!
Like that FBI informant from the Proud Boys who’s in prison for not being at the Capitol on January 6, Perry going down for murder would be totally unjust—and fully deserved.
He “served” and he palled around with the cops. Twice a traitor.
This is correct. If you are truly a dissedent you should view soldiers with the same level of affection you view DMV workers with, at least DMV workers usually haven’t killed anybody trying to defend their country from an invasion.
The stuff they said people said about returning vietnam vets was mostly bullshit but for israel’s current boys in uniform all that stuff would be deserved.
Well we can sit around pissing and moaning about it all we like. The truth of the matter is that the system, as it currently stands – cannot survive. Nor is there anything guys like you and I can do about it except feed it or kill it. The beauty of it is we have a third option – to stand aside and let it kill itself. If I see some woman getting gang banged by a bunch of migrants and undocumented visitors… I will not lift one finger to help. Conservative, sensible women will no longer expose themselves to… Read more »
Well said. At this point the only women a man should be defending are his own. Let them get what they’ve been asking for. Same for the financial elite – they’ve been able to insulate themselves from the damage they cause for too long.
A friend recently told me that pro athletes are having their homes invaded during game time by these foreign gangs. I smiled.
Why wouldn’t the gangs go to those homes?
After all, that’s where the money is!
I can appreciate hyperbole. That said, when it comes down in real life to protecting women, children, the old and the weak you are a white man and presumably a Christian. Those characteristics at a minimum compel you to give a shit and do your duty to your God, your people and to yourself. I trust if, God forbid, my daughters or nieces or any woman were being gang raped in your vicinity you would take action. Again, I can appreciate hyperbole and trust you are not an actual monster
I am not a monster, I am not a martyr, and you can shove your sanctimony up your arse sideways – the Bible is not a suicide pact. Shove your self righteousness, sell your cloak and by a sword because you are going to need it. How about YOU look after YOUR retarded and sinful women?
Insulting people on your side is not a winning strategy.
Add a new wrinkle: doxing. In addition to having to deal with often hostile and ignorant minorities selected as jurors, outside of the courtroom Antifa and other leftwing terrorist organizations know who jurors are and where they live. The odds are pretty good the wannabe communists have put details about Penny’s jurors all over the ‘Net. The odds also are pretty good that the FBI did so if their Antifa allies failed to do so. Another perceived absolute right is a public and open proceeding. How can this provide a fair trial in the modern era? Look for the British… Read more »
Forget the juries. We need better prosecutors. Prosecutors have incredibly broad discretion. No reasonable prosecutor would ever have charged Penny in the first place. The jury wouldn’t matter because there would not be a jury to consider the case. The real problem is the weaponization of the law by prosecutors across the country. Not only do you have politically motivated prosecution, but their discretion is being abused by their failure to prosecute members of the favored group. It is why Neely was even on that train to begin with. In a fair world, he would have been in Rikers where… Read more »
Forget the resume builders called prosecutors. We of the USA need better so-called law*, better philosophers, fewer law schools, and fewer imperialists who want to save the world. In fact, we need to knock Columbia off her feet and to cut off her head while she is struggling to regain her footing. Each of the provinces aka “States” likewise must go, for they are legacy institutions poisoned with the gross fraud to which they have been attached for most or all of their histories. The USA must be swept into the landfill of history with corporate capitalism. === * “this… Read more »
I’d like to agree, but having judiciary being a branch of government is an inherent conflict of interest because the prosecutor is a paid employee of the plaintiff in the case. His paycheck depends on getting satisfaction for his employer, whether or not it is just.
An obviously flawed but better answer that removes the conflict of interest is private arbitration/courts and private “prosecutors”, with the state only authorized to carry out the punishment and/or restitution or to grant clemency.
NO. NO! A thousand times, NO! I am for banning consumer arbitration and I cannot imagine criminal arbitration would be any better than consumer arbitration. Why do you think all the corporations are trying to force consumers into arbitration? Hint: It’s not because it’s better for you. Because the arbitration companies are the paid clients of the corporations. Do you think you can get a fair hearing in front of an arbitrator your opponent is paying for and is an ongoing client of? Furthermore, arbitration is final and cannot be appealed in 99.999999% of cases. They don’t need to follow… Read more »
The problem is not the arbitration, but who gets choice of arbitrators. Yes, corporations (which, remember, would not even exist without the state) are going to choose arbitrators who skew one way, bur why would a consumer choose that venue?
If you really want to help the “little guy”, the first thing you need to do is beat that stupid contractualism idea out of your head. From the time when a serf had to put an X on paper to signify his agreement, the whole point of contractualism was to screw him.
I support ending consumer contracts of adhesion and especially, any contract clause which limits your constitutional rights, like access to the courts we pay for. It’s been an American’s right to file a lawsuit for centuries. If we were to set up criminal arbitration courts, the charged would not have a right to chose his venue, just like prisoners have no right to chose a prison, even in the private prisons. Plus, just like private trash collection, it would be just another scam. You cannot choose whoever you want to pick up your trash. You have to choose from 2… Read more »
“If we were to set up criminal arbitration courts, the charged would not have a right to chose his venue,”
I kept reading to see why that would be a bad thing, and evidently, “scam” is the best you came up with?
Let’s say they took the case to some scam operator, who delivered injustice. It goes to the state. Assuming the state is the competent, just operation of your argument (characteristics of the state not in evidence, I’d note) why wouldn’t they just grant clemency?
George Soros came to this exact same realization about prosecutors.
Just look at what happened in Philly or LA for examples.
Anything we build can and will be used against us by those twisted and hateful enough to do so. The sole solution is permanent separation from those people – and the swift crackdown/banishment of those idealistic fools within the native population who will repeatedly pop up with the same dangerous ideas. Satan never sleeps . . .
I’ve been optimistic about Penny’s chances for a hung jury because even ferals have the sense to be afraid of ferals, thus at least some of any ferals on the jury will probably empathize with the defendant. Ditto for the immigrant, most likely. Deliberations being in their 3rd or 4th day is a good sign. Pessimistic about an acquittal for the reasons Zman and Jack Dodson state. In this particular case, I submit that Penny would be in far greater peril if being judged by a jury full of AWFLs than a jury of feral negros. In other cases, perhaps… Read more »
That’s a good point, very few people are immune to crackhead fatigue, the only exceptions are probably the AWFL demographic you mentioned & fellow drug addicts. I figure anyone on that jury thats been on the subway in the last few years & isn’t one of the immunized groups is going to be at least somewhat sympathetic to Daniel. Hopefully his lawyer picked people who use the subway all the time, the more exposure to psychotic druggie pests the better.
I had a commenter at another blog lambaste me for making a similar point – he/she claimed most who ride the NY subway are “law abiding” workers. LMFAO.
Were now in a situation where someone could in all seriousness argue that someone who has been arrested multiple times for smearing feces in people’s faces isn’t actually a criminal because the charges always get dropped. I’ve actually had this argued to me with the classic “innocent until proven guilty” line thrown in as the cherry on top of the shit cake, so to speak. Used to be people wouldn’t dare make such a ridiculous claim but this sort of blatantly fallacious lawyer style argument is becoming very common now. I didn’t realize it at the time but when the… Read more »
Oh, believe me, I understand. Earlier today I complained to my husband about a Daily Mail headline stating that Amber Heard was ‘expecting’ her second child. Meaning, she used IVF or artificial insemination with some stranger’s sperm and rented a womb. God, I hate the manipulation of language and reasoning and so I hate Klown World with the heat of a thousand suns.
Reminds me of an article a while back with a picture of lena dunham in a bikini & the headline said she was ‘stunning.’ Then of course the comments were all glowing in agreement, naturally anyone who disagreed was censored. The worst part is there’s no escaping it, there’s not one facet of daily life that’s not somehow infected with the subversion to some degree. I especially hate the subtly condescending examples like these, its like being around a pathological liar where you both know everything being said by them is bullshit but its considered a faux pas to call… Read more »
You made me look. Damn you!
Apologies to you & all my fellow helpless morbid curiosity sufferers who just cannot look away. Also for all the people who refused to believe anyone would ever describe a near naked photo of her in that way who looked it up to see if it was true.
Criminal trials are a joke and Ted X has covered torts/malpractice. But civil trials are also a nightmare. In our business dealings, we generally insist on a contract with a “waiver of jury trial” clause. The reasons are obvious: as bad as some judges are, in a business dispute you’re almost always going to be better off with a “bench trial”. Jury trials probably cost the country billions of dollars in higher insurance costs, business frictional costs, legal fees etc, not to mention the obvious loss of social cohesion.
All of the commercial contracts that I have written or approved have very strong arbitration clauses…No one wants to pay a lot of money to try a case in front of a group of idiots? And the bigger the money, the bigger the incentive to arbitrate and/or settle the case….Often both…
Heh, you guys beat me to this point that I repeated above.
I would much rather deal with a professional, well-paid arbitrator than a jury box filled with clowns.
That said, there is a subset of people out there who are outraged about the arbitration clauses many corporations insert in their user agreements.
Is that outrage justified, or are those folks just caught up in romantic notions about jury trials?
A little of both. If Walmart is inserting an arbitration clause on the back of your grocery receipt, that might be a bit much. In b2b dealings, it make sense. In consumer actions, I can understand some outrage, especially if the arbitration fees are split or footed by the loser. If your $800 Sony TV is a lemon and it will cost you $5,000 to fight it, then the arbitration clause is little more than a way to avoid warranty obligations.
Theory aside, in effect “forced arbitration” closes the system, protects its workings from outsiders (who may well be idiots). It’s normal corruption. If you think whoever’s lower on the existing hierarchy should always get screwed—if you’re a happy merchant selling cars that trap people inside and burn them, or selling sawdust as bread, or pajeet code as American—then it’s to the good. No arbitrator will ever stop you…unless some larger competitor wants them to. Allowing juries into the process runs the risk of some corporation somewhere maybe having to pay for its crimes. It never happens, and if it did… Read more »
Arbitrators are making a killing these days with corporate litigation because no one wants to step foot in a court room. It’s expensive and between crazy jurors and moonbat judges, a good outcome is a remote possibility.
The question comes in, who picks the arbitrator? I like the system where you pick someone, and they pick someone—and then both those picks settle upon an arbitrator!
Depends on how the arbitration clause is written. Can pick them pretty much any way you want. Most b2b will include minimum qualifications or picked from an industry identified group (healthcare, intellectual property, etc.).
Jury trials are actually rare. Most cases are plea bargained. A few years ago, a local, long-time Superior Court judge retired. A reporter asked him what percentage of defendants in criminal trials are guilty. His reply: they are all guilty. They went to trial because their crime or criminal history was so egregious that their lawyers could not get a lenient plea bargain. With a trial, they might get a sympathetic jury or a some error that justifies an appeal or re-trial.
Depends on the chief prosecutor of the district. We had one years ago who was extraordinarily hard nosed. Everyone went to trial. He won in 95%+ of the cases. I’m sure he cost the public a bundle, but no one complained as to cost. 😉
“Harrison Bergeron” has turned out to be a depressingly prescient bit of fiction.
Yep…Kurt Vonnegut saw the future very clearly….Cat’s Cradle also effectively satirizes the world we live in….
Reading this thread also reminded me of the chaotic courthouse scene in Idiocracy. Who knew even 20 years ago that our society’s institutions would turn into such jokes?
As I recall with Rittenhouse, at least one and possible two women on the jury held out for two or three days until some idiot from MSNBC tried to follow the jury back to their hotel to dox them. That trial was much closer than it should have been and without the old white guy judge would have been even worse. There are signs New York is going to correct at least slightly. The mayor who is trying to cozy up to Trump to stay out of jail made some positive noises about Penny. I would imagine the murder of… Read more »
‘The civil rights revolution was an act of revenge against the capable and it is reaching its logical end.’ It was a disaster of iniquity and celebrated tribal resentments. But it was a top-down imposition of the elite classes, not a grass-roots movement of the ‘oppressed’. Once JFK was outta the way — and the National Point bloodily made by our handlers — LBJ and his associates took over. CRA ’64 and the Immigration Act of 1965 followed quickly, sealing the doom that the 19th Amendment began. Once I realized (the hard way) that the courts were full of moralistic… Read more »
“The civil rights revolution was an act of revenge against the capable and it is reaching its logical end.”
A brilliant, single sentence summation of the current political landscape. Nicely Done Zman!
https://thezman.com/wordpress/?p=33137#comment-435130
maybe Whites will fight when they are starving in the last corner they get pushed into. maybe. all so depressing.
The jury thing is important as it is one of the foundation pillars of society. According to anti-racists, an all White jury must be suspect because Whites can not be trusted to judge non-Whites impartially. But Whites are expected to receive justice from non-Whites? It doesn’t make sense. Regardless of which way the bias swings either the victim or the perpetrator can not expect impartial judgement to be done in a multi-racial [multi-identity] society. Who can believe in such a system?
“A jury of peers” is really “A jury of people who *should* be your peers”, which means a jury can never be White.
Ramsey Paul has a video on the prosecutor. A Jewish freak, lesbian, daughter of “Holocaust survivor.”
Everything is a damned freak show. Just google the name Dafna Yoran and take a look at her.
Yoran is an Israeli-born, Jewish, anti-White, ‘Restorative Justice’ Communist lesbian married to a Peruvian BLM activist.
Yoran’s claims to fame include being the first attorney to successfully prosecute a “White supremacist” as a “domestic terrorist” in the United States,…
Yoran’s father is the author of ‘The Defiant: A Story of Jewish Vengeance.’
Yoran has continuously referred to Daniel Penny as “the White man” throughout his trial, assuming that the jurors share her view that “White man” means “Nazi”…
Because there are Dafna Yorans everywhere in the system.
https://coldfury.com/WRSA/WRSA-WP/
Good gods this woman is Skeletor’s ugly sister
It looks like an active case of leprosy – melted, ugly mug.
The phrase “jury of your peers” has its roots in British legal tradition, the Magna Carta, specifically. Brits being Brits, they use words differently than Americans. To Brits, “your peers” means “your aristocracy”. America rejected the idea of aristocracy by birth, and instead tried to implement aristocracy by achievement, a meritocracy.
“This will never do!” shrieked the proto-egalitarians, and their answer, as with their latter-day equivalents, was to redefine “peer.” We went from juries of the smartest, most accomplished men in the community to whomever can fog a mirror.
Today’s post is yet another example of why we are not going to talk our way out of the mess we’re in. Pissing and moaning about the present societal insanity is not going to change it. Daniel Penny took affirmative tangible action to prevent a crack addict from doing harm to innocents locked within a confined subway car. He was not wrong to do so. We the people have the same obligation with respect to our corrupt system of governance. This problem is soon to become existential and only tangible action can save us. You are either part of the… Read more »
Well Tom, I think you hit the nail right on the head. Normie and Griller have to stop running away to the couch or the patio BBQ – sure it’s all fine and dandy to see big Donk cities devolve into the planet of the apes – but if you sit on your hands and do nothing about it… pretty soon the apes will start showing up in your town. Not trying to preach – but I am the voice of experience. We come from leftist hive families and they eventually destroyed themselves. What they’ve done to their families, they… Read more »
How do you reconcile the various positions you’ve staked out in just this one post? Some seem quite contradictory, like ragging on people to do something, while in another you say you would not do something to help someone being raped.
The typical normie lament when faced with dire reality is to whine “well, who am I supposed to shoot?” and then go back to the couch. That attitude makes you easy pickens when they go fully feral and start sucker punching little old ladies on the street. It’s your duty to know what to do when the time comes. That’s what your brain is for.
“The typical normie lament when faced with dire reality is to whine “well, who am I supposed to shoot?” and then go back to the couch.“
And how does that differ from @Filthie’s position, which is to ignore someone being raped? In what respect does that differ from going back to the couch?
The real world doesn’t always balance and zero out Steve. Especially these days. There will always be contradictions, exceptions, and paradoxes. My faith decrees that I must render unto Caesar…but I don’t bow down to him.
The reality of our day is that we can hang together or hang separately. If we must hang separately… I fully intend to watch the other guy swing first. And when it’s my turn…I will take some with me when I go.
Agreed. Same-same. BTW, reread that section on Caesar, and keep in mind what kinds of coins were clean under temple law, so which coins they should have brought. By their own temple law, they declared Caesar their god.
I’m just a little disheartened that you don’t extend the same to the “grillers”. They are enjoying life and family while they can, and, presumably, are also only coming to the aid of their own families. Just like you and I, at least for now.
I am sympathetic to this sentiment, but white people who stand up in this way will be made examples of whenever identified. Whites are the only group to whom the law still applies with ruthless certainty. So each man must ask himself – am I willing to go to prison and be bankrupted to help maintain order and save the system from itself? All while it turns his wife and children against him with uninterrupted full-spectrum propaganda. You protect what’s yours because you must, but all beyond that is on its own. If a jurisdiction could be built where sanity… Read more »
Bob Dylan nailed it as a pig circus years ago. Just a continuation of the same old same old!
“Of course he’s guilty. Just look at him!”
I though Idiocracy was supposed to be a spoof set 500 years in the future, not a documentary about present day America.
Diana Moon Glampers says hi. Also, she will blast you with a shotgun…
Penny is most likely to be convicted on all counts and spend the rest of his life in prison, the prosecution would have done things to save face if they were not confident of a conviction. It will now be open season for every thug and crazy to attack people in the subway or any place else in NYC. And this is exactly what the City Prosecutors want. They chose to charge Penny with the max instead of some bs misdemeanor that would amount to time served in jail or something. The ideal city that Alvin Bragg who wants to… Read more »
You are right to worry about Alaska, but no war is needed in the plot of the story. The Russian Empire’s claim to the land was very weak in Seward’s day, and you can’t legitimately sell what you don’t own. The Russians have a wedge issue here to develop into an international crisis. It’s very much to their advantage to roll back the Western empire in that part of N. America. A problem is preserving their claim on northwestern Asia. They have a reputation, arguably deserved, for being less harsh toward “indigenous” peoples. So perhaps they have a fair chance… Read more »
Meanwhile, the craven Left backs off when Muslims (rightly, in this case) assert themselves:
Manchester United scrap rainbow jackets after Mazraoui cites religious objections | Soccer | The Guardian
Man, is this guy getting hosed. This BS should never have come to trial. Now he’s on knife’s edge. I hope to hell he is rightfully acquitted, but I’m not confident – at all. What a dirtbag country this place has become, with an equally dirtbag legal system to boot.
I’m skeptical that the left opposes the death penalty qua death penalty. After all wasn’t Czar Nick given the death penalty?
When called on for jury duty, one should go, just for the one time experience. It’s not something you can buy a ticket for. Strangely I have never been called up, but I know others who have been called many times.. I don’t begrudge anyone who has done jury duty once for trying to get out of a repeat experience. My wife was on a criminal trial jury for attempted murder. She gave me a run-down of the case, and it was pretty obvious the guy was guilty of trying to kill his girlfriend. When it came to deliberations, some… Read more »
I got called in to Jury Duty last year at this time, even though I pointed out on my questionnaire when it got to the question “Do you know any one who works in law enforcement or government?” I answered “Yes, my wife, a lawyer for the State Department of Child Services.” I get in the cattle call and we watched a video that I swear to the heavens above could have been titled “Jury Trials for Kindergartners“. Did you know the people trying and defending the accused are lawyers, sometimes called attorneys? Did you know the person in the… Read more »
My wife was on a criminal trial jury for attempted murder. She gave me a run-down of the case, and it was pretty obvious the guy was guilty of trying to kill his girlfriend. When it came to deliberations, some were not convinced. Then one of the jurors came up with a completely silly train of “logic” that convinced the simpletons to convict. So, Justice was served, but only by chance. Seems like a helluva way to run a legal system. The Lovely 🥰 Mrs. did jury trials for Insurance Defense. Some of the stories she told me of the… Read more »
Anyone heard of Genrik yagoda? He had a weird conception of criminal justice some 90 years ago
The maxim that anything that hints of discrimination is immoral has resulted in jury selection becoming little more than drawing names from a hat.
Dear sir, it is far worse than that. It is not random at all – should you use a peremptory challenge in a manner deemed racist, sexist or anyist, the judge can nullify your choice. Thank our SCOTUS for that idiocy that puts the “right to be on a jury” ahead of the rights of the persons with actual, real skin in the outcome. What f#ckheads.
The last time I was a juror was a double murder case. A black woman had shot to death her philandering husband and her teenaged daughter (using his pistol [he was a security guard]). The case was unusual in that the crime had been committed years earlier and the defendant had been in a looney bin during that time. I thought she was a victim of her psychiatrist, who had put her on Prozac, after which her behavior became bizarre, culminating in the shooting of her beloved daughter (the shooting of her husband was not so bizarre). Her lawyer did… Read more »
Any lawyers out there: does the concept of “a jury of your peers” come from English Common Law (which is customary and may have been assumed by the 18th century founders)?
IANAL, but here’s what the Magna Carta had to say on it:
“No freeman is to be taken or imprisoned or disseised of his free tenement or of his liberties or free customs, or outlawed or exiled or in any way ruined, nor will we go against such a man or send against him save by lawful judgement of his peers or by the law of the land.”
They created two different ways of convicting someone — either the king (“law of the land”) or some arbitrary number of nobles (“peers” — more than one) rendering judgement.
[…] ZMan does some parsing. […]
If I were going to court today, I’d make sure my public attorney’s face was that of a very dark-skinned Hispanic female — and all the real, backup lawyers were competent white men. Given the affirmative action environment prevailing in today’s world, you can count on your minority lawyer being terrible — but getting better treatment in the courtroom by everyone including the jury. Look at the white female prosecutor of the O.J. Simpson trial. The black women on the jury hated her, and freed Simpson because of that. Have the smiling face of a minority. And the thinking brains… Read more »
Agreed – but purely on a tactical level. If you have to play on their turf you are probably already dead. If you have to make your last stand – you will want to make it based on the terrain you find yourself in…