No Tomorrows

All human societies have some form of belief system, usually based in the supernatural or in unexplained mysteries. People who study these things think that belief is one of the earliest modern human traits. Language and religion, the formalization of belief, most likely evolved together. That certainly makes sense. Religion has always been a handy store of knowledge and language is the way in which it can be transported over time and place. They are complimentary.

That is speculative, but what is not speculative is that all known people have had something we would consider to be a faith system. Primitive people have primitive belief systems, usually based in natural phenomenon like the seasons and elements. American Indians have a whole collection of deities based in nature. More complex societies create more complex myths and belief structures. The Greeks and Romans had complex systems. Christianity is a rich and complex belief system.

We in the modern West tend to think we have moved past this stuff. The educated classes, while not willing to say they are atheists, scoff at the religious. The most you will get from the upper classes is the line about being spiritual, but not religious. The truth is, Western elites are believers like all people in all times, maybe more so. It is just that their beliefs are informal and ad hoc. The people toting canvas sacks to the market are doing so because our better say nature demands it of us.

Belief systems describe a people. The ancient Egyptians had a complex belief system like many ancient people. Their religion, however, was unique in that it was entirely focused on the afterlife. They did not make sacrifices and pray for the here and now. They built monuments, complex burial systems and temples in order to prepare the living for the after life. There is a good argument that this focus on the after life is what allowed the Egyptians to keep their culture going for 3,000 years.

On the other hand, the Greeks were not overly concerned about the after life. Their focus was on the here and now. The gods interfered in the lives of men, so it made sense to focus devotion on swaying the gods to act on your behalf or against the interests of your enemies. The Greeks did have the concept of an afterlife, but it was not the focus of their belief system. Immortality for man was possible by having sons, who would carry his name, or dying for his polis, which would live on and remember his name.

The Greeks may have been more concerned with the present, when it came time to worshipping the gods, but they had a nice long run. It was not as if they were hedonists, living only in the moment. Even so, this focus on the now had some odd results. For instance, we know just about every Egyptian ruler and his deeds. We even have some of their corpses. The Dorian Greeks, on the other hand, burned their kings, as well as any record of them. We know nothing about them as a result.

This brings up an important point about our present age. The cult of Gaia, for example, is long on rhetoric about the future, but its focus is on present virtue. The greens are not trying preserve the environment for future generations. They are hoping their efforts snuff out future generations. The same is true of anti-racism and multiculturalism. These are all about the present. Calling them suicide cults is useful rhetoric, but in fact our virtuous rulers do not think past tomorrow. it is all about grace today.

This is particularly true with regards to migration. Nationalists like to cook up complex theories as to why our rulers are wedded to the idea of mass immigration. Some say it is cheap labor. Other say it is cheap votes. Still others see it as spite. All of those things are true, but the real motivation is virtue. Instead of a public ceremony where they sacrifice a bull or consecrate a church, inviting in the poor and downtrodden is the big public act of virtue. The consequences are down the road. The grace is today.

It is not just vanity. We are the first people to have no conception of an afterlife. Even the Greeks believed in the after life and they believed there was judgement of souls. They may not have made that the focus of their faith, but they still believed there was something beyond this life. This spiritual hopelessness of Western elites may be why the Cloud People couch everything in terms of personal fulfillment and self-actualization. It is a way of crossing the river Styx without actually believing in it.

The nuttiness of modern elite culture may simply be a neurosis arising from the conflict between the natural desire of man to be remembered, colliding with the lack of any reason to be remembered. Even the humblest of men will carve his name into a tree or scratch his name on his prison wall. “I was here” is the primal scream. Today, that impulse has no outlet. The lonely barren spinster yells “I was here” and the only thing that happens is the cat stirs and then goes back to sleep.

Maybe this is it for us. Maybe there is no tomorrow for the West.

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rich whiteman
rich whiteman
7 years ago

Maybe many of us believe in an afterlife. Maybe many of us are desperately praying for miracles, while we watch our kids dying of cancer and talking in their sleep to dead relatives.
Maybe, maybe, it’s real and the reason we’ve “created” these beliefs is because they are real.
I have my hopes; and they are stronger than no hope.

Joey Junger
Joey Junger
Reply to  rich whiteman
7 years ago

There have been many medical studies on prayer and its efficacy. I’m agnostic but I find atheists to be far more pushy with their belief systems than most Christians. Christianity’s proscriptions against homosexuality and general irresponsible sexual behavior are born out by most medical research on the subject. “Nothing’s bullshit that works,” as the writer Charles Bukowski said. Mormonism may look funny from the outside, but Mormons have large healthy families and create stable sane and pleasant communities in a world collapsing around them, so I’m not laughing.

smitty1e
Reply to  Joey Junger
7 years ago

The unintentional hilarity of this post is the tacit assertion that rationality bounds the scope of human existence.

Those of faith, while also rational, know better.

Issac
Issac
Reply to  smitty1e
7 years ago

I’d suggest the corollary, which is that human existence bounds the scope of “rationality,” so far as humans perceive it, and they are often deceived by their own short-hand versions of rationality. As Z suggests, Religious Faith is an inter-generational communication system. It ensures through writ and ritual that subsequent people, separated by centuries or more, will still have critical heuristics on living well (adaptive behavior). It’s obviously imperfect as those heuristics are informed by the nature of the people who developed them and the environment they were in at the time, but any such wisdom should only be dismissed… Read more »

smitty1e
Reply to  Issac
7 years ago

>As Z suggests, Religious Faith is an inter-generational communication system.

Still laughing. To say that there is no Absolute Truth is like saying that there is no absolute zero, or gravity, AFAICT.

Issac
Issac
Reply to  smitty1e
7 years ago

Your ancestors imparted the wisdom of a thousand generations to you through religion and it was your faith that kept the connection alive. That is how religion and faith interact. Why would you cheapen this by claiming absolute truth is just some sterile law of nature to be quantified and applied? It’s not as though Absolute Truth becomes anything else simply because it was imparted through mortal flesh over many generations.

smitty1e
Reply to  Issac
7 years ago

> Why would you cheapen this by claiming absolute truth is just some sterile law of nature to be quantified and applied?

Why do you call it sterile? Looks quite vibrant and dynamic to me.

Issac
Issac
Reply to  smitty1e
7 years ago

Anything deracinated and removed from its human context is sterilized. The result of this sterilization is Vatican II, Dispensationalism, Gay Weddings, Refugees Welcome, etc.

smitty1e
Reply to  Issac
7 years ago

I would offer that the human context occurs within a broader one.
As I posited initially: “the unintentional hilarity of this post is the tacit assertion that rationality bounds the scope of human existence.”

Alzaebo
Alzaebo
Reply to  smitty1e
7 years ago

Please tell us this wondrous Absolute Truth!
And no, not some silly theory, like the Theory of Gravity.

smitty1e
Reply to  Alzaebo
7 years ago

The carpenter.

bad guest
bad guest
Reply to  Issac
7 years ago

The Jungian clinical psychologist/university professor Jordan Peterson is currently enjoying internet fame espousing the same basic ideas about these stories.

That they’re myths, but myths to be taken seriously because they contain truth and wisdom distilled through the ages.

He’s put a series of lectures on interpretation of the Old Testament as instructive myth up on YouTube:
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL22J3VaeABQD_IZs7y60I3lUrrFTzkpat

Joey Junger
Joey Junger
Reply to  smitty1e
7 years ago

The deliberate smarm of this post is smarmy.

Karl McHungus
Karl McHungus
Reply to  Joey Junger
7 years ago

you might want to read up on birth defect rates in the mormon community — due to in-breeding. i do admire the way they stick together and help each other, all the time (and not just when someone has misfortune).

joe_mama
joe_mama
Reply to  Karl McHungus
7 years ago

It’s more a Utah thing from the legacy of early Polygamy.

Luddite
Luddite
Reply to  Joey Junger
7 years ago

During my time in Africa, I found voodoo and its shamans/priests held powerful sway over the believers. It was then that I realized that christianity, like voodoo, only works on those who believe in it.

iFrank
iFrank
Reply to  rich whiteman
7 years ago

as a poet said, “to live without hope is to dance without music.”

Severian
7 years ago

Camus (I think) said the only real problem in philosophy is the problem of suicide. As in, why don’t we all commit it? Typical Froggy posturing (ahh, l’ennui!) but he inadvertently made a point — the entire SJW catechism comes from vapid people discovering that life has a point after all … and they missed it. Whether or not there’s ultimately any higher purpose to life, we all sure ACT like there is; life without “God” (the usual shorthand for this) really is nothing but despair, as Nietzsche — yeah, the guy these idiots love to quote — realized full… Read more »

Toddy Cat
Toddy Cat
7 years ago

“Maybe there is no tomorrow for the West.”

Perhaps not for the West as currently constituted, and given what we see around us, there probably shouldn’t be. But the West we see around us, the West as currently constituted, is not the only possible West.

“But they were men who built the city, not gods or demons. They were men. I remember the dead man’s face. They were men who were here before us. We must build again…”

Caleo
Caleo
Reply to  Toddy Cat
7 years ago

Excellent comment. The West is obviously in a terminal phase, but that doesn’t mean western, meaning white, people have to die off with it. There are many paths available to intelligent, productive white folks. It will take a massive effort of the collective will, and a re- tribalization, of sorts, for European peoples to come through the other side of this. I do not doubt for one moment that remnants of the West will circle the wagons and create new societies. European peoples have gone through these types of collapse scenarios before and flourished. The end of the last Ice… Read more »

Tekton
Tekton
Reply to  Caleo
7 years ago

“ But Jeshurun waxed fat, and kicked: thou art waxen fat, thou art grown thick, thou art covered with fatness; then he forsook God which made him, and lightly esteemed the Rock of his salvation.” Deut 13:15 “Jeshurun” is a pseudonym for the ‘last days’ kingdom of Israel. The Pilgrims and our ancestry–those who established this nation recognized who that was… Because we have forgotten we are the Stone Kingdom of the book of Daniel. We have lost sight of what Plymouth Rock meant to our fathers who hewed this nation out of a howling wilderness. We no longer call… Read more »

Tim Newman
7 years ago

I wrote about this very same thing, and reached very similar conclusions, last July: For whatever reason, every society in existence has worshipped something or other, and this has been the case for millennia. There is something about the human condition which makes belief in higher beings very attractive, and it’s probably better just to accept this rather than argue logic with a few billion people who disagree. … So with Soviet-style socialism discredited, non-religious people had to find something else to believe in, and that was liberal politics. … I find modern politics, particularly in the west where Christianity… Read more »

Old Codger
Old Codger
7 years ago

FIFY! As its much more likely:

“Maybe there is no tomorrow for the West’s Cultural elites.”

Partial cultural suicide by arrogance and credentialism is what they, the Cloud People, are bringing upon themselves.

Dirt people will continue to work their way through it, valuing wisdom over educated credentialism.

Joey Junger
Joey Junger
7 years ago

If leftism is a religion, I think it’s in its most corrupt, least credible moment like Holy See when Luther nailed his theses to the door and Rome’s grip was challenged. Indulgences certainly seem to be about how the elite views their charity works (it got to the point before the counter-reformation that rich Catholics could literally pay others to do their atonement for them, just give some poor guy money to perform your pilgrimage and you’d reap the spiritual benefit). Every left-winger with a room temperature IQ (the sort who read Huffington Post or watch Colbert) still tries to… Read more »

Issac
Issac
Reply to  Joey Junger
7 years ago

“Buffet’s the only one of the aforementioned three who isn’t just a lottery winner/thief/opportunist”

Buffet is very much a lottery winner by-birth and political opportunist.

miforest
Member
7 years ago

for the sake of my 3 young adult children, I hope there is a future. We are catholic (john Paul type, not Francis type) , so I believe there is .

Tax Slave
Tax Slave
Reply to  miforest
7 years ago

You’re not alone. I’m a former Catholic seminarian now with a family and I pray everyday for the future of my son.

Bunny
Bunny
7 years ago

Cheer up, Zman, wherefore such a pouty pants? There is no Christendom (The West) without Christianity and we have been running on just the fumes for quite s while now. There can be no Christian society without Christianity, that’s not how it works, that’s not how any of this works. Sorry, materialists. http://www.theimaginativeconservative.org/2016/07/materialism-false-god-modern-science.html “So do not fear, for I am with you; do not be dismayed, for I am your God. I will strengthen you and help you; I will uphold you with my righteous right hand.” Perhaps there will be a remnant. Perhaps if we crack out our rosaries… Read more »

StanFL
Reply to  Bunny
7 years ago

I think what you said is that the West needs a new religion. Exactly true. Let’s invent it.

Bunny
Bunny
Reply to  StanFL
7 years ago

Restoration. One does not simply invent a new religion. Unless you’re Mary Baker Eddy, Joseph Smith or God. “If I am to discuss what is wrong, one of the first things that are wrong is this: the deep and silent modern assumption that past things have become impossible. There is one metaphor of which the moderns are very fond; they are always saying, ‘You can’t put the clock back.’ The simple and obvious answer is ‘You can.’ A clock, being a piece of human construction, can be restored by the human finger to any figure or hour. In the same… Read more »

Tax Slave
Tax Slave
Reply to  StanFL
7 years ago

There is one right in front of our faced.

Member
7 years ago

The fall of the West coincides with the loss of objective truth. If there is no objective truth, no clear right or wrong, then EVERYTHING is on the table. You can do anything you want to anyone you want because you only need to ask yourself for permission. The Simpsons nailed this years ago (1993) with their “Be Like the Boy” episode. http://pixa.club/en/the-simpsons/season-5/epizod-7-bart-s-inner-child The relevant part starts at 12:00. To quote Lisa, “This is madness. He’s just peddling a bunch of easy answers!” If you want to understand America in 2017, just watch from 12:00 to the end. Some fascinating… Read more »

Bunny
Bunny
Reply to  hokkoda
7 years ago

“Now the seniors in the back-we like Roy”, lol! Ah, the glamour of evil. Being transgressive is not as much fun when everyone else is doing it, too.

bad guest
bad guest
Reply to  hokkoda
7 years ago

Dostoevsky also nailed it in The Brothers Karamazov in 1879, when Ivan observed, ” If There Is No God -Then Everything Is Permitted’

rien
7 years ago

Yes, this leads me to an idea I am trying to develop these days: The biggest belief out there today (in the west) is not nature not religion but “Democracy”.

Member
7 years ago

I would dispute that “More complex societies create more complex myths, legends and belief structures.” Materialist society inevitably devolves into superstition. The Soviets were deeply interested in ESP and UFOs; and look at your modern American space fanboys who believe in an imminent space-faring destiny led by Elon Musk. They read “The Moon Is a Harsh Mistress” and now believe that the close confines of a crowded colony in an airless place is the perfect breeding-ground for a libertarian utopia. Meanwhile, Washington socialite Sally Quinn puts her witchcraft skills at the service of DC matrons, and puts the whammy on… Read more »

Al from da Nort
Al from da Nort
Reply to  DarrylHarb
7 years ago

Derryl; Another recent ersatz religious variant is attributing personality and agency to vast (‘the universe’) or obviously impersonal and ill-defined entities/concepts such as ‘nature’, ‘evolution’, etc. That way elitists evidently suppose that they can have it both ways: Acknowledge the ageless human sense/instinct that there are extra-human, superior forces and intelligences in the universe while avoiding needing to actually bend the knee to any of them. And, as a big bonus, they can pretend to speak for that entity without any fear of objective refutation. This is because, so long as they avoid specific, near term*, prophecies, their claims are… Read more »

Ryan
Ryan
Reply to  DarrylHarb
7 years ago

Maybe civilizations operate on a complexity budget. We spend so much complexity on politics, economics and technology that by the time we get around to religion and philosophy we have so little complexity left we can’t manage anything beyond vacuous gaia worship. Contrast that with the ancient Egyptians. “The Nile floods, we grow wheat.” OK, put a check in the box next to survival. Then they can use the rest of the complexity budget to develop a religion with hundreds of gods functioning as avatars of concepts and a language that weaves the narratives into their daily lives. They can… Read more »

James LePore
Member
7 years ago

The more unintelligent a man is, the less mysterious existence seems to him. Arthur Schopenhauer

After your death you will be what you were before your birth. Arthur Schopenhauer

el_baboso
Member
7 years ago

Birthrates are at or are trending to sub-replacement levels everywhere except sub-Saharan Africa. Each region has a different narrative to explain the birth dearth, based on it’s culture and residual religion, but the outcomes transcend race, IQ, history, religion, etc. Birth control and female emancipation and substantial mass media penetration seem to be necessary conditions for the demographic contraction to begin. If the depopulation trends continue, then the birth death will continue until one or all of the three pre-conditions disappear. At some point, population contraction/imbalance means that civilization can no longer provide the technical means to manufacture birth control,… Read more »

Alzaebo
Alzaebo
Reply to  el_baboso
7 years ago

We’ve quadrupled our numbers in two generations, perhaps we’re seeing a natural contraction. Markets call this a correction.

A safer world at a less frenzied pace?
OK by me. The insistence of “growth, growth, growth!” is crowding the Petri dish.

Issac
Issac
Reply to  Alzaebo
7 years ago

This is an apt observation. Population figures were, arguably, due for correction and particularly so with the rise in resource consumption per individual. Having said that, it’s quite important to discern population inertia and the meta-level problems of having leading and lagging population figures across the human racial spectrum. There is a positive significance to a stabilizing human population in aggregate. There is also a very negative significance to a human population 75% of which would have been considered mentally retarded by recent pre-political-correctness standards. The ideal makeup of humanity is a philosophical question, but in real physical terms we… Read more »

Member
Reply to  Alzaebo
7 years ago

The dish would get a whole lot less crowded if we stopped bringing first world medicine into third world hell holes. Not suggesting active genocide, but our medicine and open hearts are literally saving the hordes from themselves so they can flock north and destroy us.

if we are going to export anything, it should be culture, reason, and colonial management for the extraction of resources and subjugation of the people to create civil societies.

the benefits of first world advances should not be allowed until AFTER domestication.

Ursula
Ursula
Reply to  A_Livingstone
7 years ago

The only things the West should be exporting to Africa are birth control and free abortion services. Sell it to them by explaining that they’re hallmarks of Western sophistication, just as our elites and institutions teach us.

james wilson
james wilson
Reply to  A_Livingstone
7 years ago

And the great majority of their food.

A.T. Tapman
Member
Reply to  A_Livingstone
7 years ago

Stop sending food and ag assistance, the strong will eat the weak. This is what winning looks like.

Bunny
Bunny
Reply to  Alzaebo
7 years ago

Hasn’t “conventional wisdom” always been that without growth there is no prosperity and perhaps even economic collapse?

Karl McHungus
Karl McHungus
Reply to  Bunny
7 years ago

no, that is a 19th century (onwards) notion

Alzaebo
Alzaebo
Reply to  Karl McHungus
7 years ago

Yes, the smart guys never figured how to profit from degrowth: it starts with lesser costs.

Teapartydoc
Member
7 years ago

Seeing a lot of talk like this here and there. Maybe we need to dig up Robespierre and his cult of the supreme being after the revolution.

Or maybe just genocide the libs like they’ve been doing to us.

notsothoreau
notsothoreau
7 years ago

I think you can add to this the effects of the digital age. There won’t be much left behind by modern man. No notes, pictures, and we certainly can’t have any statues! Plastic doesn’t age well either.

Rhino
Rhino
7 years ago

They don’t believe in tomorrow because thinking about tomorrow keeps you from doing whatever you would most like to do today.

Amateur Brain Surgeon
Amateur Brain Surgeon
7 years ago

Language and religion, the formalization of belief, most likely evolved together. That certainly makes sense. Religion has always been a handy store of knowledge and language is the way in which it can be transported from one generation to the next. From an evolutionary perspective, it makes sense for both to coexist. Evolution is a false faith and one way we can see that is so is the way evolutionist attribute teleology to a system of mutations and random selection, that is, a pretend system that excludes purpose. How can one claim such a system makes sense when even the… Read more »

Eclectic Esoteric
Eclectic Esoteric
7 years ago

Belief systems are rooted in the common belief of another existence prior to this one, a presupposed unknown. Our ability to form an abstraction and bring it into the third dimension validates this “belief”. Without this function, there would be no concept of a past or future, only the here and now. It is in this inner space the past is revealed and the future unfolds. Knowledge is the currency of the power to create reality, increased exponentially by the merging of minds with a common goal. Barren cat ladies are waiting for us to make their world a better… Read more »

A.B. Prosper
A.B. Prosper
7 years ago

There was a West of a different sort long before Christianity. Its not exactly what we are used too but it lasted centuries and worked well enough If we can get over the space between loss of our old religion and its assumptions and the natural formation of a different one, we’ll be fine Look at it this way Christendom was already waning but the 1600’s which is what 600 years without paganism , the Greek, Roman and Celtic lasted even longer before they too ran dry Its a natural cycle and once the hump is passed we’ll get by… Read more »

Leon
Leon
7 years ago

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rDPj5zI66LA
Love the site.
The lefts total lack of awe keeps amazing me. We might be totaly alone!

De Ferrers
De Ferrers
7 years ago

Read Ernest Becker’s denial of death. He called this urge the “immortality project”, which has been transformed from the religious to the material. Although he pointed to stuff like Marxism, I think he would have been horrified by the even stranger course it has taken now.

The book is profound if very depressing.

Member
Reply to  De Ferrers
7 years ago

Becker is good. Eric Voegelin goes into more detail on the magical thinking of modern people, who use symbols as if they are objects. See his brilliant New Science of Politics.

Ripple
Ripple
7 years ago

Plenty of SWPL lefty types hold Eastern beliefs in karma and reincarnation.

PropagandaHacker
7 years ago

what you have said is essentially correct, but you do not follow through. You peeled one layer of the onion. Peel the next! Yes, our leaders, our elite seek to be virtuous. But who or what determines what is virtuous? And what forces made that determination? And what are the effects of being virtuous or non-virtuous? Let us peel this next onion layer together. Are you ready? Great. Things happen in this universe for a reason. If an apple falls from a tree, the force that causes its movement is called gravity. Cause and effect. Forces. Effects. What forces caused… Read more »

Karl McHungus
Karl McHungus
7 years ago

ot: Zman, what’s your take on the weinstein take-down? that bastard looks like he is one more piece of bad news away from topping himself. looks like he will pull the temple down around himself, too, judging by Affleck and Damon getting sucked in so quickly.

StanFL
7 years ago

To be extremely explicit, religions are created by small groups of individuals with some purpose in mind. The details of the religion have to ensure that others will be motivated to spread it, and help it expand its numbers; bright people can do that. If you don’t understand the reasons these small groups had to take the trouble to start a particular religion, you will not understand its evolution or its downfall.

Amateur Brain Surgeon
Amateur Brain Surgeon
Reply to  StanFL
7 years ago

Cosmogony is evolutionary? If that is true, then why did Darwin, who stole the theory of evolution from poor old Alfred Russell Wallace, end-up with essentially the same cosmogony as the Navajos even though Darwin had none of the same mutations and traits etc as they did and was born thousands of miles away. Evolution is a false religion and there is not the least bit of evidence for the development of either the idea of religion or language but men have been persuaded that evolution is a fact and to deny it means you are, well, an ape. Tom… Read more »

Anonymous White Male
Anonymous White Male
7 years ago

Man will always substitute one religion for another. Take Darwinism, Marxism, or Freudianism. With the exception of natural selection, there are no facts that can be even anecdotally proven with the Theory of Evolution. And everyone of those theoretical maxims was provided by a finite man. Marxism has had over 160 years to show that there are any results that show the accuracy of another finite man’s opinions. And Freudianism….don’t get me started. How did Freud gain access to the “Big Cosmic Book of the Symbolism of Dreams”, the one in which a cigar is symbolically a penis? Or what… Read more »

Pimpkin\'s nephew
Pimpkin\'s nephew
Reply to  Anonymous White Male
7 years ago

There comes a time when just shutting up, and listening to the life around you, becomes an argument. For what? Well, that’s up to you.

Read Walker Percy’s “Lost in the Cosmos”, have a drink, and calm down.

Christopher Chantrill
Christopher Chantrill
7 years ago

Yes. What a joke. We don’t have God any more but we have had militant secular religions that reach around the world that make all previous religions look like Sunday outings.

Pimpkin\'s nephew
Pimpkin\'s nephew
7 years ago

Just thought I’d chirp in, to suggest that we all read (or, re-read, for I wouldn’t want to presume) Christopher Lasch’s last book, the 1996 “The Revolt of the Elites”.

Report back with any changes of heart.

Calfcreek_2
Calfcreek_2
7 years ago

Why would one not look at the fact that all ancient peoples worshiped some sort of deity, make one believe in same?

Karl McHungus
Karl McHungus
Reply to  Calfcreek_2
7 years ago

because one has 2000 years of science? and because there is no evidence that any of the religions are anything but man made constructs?

Ryan
Ryan
Reply to  Calfcreek_2
7 years ago

From some guy named John Crossan: “My point, once again, is not that those ancient people told literal stories and we are now smart enough to take them symbolically, but that they told them symbolically and we are now dumb enough to take them literally.” If you dig into the roots of the ancient religions, no one worshiped any deities. They conceived of the world through avatars, anthropomorphized fundamental concepts. This is true of Egypt, Hinduism, even pre-reformation Catholicism (angels, archanges, demons and the like). An old internet friend wrote on his blog the other day “Now someone might say,… Read more »

Caleo
Caleo
Reply to  Ryan
7 years ago

I would up vote this 100x if I could. Many moderns fool themselves into believing that the ancients, or at least the “civilized” ones, actually had a literal belief in the forces they worshipped. The peasants probably did, but the literate elites knew better, and they were also well aware of how powerful ritual and myth was in cementing the bonds of the larger community.

Karl McHungus
Karl McHungus
Reply to  Ryan
7 years ago

please provide a reference for your statement “they told them symbolically” because there is a lot of evidence ancient peoples took their religions pretty damn literally.

Sim1776
Sim1776
Reply to  Karl McHungus
7 years ago

Look up “mystery cults” or the Eluesinian Mysteries. Esoteric versus exoteric knowledge. Freemasonry is excellent example for modern times. The Knights Templar, Roshoniya, and Assasines are another set of historical examples. Only the initiated knew “the truth.”

As for disparaging God or Gods, plenty of evidence exists. Look at some of the musings of quantum physicists. The Hindu Vedas call into question transgenic evolution. “Anomalous Archaeology” is another good subject for research.

The “Elites” by and large are nihilists. They believe their “good works” offset the evil that they create.

europeancivilwar.com
Reply to  Sim1776
7 years ago

I agree. I’m not normally a Nietzsche-referencer but the good philosopher did predict that the death of religion at the hands of science would plunge the West into nihilistic despair. I think progressivism is just that, and in that regard basically a new iteration of turn the cheek christianity. What is interesting though is its symbiosis with globalist consumerism, and how it has been exported (at least in part, without the full on suicidalism) to countries like Japan. I think the first sign of what the future holds will be if we see the birthrates go back up in Japan… Read more »

StanFL
7 years ago

I wrote a post on a blog of mine that may help to explain the goals of a religion, or a religion-like belief system. Here it is:
http://improvingbuddhism.bravesites.com/entries/general/goals-and-improved-buddhism

StanFL
7 years ago

You’ve confused the means and the end again. Religion is a means.

Tabitha Elkins
Tabitha Elkins
7 years ago

How hilarious! The idea that Greens who want us to have clean drinking water, organic food instead of GM Frankenfood and pollution-free air belong to some kind of “cult of Gaia” is priceless comedy. Have you tried selling this idea to Hollywood? The cult of the military-industrial complex, intent on destroying all vestiges of family life, healthcare, a social safety net or meaningful human rights, will certainly donate some of their millions to produce such a film! Meanwhile, as a Christian Green, I will continue to fight for human rights, safe, clean drinking water, ecology and conservation of life on… Read more »

Toddy Cat
Toddy Cat
Reply to  Tabitha Elkins
7 years ago

You do of course realize that over 95% of people seeking to invade the West are not “fleeing from war”, they are seeking greater welfare benefits and greater material prosperity, don’t you? You do realize that mass immigration from the Third World, as opposed to helping them in their own countries, means the total destruction of much of the environment of Europe and the Americas, don’t you? And doesn’t “The least of these” include to increasingly battered, unemployed, and crime-victimized people of the West, especially the poor? And can’t you see that the “Military-Industrial” elites that you so rightly despise… Read more »

james wilson
james wilson
Reply to  Tabitha Elkins
7 years ago

Women who avoid having children (you) are civic pollution. Their maternal instincts, denied the outlet they were designed for, become shrunken and twisted, nagging instead the civilization which they refused to actually contribute to without ever first comprehending it. We’re not laughing.

Alzaebo
Alzaebo
Reply to  Tabitha Elkins
7 years ago

You so wonderful.

Tykebomb
Tykebomb
7 years ago

Our legacy is the human race, Pale Penis Person. A human race comprised of 4 billion+ blacks and their Chinese managers. You’d understand that if you just embraced the human race instead of white race.

Rod1963
Rod1963
Reply to  Tykebomb
7 years ago

The Chinese have no real use for idiot blacks as their experience in Africa has shown them how limited if not useless they are as a race. Even here after trillions spent on them, they remain a useless and predatory species. See Empire of Dust on Youtube. And this particular snippet https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ZkE3xB8o8A Or look at what Blacks did to Detroit If the Chinese do take over, there is no need to keep such a inferior, lazy and violent species as blacks around. Even Mexicans hate them and kill them to drive them out of their communities. The only people who… Read more »

Sim1776
Sim1776
Reply to  Tykebomb
7 years ago

Nice try, troll. When the food welfare stops, what happens to those 4 billion+ blacks?

A.T. Tapman (Merica)
A.T. Tapman (Merica)
Member
Reply to  Sim1776
7 years ago

“Nice try, troll. When the food welfare stops, what happens to those 4 billion+ blacks?”

CHIMPOUT