A New Delian League

The Delian League was an alliance of Greek city-states formed in 478 BC in order to confront and defeat the Persian Empire. Persia had conquered Asian Minor, including the Greek city-states, which were collectively known as Ionia. The Greeks had defeated the Persians at Marathon, Salamis, and Plataea in the early 5th century BC, but the threat of Persia remained a concern and the fate of the Ionians was a primary concern of Athens, which saw itself as the defenders of the Ionian Greeks.

As is often the case, the Delian League lost its purpose after the Persian threat had been addressed, but the league never went away. Instead, it quickly turned into the Athenian Empire, as Athens came to dominate the member states. First the Athenians took control of the navy. Member states either supplied ships or money, but the navy was completely controlled by Athens. This made the member states entirely dependent on Athens for defense against Persians, pirates and other Greek city-states.

Then the Athenians took control of the money supply. Initially, a treasury was established on the sacred island of Delos in the Cyclades, hence the name of the alliance. Every member state was assessed an amount they had to contribute annually to the common treasury. The treasury was moved to Athens and each member state was required to pay tribute, based on an assessment set by Athens. For all practical purposes, the league was now an empire ruled by Athens.

This bit of ancient Greek history is useful to keep in mind when looking at what is happening in the West. The EU is the new Delian League, with Brussels playing the role of Athens. The European Union is an economic empire, so controlling the military is not important, especially since Europe is entirely dependent upon the United States for its defense. Any attempt by one state to use force against another would bring in the United States. That and Brussels does not control any military assets.

Instead, the European elite uses money to control the empire. Former Belgian prime minister and current leader of the Alliance of Liberals and Democrats in Europe, Guy Verhofstadt, said as much in a recent interview. In the view of European elites, the member states of Europe must abandon all of their sovereignty and become members of a European empire. Just as the member states of the Delian League would exist, but as subjects to Athens, the nations of Europe will be subjects of Brussels.

There are three problems with this analogy, as well as the motivating philosophy behind the concept. One is the Europeans have no military to speak of, at least not one that Brussels could use to project power. The Italians have a respectable military and the French still have some useful military units, but Brussels has nothing. It is one thing to crater the Greek economy, as Brussels did when SYRIZA tried to revolt. It is another to pull down her walls and take hostages as Athens did to Naxos in 476 BC.

Another problem, perhaps the biggest problem, with this analogy is the Delian League had a clear idea of the enemy. First they had the Persian Empire against whom they were defending the Greeks. That gave the League a clear purpose. Then in the war with Sparta, Athens was defending Greek democracy against tyranny. The current European elite is anti-democratic and it is unwilling to defend Europe against the Persia of this age, which is peripatetic Arabs and Africans.

The final problem with the analogy is the fact that Europe remains a province of the American Empire, which is the continuation of the British Empire. The Anglosphere continues to control the world, militarily, economically and culturally. That last bit is probably the most important regarding Europe. Walk through a shopping district in Europe and it reeks of American ghetto culture. The news in Europe is more about America than Europe. Brussels is playing at empire, but remains a vassal.

In that regard, this reality may explain why the American foreign policy elite is silent on Trump’s support for Brexit. His idea for a free trade and travel zone for the Five Eyes nations would solve a problem for dealing with Europe. If Brussels wants to have access to the vast trove of signal intelligence held by the Anglosphere, they have to play ball with the Anglosphere. This would allow the United State to reduce its footprint in Europe, thus lowering the cost of controlling the Europeans.

Putting that aside, the utility of this analogy is that even with control of the military and the money supply, the Athenians were never able to make their empire work. Even controlling some of Greece put them at odds with Sparta. The Peloponnesian War ended with the defeat of Athens at Battle of Aegospotami, but the cost of maintaining their empire was bleeding them dry. Most historians think the strategy of Pericles would have bankrupted the Athenians in a year or two, even if they won at Aegospotami.

That seems to be what is happening with the European Union. The revolt of the Greeks when SYRIZA came to power was a glimpse of what was coming. Now it is the Italians that are challenging the economic rule of Brussels. The cost of putting down that revolt will be orders of magnitude higher than suppressing the Greeks. The eventual withdraw of Britain will undermine much of the legitimacy and authority of Brussels, as Britain is unlikely to perish without protection from Brussels.

Then there are the populist movements that keep boiling up in every EU country, even core countries like Germany and France. As we see in the United States, the ruling class is petrified of these movements. They are willing to go to great lengths to suppress them, but the cost is becoming increasingly high. More important, suppression efforts seem to be converting more people to populism and nationalism. At some point in the near future, Brussels will be faced with its Aegospotami.

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105 thoughts on “A New Delian League

  1. Modern politics is about bribing voters with their own money and hoping they won’t get wise to the scam. Eventually the cost of this bribery (and the incentivizing grift for the pols) becomes too much to bear and the Ponzi scheme collapses in a spectacular and sudden crash and burn event. Usually all of this is preceded by a general degeneration and decline of the population’s robustness, so the newly arriving hardship tends to be overwhelming and desperation become epidemic. Now the fun begins and it’s back to the jungle time.

  2. I though for a second Victor Davis Hanson was writing for the blog.

    Considering at least on the Right he is considered a subject matter expert on tha era , that speaks a lot about your erudition.

  3. “Wreaks” is a much better fit, pedantic hosers!

    I’m reading a Mike Hudson interview- he discusses banking in the ancient and classical worlds.
    He says that past empires fell because they could not bring their asset-stripping oligarchs to heel.
    He recommends regular jubilees of personal debt, rather than a ban on interest.

    (He prefers the public-private partnerships of temple/pyramid cultures or interstate highways, but those are also being abused as pools of low cost loans tapped for the political rentiers.)

    He reinforces the Z-point, “what kind of society do we want?”, rather than obsessing over the tools.

    Also, the “American” empire is a front for it’s true owners.
    Note that the Federal Reserve is owned by 8 families, who created the global BIS banks. It seems someone unnamed provided debt financing to the Roman oligarchs; perhaps that is why a certain country was destroyed, and is now being avenged.

    • Human nature is the problem, not the institutions. Liberals say that jubilee will be 10 000 years after the end of next Ice Age and I as a conservative army served gun owner, I must agree, because somebody may call me racist or iceist or cold lover or warm hater or whatever.

    • Sigh. I won’t get into a pig wrestling match but to preserve the dignity of this excellent blog someone should note that this “8 families” and “BIS” nonsense written about the Fed is exactly the kind of mentally impaired horseflop that makes sane people turn away in disgust. There are certainly criticisms one can make of the Fed but its origins, structure and operations are among the most straightforward and frankly respectable of all the world’s central banks.

  4. Brits don’t want to be ruled by Brussels, but do they even want to be ruled by London, which many Brits don’t even consider to be a British city anymore? I wouldn’t be surprised if not only the EU broke-up, but European countries themselves did, too.

  5. The elites in both the EU and the Anglosphere are both a false aristocracy: a combination of avaricious jumped up white trash and foreign parasites who are hell bent on destroying their native population civilization wide.

    There is no precedent or analogy for this. Maybe Attila and the Hun. But they had military superiority.

    • “False”

      I’m sorry to say it, but I think the elite are quite well superior to us in mental faculties. They’ve outfoxed our surprise wins, through lawfare and deplatforming. By and large they haven’t needed to lock our supporters up, and extrajudicial killings are few and speculative. I think we have to win via hubris on their side.

      The Tiger I Panzer was overbuilt and hard to maintain, while being otherwise superior to the Sherman. It was also supposedly damaged via sabotage in the production process, and hampered by supply shortages. Our problem is that we aren’t facing a 1944 Tiger I, but a 2019 M1 Abrams, while still being in that 1944 Sherman.


      • Your perspective is too short-term.

        We are ruled by a false aristocracy. A natural aristocracy evolves and rules from a throne and altar. They are first in war and first in faith. Complexity expands that into a complex woven institutional social fabric. They oversee the symbiotic relationship between the social castes. They are conservative in setting an example and keeping in check any group or individual who acts in a destructive behavior. A natural Aristocracy rules a polis of naturally evolved hierarchical estates. A hierarchy that is both vertical and horizontal. Z did a podcast about some right wing political theories a month ago. He spent most of it describing Anarcho-Futurism. Carlyle described this in an earlier age, Faye wrote a more modern version. The Anarcho is the structure described above. It founded and built our civilization from the Pleistocene up to the Enlightenment. From that point on we took a wrong turn at every fork in the road.

        We no longer have a functioning civilization. The estates (castes) that evolved have been so corrupted and turned on their head that chaos rules the day. In an age that worships miasma it is the slime that rises to the top. Parasites who would have been kept in check in a sane age now set the agenda and rule. Yes, they are superior at being manipulative lowlifes in a civilization that idealizes mammon and orgasm. An aristocracy of vermin.

        And they are well aware of what they are and that their power is knotted with flimsy propaganda and not deeply rooted natural leadership. This is why they are so terrified by small groups of dissenters.

        In the end all power lies with nature and not man’s fantasies. We either build a civilizational order that parallels nature or we build one that chafes against the natural order. One that chafes until it collapses.

        • Building a natural parallel civilization, what does that look like? I hear this mentioned on other sites, your take?

        • >>>A natural aristocracy evolves and rules from a throne and altar.

          This was certainly true within traditional societies, both European and non-European. The great question for the modern world is whether an aristocracy can be dominated by grifters and con-men, and still function. The Western aristocracy says “yes, it can” (but of course they’re lying).

        • There probably isn’t any good to come from attacking people in your own tribe. Not when your enemy is so clearly defined.

          Understand frustration, but batting around ideas isn’t the worse thing in the world… particularly when everybody else in your trench doesn’t want to be the first to go over the top into No-Man’s Land.

      • Silicon Valley is now run by rentier Jews who really hate people like us and have the wealth to impose their views on us at will. This is not the Silicon Valley that actually innovated and created new computers, etc.

        As for the ruling class, they have three things that making controlling us easy.
        1) Control of the courts/system whose members hold the same views as them.
        2) Control of the MSM
        3) Control of the Wall Street bubble machine that gives proles the illusion of wealth and keeps them pacified. This last one is a ticking time bomb. When it goes the next time they won’t be able to re-inflate again and will probably spawn a outright rebellion against the establishment.

        And they have shown they cannot rule. Witness the decay of cities under their control. Los Angeles is now suffering from Typhus and Typhoid outbreaks. It’s just a matter of time before Bubonic plague gets going. Seattle is drowning in homeless people. Portland is becoming ungovernable. San Francisco is awash of human and drug waste. NYC is regressing to the bad times of the 1970’s.

        They are so arrogant they cannot admit they are wrong and so have locked themselves into a death spiral.

  6. I don’t really find the whole Brexit drama all that interesting. The UK is dead, her capitol city occupied by hostile foreigners and her own people completely disengaged. The rest of Western Europe is in the same boat. Demographics is a slow moving force but you can’t flip it around in a year or five. If you already have a huge, fecund non-European population and a native European population that refuses to reproduce itself, as Douglas Murray wrote in The Strange Death of Europe…

    “Europe today has little desire to reproduce itself, fight for itself or even take its own side in an argument.”

    …then it is doomed.

    I am more interested in seeing if Eastern Europe can get over their understandable historic hostility with Russia and make common cause with them. They may be a mess right now but Russians and Poles are still far more intelligent than Eritreans and Somalis, the new Western Europeans.

    Maybe the EU can prolong itself with a handful of technocrats but eventually turning your major cities into cesspools is going to bring it down, unless some sort of global pandemic or major war comes along.

    • The potential of automation causing a secular decline in unemployment is one way to break the logjam. The public is often skeptical of immigration, but doesn’t vote for the nationalist right. Some of these people are genuinely concerned that the economy will crack, and their pensions will be unfunded.

      If there is nothing for the unskilled migrant to do, labor-wise, it becomes politically easier to say that we should just pay the Third World to stay back home. And lest anyone thing we can succeed without a cost in gold and blood, we will be paying heartily in both.

        • The ordinary person engages in crimestop the minute they hear us make violent and dehumanizing remarks. Rhetoric that inspired shell-shocked veterans and widows of the Great War doesn’t work in today’s soft and self-policed conditions.

  7. The EU and Germany in particular are either led by complete fools, or enemy saboteurs. That much is evident from their actions. The economic can may only be kicked down the road so far before they finally are faced with a problem they have to deal with. Salvini is a major problem for them, as Italy is a bigger player than Hungary or Poland.

    As far as where this goes: Germany (it’s government at least) seems to want to enter the Russia/China sphere. I’d be surprised if the populist countries chose that route, their rhetoric generally is geared towards increased sovereignty. That cannot be guaranteed under the American sphere, though, particularly after Trump leaves.

    • Neither Russia nor China strikes me as representatives of GloboHomo, whereas Germany is their leading light.

      Why would they move away from their fellow POZholes to embrace the big bad Bear (or Dragon?)

      • Perhaps it is suicidal behavior, perhaps they are extremely naive, or even over confident that they can convince the russkies and chicoms of the virtues of unlimited sodomy and Muslims.

        But in terms of action, they most definitely are cozying up. The Huawei conflict is one of the better examples: you would have to be a fool to accept such tech, knowing full well what it will do. Even though America does it too, we also do sigint and comint sharing with them, which will most definitely end if they let Huawei in.

        With Russia, it is the LNG deal that I cite as evidence. They also seem keen on Iran. Why are they doing it? Your guess is as good as mine, which is ‘Amalek’.

        • Redpill me on Huawei. I don’t know much about it other than that the GRIDS-riddled Tim Cook doesn’t want his oligopoly threatened.

          • Certainly. In short, they are attempting to dominate the 5G market, specifically the hardware that will serve as the network infrastructure. What America’s IC has been saying is that it will also allow for the Chinese government to fully eavesdrop, as the entire network gives them a Man-in-the-Middle vantage point. Our Intel guys, who currently do multiple things comparable to this, realize the insane risk of letting an enemy eavesdrop on all of a countries communications.

          • Thanks for the info, it makes sense.

            I guess I’m of the perspective that no Chinese ever called me “honkey” or told me to check my privilege, and it wasn’t them that turned the state my ancestors carved out of a wilderness back into Mexico.

            Even if what “our” government says about Huawei is true, I have trouble seeing China as an enemy.

          • MemeWarVet, the Chinese are too smart to openly position themselves as our enemies. Instead they have been covertly buying up Western tech assets, sold to them by the Clintons and Obama (through Joe Biden, who says “the Chinese aren’t such bad guys”). Look up Loral for a good example.

          • See my post above on who would eventually get hold of the Bundy land, via Harry Reid.
            Meme..look up Confucius Institute on universities and their purpose to tech spy and relay said info back to the motherland.

          • Then don’t view them as Chinese, view them as yellow communists and that will change your mind.

          • you’d have to be a complete freakin moron (or a Democrat politician, BIRM) not to see China as an enemy.

          • Tacitus, well if the American intelligence community says so, it must be true! Lol, sorry but they’ve discredited themselves through the Russian dossier and other idiotic corruption and abuse of power. I don’t doubt /your/ honor; if only the IC were as good as you are. Really, they don’t deserve the trust of good people these days.

          • Apple can’t make product as good and affordable as Huawei so the U.S. government is trying to prevent any western country from buying Huawei’s products rather than making better products ourselves. Cheating to win or maintain the lead, the new American way. Don’t get me wrong, I’d prefer American products are dominant in the marketplace, just not by cheating. Maybe instead of serving their shareholders, Apple should spend more on innovating.

          • Ursula’s statement is also Andrew Anglin’s position, and he’s been about the only person on the Dissident Right covering the Huawei affair.

            Seems a sane and reasonable position to me.

          • Ursula: You do realize one of the main reasons Huawei is cheaper is that they have extreme subsidization from the Communist party. This is a pretty standard tactic for the chicoms, and it is profoundly foolish to favor short term savings over very real threat (that doesn’t mean I support apple and their sodomy tech).

            I suspect the vast majority of people have no idea how serious the threat is.

          • No, what I observe is that the Chinese excel at taking an existing idea and making it better and figuring out how to produce it more efficiently. The government is partner to so many Chinese businesses, that’s just how they do it. (And as if big American corporations aren’t subsidized in so many ways by our obsequious government!) But what they do not do is illegally arrest American businessmen while abroad in order to coerce their own products’ market dominance. Perhaps the decline in the quality of our people has given rise to our desperate actions. The U.S. actions have set a dangerous precedent. The U.S. needs to get off its corrupt ass and improve upon what even the Chinese do. This should be a synergy that creates continuously improving products to the benefit of consumers everywhere. Instead it’s become weaponized political market sabotage. We’re like the 800-pound gorilla with very sensitive feelings who will often illegally destroy anyone or anything if our sensibilities are offended. If anyone’s interested, here are a couple of recent pieces on the Huawei situation published at CGTN, which viewpoints of course us westerners will not find in our media. (Yes, I know it’s biased toward China, but all news is slanted one way or another depending on who’s publishing it.)



          • Shall we pretend China is not beating us badly on many fronts? Maybe you’d prefer to cheer on fantasies about the superiority of America. Look at our people and our government — you don’t see that we’re failing badly? China is doing all kinds of research and innovation in all kinds of industries while it’s crickets over here, unless you’re talking about weapons, surveillance, pharmaceuticals or finance. We’re living on the vestigial greatness of our past, which is evaporating quickly. Bet you’re one who loves Israel.

          • Actually Ursula, maybe if Apple spent less time and money supporting gay pride crap, the cult of climate change and joining every other leftist virtue signal known to man they’d be better off. So would we.

        • Every Research university and government research lab in the USA has Chinese nationals and co-ethnics as part of their research team. Americans in Chinese research labs only exist to get the Chinese up to speed, then they are sent packing.

          If they don’t know something they want our help which we are so willing and happy to offer. The stars will burn out before they ever reciprocate.

    • There’s lots of precedent for Europe to being led by fools. Think 30 Years War, WWI, WWII for three outstanding examples.

      The leaders’ stupidity doesn’t surprise me as much as the imbecility of the followers. And that holds for today, and not just in Europe.

    • “The EU and Germany in particular are either led by complete fools, or enemy saboteurs”

      Its got to be the latter, complete fools wouldn’t have been as successful. Its pretty clearly a coordinated, global push across all fronts.

  8. The current European elite is both anti-democratic, it is unwilling to defend Europe against the Persia of this age, which is peripatetic Arabs and Africans.

    It would take the armed forces of Luxembourg (the true capital of the EU) a few weeks to whip both Africa and the Arab Street.

    The Persians are the globalists – our own leaders – the POC are merely one of the weapons they wield against us.

    • None that fit. If we are to have Civil War II, it will look nothing at all like the first.

          • More like unchecked rape, murder and bloodshed on a vast scale, although the Saracens gaining power over a large portion is certainly possible.

            One of my biggest worries is some genius deciding that the nuclear option is acceptable. Ultimately, the balkans did survive. We may not be so fortunate.

            Think Rwanda but with all the wonderful stuff the pentagon has cooked up over the years put into play.

          • More like unchecked rape, murder and bloodshed on a vast scale

            The difference between Rwanda and heritage America, is that Rwanda is black, heritage America is white.

            It’ll be nice and orderly, a few passes with the gunship to make our point and off you go. No cattle wagons, clean, airconditioned busses, and repurposed hotel-camps, until they get shipped off to some shithole country we either invade or buy wholesale.

          • How many white heritage Americans do you personally know, who are able and above all willing to take up arms?

            This isn’t me being an asshole. I can count three for certain, perhaps another five depending. The count does not include myself, naturally.

            Have you ever encountered a person who hasn’t eaten for three days? Have you experienced this yourself? Do you understand what this does to even the most reasonable person, or how far they’re willing to go to eat?

            I get that I’m the new guy, but I’ve been reading this site for quite some time, and generally respect your opinion, which is why I find your nonchalant attitude puzzling.

          • I know a lot of Boomers who THINK that they’ll take up arms, but in reality they’ll hand over their arsenals to avoid being called a “racist.”

          • Meme…you’re going demented. You’re obsessed with this Boomer crap and wasting your energy. The Coastal Boomers who are all in on crystals on the table..love every color…DO NOT own guns. They will shriek Racist at the drop of a hat for anything, when they sit on the pot they yell Racist. We Boomers who own guns, you should admire us, dropped the antelope 1 shot through the heart, don’t give a fat flying frog about being called raaaaacist. We’ll hand over our Boomer arsenals because we’re F***ing old, don’t move fast, and what life we have left we’re not going to waste going down in a hail of bullets for a useless gesture!

            So RoboCop with gunship hovering bangs on my door and demands my guns, and I stand in my doorway and proclaim Shoot Me after telling the kid next door to start his Iphone filming and post it on Twitter…..Not! My death as a statement will be useless, my neighbors will cower inside, there will be no posting of atrocity on social media, no one will know. Let’s see you stand in your doorway and get gunned down for nada, wise guy. If you really want a world with no old people, your world will be all the poorer without what the old ones have to contribute.

            I thought this site is for people to plan, think, prepare and krall together into something greater than ourselves, a world of realism.

          • If they get to the point of taking out guns, what comes next will be ethnic cleansing Because they have made it very clear, they want us dead and gone. They will take your white boomer ass, toss it in a boxcar to be dumped in some quarry after putting bullet in your skull as you beg for your life.

            There really isn’t any other option other than fighting at that point when they are confiscating weapons.

            Prior to that you should be figuring out the best way to hurt them, rather than waiting around like a fattened calf for them to collect you.

          • Rod…..you and others are such either/or, excuse the pun black/white thinkers. First of all, am not a fattened cow, I am a rather comely cow. Second, do you really think am just wringing hands and shuffling off to the death chamber? Some of us oldsters made it to elder age because sometimes age by craft and deceit can trump youth. Sand in the gears has merit and, no, I shan’t divulge how to monkeywrench.

            “There really isn’t any other option other than fighting at that point when they are confiscating weapons.” Possibly, or not. Every situation to be assessed at that time. Rather than spending time setting up a points system for the Olympic Death in Doorway Event.. (Panel, please hold up your card! 8.0- 7.9- 8.0- 8.0- 7.9 Wow! Such grace! Such style! She’s a winner! but dead)…..let’s figure out how to live with you, me and other like minded people and build a realistic world on this side of the great divide.

          • “First of all, am not a fattened cow, I am a rather comely cow…” You got me. Coffee accidentally snorted. 8.0

          • The historical record is pretty clear on what happens after confiscation. The Founders assement of those situations was clear hence a core element of their design of citizen/government relationship.
            In the couple centuries and change since the historical record of post confiscation “situations” is quite consistent.

            Not much assement required I think.

          • RFF, I’ve always enjoyed your posts and am usually among the first to upvote them, so it’s with no pleasure that I say you’re indulging the NAXALT fallacy pretty hard here.

            The type of Boomer I’m specifically referring to are the ones who walk around Bass Pro Shops in their size 3XL T-shirts with “he who blesses Israel, so shall I bless you” emblazoned on it. They’ll drop 3K of their retirement money on a couple of new rifles that they’ll never fire in anger, while prattling on endlessly in the Breitbart comments section about “Muh Constitutshun.”

            I don’t for a moment believe that statement applies to you, but you also know darn well that serious people like yourself are badly outnumbered by what I just described.

            Keep up the good work. Friends can talk through minor disagreements.

          • Of course we can. Point well taken. Visual. Didn’t even think there are the kind of Boomers out there you describe. I never see them in my world so plead ignorance. Glad I don’t have to play on the game show Olympic Death in the Doorway Event with you!
            PS…what the hell is a NAXALT fallacy anyway? I really enjoy being in hicksville and not knowing what is going on and abbreviations for said not knowing.

          • Thanks for the teaching! Godalmighty..I hate acronyms. A new one a day. Meme….get your tail back here….and the rest of you, too. Be prepared that no perfection here.Just pretty country and not as intensely in your face. Just mostly nice sheep.

          • The Boomers are too old . The very youngest are fifty five and while a few of them might join in, hell there were very dangerous Korean War vets at Bundy Ranch , thi is not the Boomers fight

            It is up to younger Gen X, Gen Y and Gen Z to do the dirty work

            However the Right will do absolutely nothing till they figure out what they want to fight for, are willing to die for and what they want power for.

            Thus far this has been elusive to say the least.

            Until that happens, unless there is door to door gun confiscation which is looking less likely by the year, they will do nothing

            Hell if the Left wanted to simply eliminate the Right for good they could do it easily, simply trade Federal gun protection for huge amounts of legal immigration from say Africa and Latin America , resettle them into Red States than wait

            And note the Chamber of Commerce would eat this right up , cheap labor ahoy!

            A decade or two later, the military is purged of rednecks by a Democrat President and using data science to determine who is Conservative, and note we log everything and let the purges begin.

            They’ll take heavy casualties and a lot of war toys won’t work but the Right White would be utterly annihilated .

            It would take maybe four decades, say from Immigration Reform Act of 65 to Obama’s First Term

          • Speaking of Bundy, you guys forget the big fight might very well begin in the West over land use rights. Think of Dwight and Steve Hammond setting a backfire to stop an incoming wildfire, burning 100 acres of BLM land, then being thrown in fed pen Terminal Island for 5 years for arson until Trump pardoned them. As for Bundy, know folks from Overton who know Bundy, he is a bit of a nutter…don’t know his arguments for not paying fees on range land, but he sure got a crook deal with half the military storming his land and shooting his cattle. Blame Harry Reid for that one, the sheriff was in his pocket. I heard Ol’ Harry wanted Bundy’s land to sell to Chinese for a solar project.

            HEADS UP: We may be entering into the land of unintended consequences. Upward of 400 Congolese have crossed the border into Texas. Ebola anyone! The left hates us so much they don’t care what diseases and plagues come with the illegal hoards. This may get out of hand sooner if not later. That’s when you prep up.

            Look online and research Lauricidin and Biocidin for internal products that kill virus, bacteria and mold/yeast, strengthen immune system. Not sick for 3 years, got a nasty flu and it was gone in 3 days..walloped it with said products.

          • How many white heritage Americans do you personally know, who are able and above all willing to take up arms?

            I said ‘if it comes to that’, i.e. the Zombie Apocalypse. Once Normie has tried a few days of actual, real hunger, I bet his fighting spirit perks up.

          • @Felix
            “Once Normie has tried a few days of actual, real hunger, I bet his fighting spirit perks up.”

            I bet most will have run to FEMA before their stomach even growls to get a resupply of antidepressants.

          • You are correct. Up until the number of refugees meets with natural incompetence and limited resources of bureaucratic supply measures.

            A man watching his children/grandchildren suffer doesn’t much care for platitudes and promises after a while.

          • And my apologies for being flippant, but it will come to my country as well; we’ll all face it sooner or later.

          • I give it a 30-70 chance, 30% outright shooting civil war 2.0, 70% long, slow decline into complete and total fascism (“Why have you not consumed next product comrade?”). It all depends on how far the Kamala Harris regime intends to push things in the 2020’s.

          • I’ve been reading a fair amount of colonial history lately, and it seems that 5% – 10% of the population needs to be hard core in favor of something for it to gain traction. Personally, I doubt 5% – 10% of Gen X, Millenials, and Gen Z (forget Boomers, they’re hopeless) could come together to preserve Heritage America, but who knows?

          • They can’t agree on what Heritage America is beyond race and not entirely that.

            Till that happens, its no go

          • It will be a come-as-you-are war. Those Pentagon toys are very expensive and time-consuming to produce. If victory by one side does not come quickly, it will be back to the old industrial wars of attrition.

          • It will be a come-as-you-are war.

            If it comes to that, we’ll have helicopters fitted with machineguns, rockets and infrared within 48 hours.

            The other side can’t even build a decent ANFO device.

          • Depends on the other side, Antifa is more than up to the task and a great many Left wing groups including Black ones proved to be good at bombs back in the day

            Right now most Americans are stupid as shit but if hunger can the Right White off their ass to fight, bad conditions can smarten and toughen up the Left too

            Also the Left is very very good at organizing and much more interested in aggression . They’ve almost killed a representative and have at least twice attacked White Right gathering with firearms (California and Nevada)

            That is a huge first mover advantage they Right will have to overcome

          • They will eventually get your weapons but not in the way you surmise. Door to door confiscation is stupidly unnecessary. When corporations have already shown they are MORE than willing to virtue signal -around- laws, the gub’mint needn’t lift a finger.

            Want to do banking, receive a paycheck? You are a registered firearms owner. Turn in that weapon if you’d like to keep the lights on and eat this month. You would fucking marvel at how fast those weapons vanish. They will do it piecemeal.

            This ‘MUH LAST STAND’ fantasy is just that. A fantasy, Range From Fault is right in the assessment. As likely the only person here who has been -in this exact situation-. A hostile SWAT raid on my home looking for my GUNS. I can tell you it is easy to armchair QBack this until there are flashbangs flying around and half a dozen automatic M4s pointed at your face. It ain’t no kinda fun and I was certainly not willing to martyr myself. For what? To prove a point? Fuck that, I barely escaped prison.

            So it is already happening nationwide. Red flag laws, illegal seizures on trumped up charges (my situation), etc etc. But they will put all that aside and simply put so much economic pressure on you, that you will gladly surrender them. This is already happening in real time so you don’t need much future vision to see the end game.

          • This is why in order to fix society the Right will have to stop being corporate cock suckers and to understand that government created things like corporations , QUANGO’s , The Fed are often more of a threat than the government itself

            There needs to be an easily enforceable chain of responsibility and accountability for every decision at every level at every single level with enforcement designed to prevent cronies from bailing out cronies

            This will require very very smart people to run for and hold office since they can’t outsource the administrative state to anyone and have to attest that they understand what the regulations were lest they be hanged

            Not an easy thing to do as your average elected official is socially adept but hardly bright enough to say understand monetary policy or pollution control

            However in order to maintain a few country it has to be done.

            As an aside there were two former Republican congressmen killed in the last few days. This sucks

            If these were political in origin, it’s a clear sign the Left has gone to “you play, you pay.” and is smart enough to go for softer targets

            This is a winning strategy sorry to say, if you risk being shot at any point ever at any time ever for what you say, wrote, did without trial or limit, it tends to deter action at least after it becomes a common thing

            Another thing the Left gets, hell it is their stock in trade is collective punishment . Gun control is a form of this and until the Right embraces it, they’ll be on the fail train.

            Enemy groups, tribes and organizations have to be punished and sometimes destroyed. The ancients understood the friends and family of traitors are traitors too and acted on that.

            None of us want that but the other side operates by those rules and the same pressures that has caused the Right to start using things like Rules for Radicals will inexorably push them in that direction if they wish to live which is something I’m not sure is the case

            Call it in Randian terms, a Return to the Primitive if you like but Marquis of Queensberry rules or as Sam Francis the Beautiful Loser approach of the establishment Right is going to result in its destruction

            Its all Game of Thrones shit all the way down and you play that way win or you die.

          • Most legitimate assessments I’ve seen of firearms ownership in the US – put the total numbers somewhere in the 200-400 million range.

            Yes – that’s a wide range. But just pick the smallest one. Even 200 million is an awful lot of piecemeal to dig your way thru.

            And technology is making confiscation a useless endeavor. They can do it piecemeal – and already have started. But when they do that , they’re just driving counter actions.

            During the Obama administration those counter actions consisted of people buying up every round of ammo and every available firearm every single time anybody even whispered about increased gun regulations. That’s when the next wave got started: 3D printing and home building.

            The “build your own” wave seems to be pretty well embedded at this point – based on what I’ve seen of the profusion of 80% kits for both rifles and pistols – and the sizeable increase in places selling them.

            If you want to understand how this REALLY works – you need to go read thru some of the underground history of guerilla movements and insurrections. Factories to produce firearms ALWAYS get setup. I remember reading an article probably 18 years ago now – about the little hole in the wall shops churning out AK-47s in the border region of Pakistan next to Afghanistan. These guys were pounding out AK-47s on dirt floor shops.

            If the US goes into full confiscate mode – then they’ll either have to do all at once (pretty much impossible) – or do it a piece at a time. The piece at a time is the only way they can pull it off – and the “gun community” is so paranoid about confiscation – that any effort along those lines will just lead to an increase in alternative methods of acquiring firearms.

            You can look at things like the war in the Balkans during the 1990’s – and the fall of the Soviet Union for further examples. There’s videos on Youtube going thru all the firearms that people were carrying around during the Balkan wars. A lot of it was of WW2 vintage. I remember reading stories about how after the fall of the USSR – it was pretty common for people to be walking around with an AK slung over their shoulder.

            Where did all those firearms come from?

            Buried in basements. Buried in barns. Etc.

            Where did the Jews who fought the Nazis get guns from?

            I don’t worry about guns. The history points to resistance movements always being able to get their hands on firearms.

            That’s not the problem.

            The problem is within people’s heads. Which means – will they have the will to use them – or will they continue to come up with excuses?

            ” you can never win against a modern army ! ” LOL

      • Probably something closer to the Spanish Civil War, with the Left playing the role of the Communists, except that they will have the establishment and military (at least the top ranks) on its side. Not sure if we will have a Franco, so it could get quite ugly for us.

    • Civil War III? Does it look like a repeat of the 1960s-70s civil unrest/violence or the fall of Rhodesia? Dunno. May God not ask us to drink from that cup.

  9. “reeks of American ghetto culture”, not “wreaks”. I wouldn’t bet the ranch on the “eventual withdrawal” of Britain from the EU. The deadline is more than two months past, and they’re still in, and the Conservative Party, the motivating force behind the idea, is coming apart.

    • We will leave but maybe not this year and maybe not without some serious civil disorder. Also, the Conservative Party is not the motivating force behind independence; in fact, they have fought tooth and nail to stop it happening and that fight goes on.

      • At first (along with I believe our host) I just assumed that the UK would never be allowed to leave the EU. But now despite all the delays and maneuvering I’m not so sure. Yes the Conservative Party does not want Brexit but it is becoming increasingly clear that they have to deliver it in order to survive. Their hold on power is intrinsically feeble but made absolute in a practical sense because almost no one with any power, including many of the Labour MP’s, wants Jeremy Corbin as PM.

        So I think Brexit might have a chance but only because the Conservative MP’s will put Party above Country (as they see the interests of their Country). It’s a funny old world, isn’t it.

  10. Earlier this year I royally pissed off a French lady, when I politely informed her that France was not strictly speaking a country anymore, as it had control of neither its borders nor its currency.

    Perhaps this was unkind but her boundless admiration for the EU was starting to bug me.

    • France has proven willing and able to close its borders (if only temporarily) in defiance of globalist dictate. America has not.

      As for the currency… Don’t even get me started.

      • Felix, you got me interested. I’d like to hear your succinct thoughts on currency.

        • I asked for that, didn’t I?

          Well, in a nutshell, the Federal Reserve is a private entity owned by the major banks, subject to neither Congress nor the government. If you hurry, you can probably still find a video or two on Youtube.

          • Felix, you make a point that likely fewer than one in a hundred in this country understand about our Federal Reserve. It is a banking cartel, run by and for the big banks. Ask a knowledgable community banker about the Fed sometime.

    • By those criteria the US is not a country any more, either, as it too controls neither its borders nor its currency. But then. Again, the U.S. has not been a country for quite a while now, and by many more criteria than those.

      • America is an empire, not a country.

        Other than that I completely agree with both of you.

        • No it is not. You confuse legitimate legal, geopolitical and geoeconomics with empire and tribute. There may be similarities but they are far more different than alike. If America WERE an empire, we’d have enslaved the moslem mutts in Iran and Iraq, and be profiteering like bandits on their oil. Hell, we wouldn’t even get our hands dirty; our vassals would do our dirty work for us. Last time I looked, every second yodelling rag head in Iraq was gobbling about death to America, Israel and half a dozen other demons and rivers of blood.

          This is a weak point of the dissident right as I see it, and a possible fracture point. We need to define what constitutes legitimate and reasonable foreign investment, and exactly what our capital assets are and to what lengths we can go to protect them.

          It’s been my experience on such topics that we are often undermined by the usual morons carping about eeeeeevil jooooos and neocons – and everything degenerates from there. Until we address this issue the dissident right can never be anything more than a hobby horse for failed libertarians, neoreactionaries and cucks.

          • “Hell, we wouldn’t even get our hands dirty; our vassals would do our dirty work for us.”

            You don’t seem to understand: /we/ ARE the vassals, and yes, we DID do the dirty work, and no, our imperial overlords did NOT get their hands dirty. Empire does not automatically work solely by your pronouncement, simply because you looked the word up in Webster’s. Here, bravo, you get a gold star.

            But you get docked twelve points for the stale old hand-waving about “morons” and “jooooos” when faced with legitimate criticism of a genuine international criminal syndicate.

          • Glenfilthie, you criticize those “carping about eeeeeevil jooooos and neocons…” Do you believe J3ws played an indispensable role in advocating for massive immigration (1965 law) and wars for Israel?

    • Nathaniel Bell… I know what you mean, its hard not to take baby jabs in conversations when you hear drivel. Its an unwholesome pleasure but hard to resist. And sometimes you “get served” as the kids say.

      I had an interesting and surprising exchange about two weeks ago. Went to the book store at the local public library (OT: great place to get books cheaply if yours has one).

      Was chatting literature while I perused with the 60ish year old woman volunteer. Most of the volunteer gals are nice but the sort that read Michelle Obama’s “autobiography”. She said she had just finished an outstanding book on The Holocaust. I was feeling a bit spicy and looked at her blankly, “Which one, the Armenian holocaust, the Cathars, the Muslim subjugation of Eastern Europe?”

      Thought that’d be the end of it or I would get a rise. Instead she told me she was aware of the Armenian Holocaust but hadn’t heard of the Cathars, and jotted it down on a scratch pad.

      We started chatting and lo and behold I was enchanted when this lady turned out to be a highly intelligent chameleon. Staunchly Christian, from a multi-generational military family, Western Civ devotee, voracious reader of classic literature, anti-immigration, agog at the anti-white trends of our culture, abreast of the decline of Europe, etc… I felt like I should pull up a chair and prepare to be schooled.

      We talked for nearly an hour between the occasional customers. At one point she noted my tattoos (one a Christian symbol, the other my former military unit) and smiled, she said, “God and Country.”

      She guided the conversation around to the travesty of pulling statues down and attacking works of western literature (as a former school teacher she was outraged). I proffered, “We are an amazing people and we don’t deserve this.”

      I kid you not, she looked conspiratorially over her shoulder and whispered to me (we were alone), “No. No we don’t. Have you ever heard of Q or Qanon?” I was gobsmacked. I got served. Who expects a female boomer to be anything but a box-wine aunty or a Civ-Nat? In a public library? She also jotted down Zman’s podcast info of course.

      I swear, if I wasn’t already married and separated from this lady by a decade and a half, I’d have asked her for a date.

      • Oh yes. There are far more of us than we know.

        Things get very interesting when I talk to people my age or younger about such things, especially white ones. They genuinely do not know about their own mighty heritage, and when you share a little history with them doubt is planted.

        In my experience the burning of Norte dame affected young whites deeply, though they couldn’t say why. For some it felt like betrayal, even if they can’t articulate exactly what was betrayed.

        I commonly take polite verbal jabs at peoples beliefs, and not solely for my own twisted amusement. The first step in recovering from a virus is getting the body to realize it’s infected.

        Hence, plant doubt.

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