The Need To Believe

Eric Hoffer noted that people who are prone to join mass movements tend to join many of them, often going from one to another. It is not unusual for someone to go from one cause then to another that contradicts the prior cause in some way. The old stereotype of the middle-aged woman driving a Volvo festooned with bumper stickers from various causes does not spring from nothing. The vegan activist will be into saving animals, sustainable farming and oppose nuclear energy.

A good recent example of this is the amazing overlap in people who worship Gaia and those who are now Covidians. The people who carry grimy canvas sacks to the market as a sign of their piety are now wearing three masks in the car as they driver alone to the Whole Foods Market. That does not mean all Covidians were Gaia worshippers, but almost all Gaia worshippers embraced Covid. HBD people embracing Covid suggests their interest in biology is something other than empirical.

What is going on here is that humans are hardwired to believe. Like almost all human traits, the need to believe (NTB) trait operates on a spectrum. At one end is the zealot who is consumed and defined by her belief. At the other end is the skeptic who tends not to accept anything at face value. The reason you don’t see skeptics protesting the latest fads is they tend to think protesting is a waste of time. On the other hand, the zealot is ready to act on the slightest provocation.

For most of human history, the NTB was kept under control by settled society through various means. Religion was the main control. The zealots were funneled into the the shared beliefs of the group. The structure of the belief system kept these otherwise unorganized minds from exploring new ways to express their NTB. When that did not work, the belief system had ways to handle the crazies. Maybe they were declared witches or expelled from the community.

The collapse of Christianity as the unifying belief system opened the door for every sort of alternative belief system. Those with a strong NTB were attracted to these new belief systems like communism. The more utopian the ideology, the more attractive it is to those with a strong NTB. It is not an accident that Marxism, for example, has had a profound influence, despite the fact it has never had a broad appeal. A relatively small number of fanatics can accomplish a lot when unified.

The great geneticist J. B. S. Haldane claimed that fanaticism is one of man’s greatest inventions, even though it was not an invention. In reality, fanaticism is just a cognitive trait like any other. The ancients noted that some men would fight like lions while others were more cautious. It was not a big leap from that observation to cultivating this quality to create elite units of warriors. The berserkers in Norse mythology were not insane, but rather the most enthusiastic of their fighters.

Today, the berserkers are those ready to lecture the rest of us about the latest edicts from the high priests of Covid. These people are irrational or insane. They are the simply most enthusiastic of believers. Their NTB goes to eleven, while everyone else stops at ten. It is why they never notice the contradictions. If you point out that Fauci can never keep his story straight, it bounces right off of them. It is not that they do not understand, it is that their NTB overrides reason.

Even the most fanatical believer, however, is prone to doubt. Since the bulk of believers are not berserkers, this means the bulk of any mass movement is made up of people in need of regular affirmation. Here is an example in the ironically named Popular Science instructing the faithful on how to tease affirmation out of their loved ones. Note that the first item on the list is the justification for trying to convert those who have yet to accept Covid in their life. The religious overtones are not hard to miss.

Note the term “vaccine hesitancy”. They cannot allow for disconfirmation, so the assumed model is one camp are those who have accepted Covid and those who have yet to accept Covid. The latter group is just scared and uninformed, so it is incumbent upon the former group to guide them to the light. All of sudden. being an annoying pest about Covid is transformed into a righteous cause that proves to the believer that she is on the side of angels, saving mankind from evil.

Also note the communitarian aspect of modern mass movements. We have to sit in the dark and walk to work because we all share the same earth. If one person refuses to use those grimy canvas sacks, then we all suffer! Similarly, the vaccine is a community good that only works when everyone is vaccinated. As long as there is one disbeliever in our midst, we will continue to be punished. The only thing missing from the Covidian toolkit is the flagellants whipping themselves in public.

What Covid has revealed is that the only path out of the madness that is infecting the West is to sort out how to manage the fanatics. That is easier said than done, as it means creating a new religion and prying these people out of power. It also means that political power alone is not enough. As long as the fanatic population is left to operate like a hive without a queen, they will keep finding new queens. Usually, those queens will be seeking dominion of the rest of society.


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Ben the Layabout
Ben the Layabout
3 years ago

I spend a lot of time reading and debating all things COVID. The pro-vaccinate bias in the media is blatant, especially the US media. Virtually all the cases i the hospital are the unvaccinated, they’d have us believe. So run on down and get your jab like a good little sheep, won’t you please? As soon as everyone is innoculated, the pandemic is finished, we promise! Yet reports from among the most-vaxxed nations, Israel and the UK, would suggest a different story. Aside: in fairness to the vaxxes, from all I gather, they really Do provide reasonably good protection against… Read more »

Paintersforms
Paintersforms
3 years ago

So Fox News is saying Biden is doing this to save face for Afghanistan. If that’s true, it may be the worst political blunder I’ve lived to see. I really didn’t think tptb would be stupid enough to turn their ire on the people they claim to represent. Truly retarded stuff.

At this point it might be wise to assume worse-than-worst case. Hell, at this rate the US might collapse in months instead of years.

Dinothedoxie
Dinothedoxie
3 years ago

Ridicule is the way to break them out of the cult.

At least the ones that are salvageable – which is probably most of them.

Whiskey
Whiskey
3 years ago

The problem with creating a new religion is that the current one (Wokism) works quite well. I will offend everyone by offering an observation: the religion deifying black people in particular black thugs like George Floyd fills a real need and works structurally for real, physical reasons. Christianity spread in the West after the Fall of the Roman Empire, slowly, as it was a poor place and always less Christian than the East. But the ability of literate monks to act as clerks for the King while being unable to be rivals for the Throne was the secret sauce for… Read more »

Moran ya Simba
Moran ya Simba
Reply to  Whiskey
3 years ago

Very incisive comment, both about the spread of Christianity and about men and women.

370H55V
370H55V
Reply to  Whiskey
3 years ago

Cunts gotta cunt.

alpha beta
Reply to  370H55V
3 years ago

Made me guffaw out loud.

JR Wirth
JR Wirth
3 years ago

And faint shouts were heard across the land….”muh constitution! muh constitution!”…….

Alzaebo
Alzaebo
3 years ago

Oh, I believe. I believe we’re being boxed with a flurry of left-right, left-right blows into a corner. As Wild Geese said, the current upset will seem to be a nothingburger. There will be damage- a lot of damage- but it will be managed to impress upon the chickens the “seriousness of the threat.” After fake squawking by the teachers’ unions, the stupid-as-a-f*cking-stump conservatives will fall for it, and cheer the “win” of getting all our childruns back into school. There, they’ll get good ol’ 1965-style mass vaccination. It’s the same as muh polio, muh measles-mumps-rubella, right? And in 15… Read more »

The Wild Geese Howard
The Wild Geese Howard
Reply to  Alzaebo
3 years ago

Stargate SG-1 predicted mass sterilization via jab back in 2001:

https://stargate.fandom.com/wiki/2010_(episode)

I’m a little blackpilled by today’s events.

Thinking about trying to start a 3-D printing biz, maybe learn small engines.

My age-appropriate date had a big heart heart and more red flags than the PLA.

Off to the Gab no jab job board!

Dennis Roe
Dennis Roe
Reply to  Alzaebo
3 years ago

Start killin motherfuckers. We’re good at it, have been for thousands of years. Why do you think we’re the main target, the bullseye, you think the Termites are not aware who their only capable adversary is?

Lanky
Lanky
3 years ago

I have an infant son and I’m on the verge of losing my career due to mandates. Tell me again how these people aren’t insane? This is how I hear the shit they’re saying: “Oh, well. You’ll just have to lose your job if you don’t let us fuse your DNA with testicular stem cells from Kool Aid Guy. Too bad you don’t just agree with us like you should.” That *is* insanity. It is a contrived insanity, for sure, but one with profound resistance to popular inertia. And because it is an actual insanity,, It will continue to worsen… Read more »

B125
B125
Reply to  Lanky
3 years ago

My sympathy goes out to people like you. I happen to be in a weird stage, graduated college, but no family yet, but enough money saved up (and parents willing to take me back in) that even if I were to lose my job, it wouldn’t have too bad an impact. I can pick up this career where I left off whenever I want. So I will never be taking it, no matter what. But they are evil. Yes, evil. Trying to prevent decent White people from earning a living. Anybody pushing or promoting this needs to be — at… Read more »

Pozymandias
Reply to  B125
3 years ago

Just wanted to offer support and perhaps a little evidence that you’re not alone. My wife and I are among the never-vaxxers here in Oregon.

Lanky
Lanky
Reply to  Pozymandias
3 years ago

I don’t know. I feel a sense of unreality these days, and it almost comforts me to know I’m headed into dark country. These years will be wild and uncertain, but I know that I am called upon to survive.

I think that as they tighten their grip, we should extend our hands. Build brotherhoods and all that corny shit. Becauae when our people are reduced to poverty, and our children are displaced, having a network of guys (and gals too, though you’re in the parentheses) is crucial. I’m fine for now, but we’ll see.

Hemid
Hemid
Reply to  Pozymandias
3 years ago

My wife and I are dodging it too—and I’m a Jew (almost) and she’s a fed (approximately).

The propaganda has only gone in about 50%, even in my world, where almost everyone is a PMC NPC. Maybe it’s still too much for us to really resist, but the resistance is big, too. It doesn’t feel quite hopeless.

Luck to all our friends. Stay yourselves.

Norhoom Foul
Norhoom Foul
Reply to  B125
3 years ago

I too offer support. The position you are in is terrible. I hope this can work out for you without having to take what appears to be a very dangerous experimental concoction. I think back to when I was raising kids and had a mortgage and slavery-like financial responsibilities and how hard such a decision would be. I’m old enough and have enough put away to walk from my job (actually I’ll go through the game religious exemption attempt etc) and then let them terminate me.

3g4me
3g4me
Reply to  Lanky
3 years ago

Prayers to you, Lanky – and I know prayers don’t pay rent or buy food. Wish we could set up a financial support system for dissident right types facing unemployment. We couldn’t give a bunch, but we could give some. Thank God my husband works for a private company that could technically be considered separate companies and stay under 100 employees, although in a very broad interpretation they could be considered federal contractors, so who knows how many of us this may affect.

Bill
Bill
3 years ago

I still think that separation/secession— however improbable or hard to pull off it might be— is the only viable solution. The two sides are never going to agree, and any compromise would be unsatisfactory to both. This holds true for Covid, as well as the other issues which divide us: race, immigration, gun control.

JohnWayne
JohnWayne
Reply to  Bill
3 years ago

How can a solution be both “improbable or impossible to pull off” and viable?

Balkanization may actually be where we are headed.

Frip
Member
Reply to  JohnWayne
3 years ago

Balkanize me baby. I got no problem with that. Give like-minded whites Illinois, Indiana, Michigan and Ohio. We’ll take if from there. And stay the f**k out.

B125
B125
Reply to  Bill
3 years ago

It will be soft balkanization, at first.

Already seeing it in areas that follow COVID rules vs those that don’t. Muslim no go zones. Etc. The government can squeal all they want but suddenly nobody is listening, and the laws are not being enforced.

As things heat up, you will see non whites used as the biological weapons they are – open borders and immediate citizenship for non whites who sign up to go kill some mean racists.

Hi -Ya!
Hi -Ya!
Reply to  Bill
3 years ago

lets just start. See what happens .

Pozymandias
Reply to  Bill
3 years ago

I’ll offer a paraphrase of Sherlock Holmes – when you’ve ruled out the impossible the only thing left, no matter how difficult or improbable, is the answer. It’s become obvious to me that keeping the USA intact is simply impossible. I also think that even the most insane Leftists are going to realize that they can’t win the all-out tribal bloodbath that civil war would be. They might think that they’ll retain control of the military but eventually they’ll come to realize that civil war here would not be a big Hollywood war movie with lots of CGI explosions and… Read more »

Evil Sandmich
Evil Sandmich
3 years ago

Just to note that as I scan through the comments I keep reading “NTB” as “TNB”. I guess though that “NTB” is “TNB” but for white people.

Frip
Member
3 years ago

Zman: “If one person refuses to use those grimy canvas sacks, then we all suffer! Similarly, the vaccine is a community good that only works when everyone is vaccinated.” On certain issues the DRight has its own true believers / fanatics / paranoids. Many here can’t see the forest from the trees. As can be seen by faulty comparisons to the vaccine and my-body my-choice, or canvas sacks. Look folks. Clear your minds….The virus IS spreadable. It affects pretty much “everyone”. There’s a vaccine that can help. End of story. Yes, Lefty lies for a living. But Lefty doesn’t lie… Read more »

Carl B.
Carl B.
Reply to  Frip
3 years ago

Mind your own damn business, Karen

Frip
Member
Reply to  Carl B.
3 years ago

“Mind your own damn business, Karen.” That’s precisely it though. Covid19 is contagious. So your business is my business. It’s a jointly owned business. So the Karen thing is meaningless.

Anyway I’m not exactly strident about it. It’s only once every few months that I tell you guys to get the shot. Mainly because I know you’re an older group, hence vulnerable. If you were all 17 I wouldn’t even bring it up.

Carl B.
Carl B.
Reply to  Frip
3 years ago

Your “business” ends at the end of my nose. Any closer and by any measure it is assault.

KGB
KGB
Reply to  Frip
3 years ago

Except there’s no evidence anywhere that getting vaxxed hinders the spread. At that point your justification for demanding the jab evaporates.

Ben the Layabout
Ben the Layabout
Reply to  KGB
3 years ago

Even worse: it wears off in just a few months (hence the “need” for boosters, barely even proposed, much less started…) ; pretend immunity created by the jab actually encourages mutations that make the virus further resistant to the pretend immunity.

Ostei Kozelskii
Member
Reply to  Frip
3 years ago

You’re utterly and hopelessly full of shit, so bugger off.

Frip
Member
Reply to  Ostei Kozelskii
3 years ago

You’re not British. You’re some dork from Arizona. So stop saying bugger off.

B125
B125
Reply to  Frip
3 years ago

Why are the grimy canvas bag people getting so triggered today?

Nobody cares what container type you carry your groceries home in. The stupid part is the sudden anti plastic bag push (and ban) and dumb people acting like the grimy canvas bags are going to save planet earth.

Compsci
Compsci
Reply to  Frip
3 years ago

Wrong Frip. For the record in case there are others in this group so ignorant as you: The jab does not prevent infection, it—at best—prevents/reduces morbidity. This is admitted by the manufacturers and the CDC. This is not opinion. There is evidence, now widely repressed, that infected folk (vex’d or unvex’d) can spread this disease—hence the CDC’s continuation of masking and social distancing regardless of status. (They know what’s up, but fear to plainly state this for political reasons.) Israel has the highest percentage of vex’d population, for the longest time. They now report the majority of new Covid hospitalizations… Read more »

Lucius Sulla
Lucius Sulla
Reply to  Compsci
3 years ago

Regarding “ICU capacity”

You mentioned it, and our fat ass (((governor))) in Illinois uses ICU capacity as a reason to begin reinstating restrictions, masks, etc.

My question would be, if supposedly the main issue is having enough ICU beds for sick people, and it has supposedly been an issue since March of 2020, why have there been no investments in expanding ICUs? Couldn’t some of the trillions being printed go towards that, if in fact the “pandemic” revealed lacking ICU capacity in our society.

The obvious answer is of course that our rulers are stupid liars.

Compsci
Compsci
Reply to  Lucius Sulla
3 years ago

Actually, we have the excess capacity. It’s called the US Military. Trump sent hospital ships to the heavy infected areas. Sent the hospital corp to convert the Jacobs Javits center in NYC into a 1000 bed hospital complete with medical staff (military). You know what? It wasn’t needed!

artwest
artwest
Reply to  Compsci
3 years ago

Similar in the UK. So-called Nightingale Hospitals were set up in places like huge conference centres at the cost of millions. At most, one or two unnecessarily handled enough patients to provide a photo opportunity before being quietly dismantled. In reality the NHS virtually stopped treating anything other than the Magic Flu despite the fact that the vast majority of medical staff did not work in areas having anything to do with Covid. Hospital wards were empty and staff were so bored that they produced elaborately choreographed TikTok dance videos. Meanwhile anyone with anything like cancer was left to fend… Read more »

Frip
Member
Reply to  Compsci
3 years ago

“Wrong Frip. For the record in case there are others in this group so ignorant as you: The jab does not prevent infection.” I didn’t say it did. I simply said the vaccine “helps”. I’m careful not to exaggerate, or be too decisive on such a nebulous issue. I lack both the IQ and arrogance to think I’ve got it all figured out.

Dennis Roe
Dennis Roe
Reply to  Frip
3 years ago

Your right about lacking IQ, you got that figured out.

Compsci
Compsci
Reply to  Frip
3 years ago

No, you didn’t say that. What you said was “get the jab” because “we are all in this together”. Seems you had enough “figured out” to give advice to us poor benighted souls commenting here whom you deemed worthy of your enlighten advice. And now, when called on your ignorance—or more charitably, your poor reasoning—you wuss out by saying “I don’t have it all figured out”. Well, then shut the fuck up if you don’t have it figured out and don’t cajole others to do what you “haven’t figured out”. Nor imply they are stubborn, selfish individualists. I have yet… Read more »

Ben the Layabout
Ben the Layabout
Reply to  Compsci
3 years ago

Excellent albeit prolix post 🙂 I didn’t see a thing in error; it matches mostly what I read elsewhere.

I’m not sure if your “vex” was deliberate or not, but a good pun on the more common “vax” or “vaxx” which is of course short for “vaccine” or “vaccinate.”

Beyond doubt we are vexed in the original sense of that verb, as well as the entire situation being a vexxation! 😀

JohnWayne
JohnWayne
Reply to  Frip
3 years ago

“We ARE all in this together.”

One too many sips at happy hour, Frip? Noooo, we ARE not all in this together. It is us versus them. Wise up.

Frip
Member
Reply to  JohnWayne
3 years ago

I never drink before sundown. Secondly, I get the politics and the PTB will take advantage any chance they get. That’s why all I’m saying is something very narrow. Get a stinking shot. They’re not demanding that we kill our first born. They’re asking us to get a vaccine. Don’t loose sight of that. There’s a contagious virus running around. And you’re probably 78. So I suggest you do the right thing for you and everyone else. The risk vs. benefit thing is on the side of getting the vax. Ok, I’m done. I’ll talk no more about it till… Read more »

Salmon
Salmon
Reply to  Frip
3 years ago

How do people like you find this place?

LineInTheSand
LineInTheSand
Reply to  Salmon
3 years ago

Frip has been here from way back. There is no finer contrarian of questionable sobriety.

RoBG
RoBG
Reply to  Frip
3 years ago

You’re right. Not just every movement, but every person has an area of “enthusiasm” if not expertise. Every virus *is* contagious or you’d never hear of it. The problem with these vaccines is that they’re not sterilizing (preventing infection) and they *may* be driving the variants. Right now I haven’t seen enough data/studies either way. The one thing that keeps creeping up is vitamin D levels. The majority of hospitalizations. Get your levels checked.

Norhoom Foul
Norhoom Foul
Reply to  RoBG
3 years ago

CDC redefinitions. How stupid do they think the dirt people are THEN: “Vaccine: A product that stimulates a person’s immune system to produce immunity to a specific disease, protecting the person from that disease. Vaccines are usually administered through needle injections, but can also be administered by mouth or sprayed into the nose.Vaccine: A product that stimulates a person’s immune system to produce immunity to a specific disease, protecting the person from that disease. Vaccines are usually administered through needle injections, but can also be administered by mouth or sprayed into the nose. NOW: “Vaccine: A preparation that is used… Read more »

Dry end of the Titanic
Dry end of the Titanic
Reply to  Frip
3 years ago

Get fucked Frip. Fuck off back to the Guardian. What the fuck are you even doing here. Oh, there will be a Ted Kaczyinski of the unvaxed. It is inevitable. Someone who has watched multiple family members killed will flip out and lay waste.

Whitney
Member
Reply to  Frip
3 years ago

It’s hard to tell what’s true anymore because there been so many lies that they’re all layered and chaotic but I know a lot of people have had the vaccine and they’re all fine and I know a lot of people that have had covid and they’re all fine but what is abundantly clear is the people pushing these mandates are evil and you should not do what evil people tell you to do

JohnWayne
JohnWayne
Reply to  Whitney
3 years ago

Exactly so Whitney.

It’s a confusing situation to be in, when you can’t trust your government or the media. They have a monopoly on information and weaponize fear.

One gets the feeling that their lies are not so much to persuade as it is to disorient, divide, demoralize all in order to gain control. Less freedom, more tyranny is our future.

Ben the Layabout
Ben the Layabout
Reply to  Frip
3 years ago

For an absolutely nightmare scenario, consider the following: (to save time, read the section “Prevention”, 3rd paragraph) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marek's_disease All the vaccines against COVID-19 are “leaky” so far as I know. Substantial fraction of the total population is already vaxxed, topping 80-90% in some nations (Israel, UK, Iceland). To the best of my knowledge, the human race has never had a “leaky” vaccine used, at least widely. According to some pundits, such a future might REQUIRE endless booster or new jabs to keep the population resistant to the ever-mutating virus. Humans aren’t poultry. The type(s) of virus are very different. But… Read more »

Spingehra
Spingehra
3 years ago

Bronze pointed projectiles were a thing before polymer.
Still have a few.
A few tungsten core as well.

Memebro
Memebro
3 years ago

From the PopSci article: “We all need to recognize that people who are vaccine hesitant are not dumb. They’re not stupid or naïve,” says Piltch-Loeb Setting aside that these words of wisdom are flowing from the mouth of an hyphenated little hat wearer, it’s amazing how condescending people can sound, even when they are saying something perfectly true and reasonable. The premise that she starts off with is that her position is unquestionably the only true, just, and right position, the only position that can be reasonably be defended, and that her “well informed” audience need not doubt the justification… Read more »

Gauss
Gauss
3 years ago

“ HBD people embracing Covid suggests their interest in biology is something other than empirical.”

This remains a mystery. Why did these folks become confirmed Covidians and what is there interest in biology if not reality? I can understand it when females like hbdchick jump on the bandwagon but Cochran? He entirely lost his stuff in the early days of the panic and got strangely silent in mid-2020. He couldn’t keep the faith.

Hemid
Hemid
Reply to  Gauss
3 years ago

For the first time in our lives, the ruling class were wielding at-first-glance-plausible SCIENCE! and math against the irredeemables.

“The main chance,” our British almost-ancestors call it.

Whoops.

Ostei Kozelskii
Member
Reply to  Gauss
3 years ago

Z with a none-too-subtle shot across the bow of the USS Sailer.

Compsci
Compsci
Reply to  Gauss
3 years ago

Cochran lost it to be sure. And in losing it, lost my readership, but that’s OK because by reading Cochran I found Z-man!

If one looks at his (Cochran’s) postings, he was very, very, wrong in his predictions. Of course, he’ll attribute that to the “mitigation” efforts of the Fed’s and the States, but that’s BS. In his panic he called it wrong, bought off on the predictive models of frauds like UK’s Ferguson—who has been repeatedly discredited, and went from curmudgeon intellectual to scared old man.

Ben the Layabout
Ben the Layabout
Reply to  Compsci
3 years ago

I’m not familiar with him, but assume he, like me, was a Cassandra early in the pandemic. In defense of our thankfully wrong estimates of huge casualties, may I offer a quick defense? Early in 2020 we knew very little. We knew that a virus called SARS-CoV-2 had started a pandemic in Wuhan, China. Even early on, there was good reason to suspect an engineered virus. The first SARS virus had a fatality rate north of 10% (look it up).* Now imagine a lab-modified virus, to better infect humans and with other unknown tricks. Can you see why there may… Read more »

Dinothedoxie
Dinothedoxie
Reply to  Gauss
3 years ago

Som people in my family have become CoVidians. The allure is the same as it is for any cult. Hidden knowledge that makes the believer better than the doubters, plus community and feeling virtuous. One other thing, is cults almost always believe in some coming apocalypse. American culture has become an apocalypse mongering one over the last generation or so. Nuclear apocalypse, “another Vietnam”, The Y2 K delusions, the GWOT, BusHitler, the Great Depression and TEOTWAWKI, Obamacare, Bad Orange Man … Each in turn, and others was heralded as the beginning of the end – not just a problem or… Read more »

Spingehra
Spingehra
3 years ago

The equipment left in Afghanistan was gear given to the ANA, including the aircraft, coms gear and nvgs. It was theirs to keep.. Brass likely knew the ANA was going to fold. Just thought it would take a bit longer than it did. Or maybe they didn’t after all the upper echelon are all from Obama appointments. Woke .
New female four star appointed to ” combatant command” southern command a couple days ago.
You ain’t seen nothing yet.

trackback
3 years ago

[…] ZMan pulls back the curtain a bit. […]

James J. O'Meara
James J. O'Meara
3 years ago

What is it with ZMan and “grimy canvas bags”? It’s a real tell for his writing. You know, you can wash the bags. Did someone threaten you with a canvas bag when you were a little ZMan? It’s like the conservative writers who signal their worldview by sneering at “men wearing sandals” while idolizing Caesar and Jesus. One of these guys wrote a whole column, I think in NR or Am Conserv, spewing vitriol at some guy he saw wearing sandals at some event. “People like him” were nothing but “foot fetishists.” I pointed out to him that it’s the… Read more »

Spingehra
Spingehra
Reply to  James J. O'Meara
3 years ago

Seattle or Portland ?

KGB
KGB
Reply to  James J. O'Meara
3 years ago

Are you similarly triggered by “men in sundresses”?

LineInTheSand
LineInTheSand
Reply to  James J. O'Meara
3 years ago

I agree with James. If I can prevent plastic bags in landfills or oceans, I will.

I guess that Z is reacting to the fact that before the busybodies had Covid to fixate on, they fixated on reusable grocery bags and recycling.

While I’m a global warming skeptic, I can live with the busybodies focusing their neuroses on pragmatic environmentalism.

james wilson
james wilson
Reply to  LineInTheSand
3 years ago

Global warming is bullshit. One can only be skeptical of a thing that owns some level of respectability. To be a skeptic gives them respect.

Apex Predator
Apex Predator
Reply to  LineInTheSand
3 years ago

“I agree with James. If I can prevent plastic bags in landfills or oceans, I will.” But what you won’t prevent is the massive carbon emissions generated by the trucks that haul all your recycled shit to the processing plant and the plant itself spewing even more massive amounts of carbon into the atmosphere to ‘recycle’ thereby creating an equal, but different, ecological impact. Not to pick on you but this is why liberals are sort of stupid. They know -just enough- about science to be dangerous and ignorant of actual science yet follow it like a religion. Don’t be… Read more »

LineInTheSand
LineInTheSand
Reply to  Apex Predator
3 years ago

Good response. Implicit in your response is that we should avoid “massive carbon emissions.” Does that mean that you believe in climate change?

It’s not a gotcha question. I just want to be a pragmatic environmentalist, which entails a rational weighing of tradeoffs.

Paintersforms
Paintersforms
Reply to  Apex Predator
3 years ago

It’s amazing how many modern evils sprang from the miracle of oil.

Ben the Layabout
Ben the Layabout
Reply to  Apex Predator
3 years ago

Well said. Sometimes if recycling comes up as a topic, I say something like “I support it in principle. The problem is that it usually makes no sense economically. If it did, it would be more widely implemented.” To this date, the only product I recycle is aluminum. It’s one of the very few consumer goods that are viable to do so.

As you’ve done in your example, you can even state the costs in energy inputs or pollution outputs.

I first learned the above wisdom in a book written in 1973 🙂

RoBG
RoBG
Reply to  LineInTheSand
3 years ago

“Your Cotton Tote is Pretty Much the Worst Replacement for a Plastic Bag” https://tinyurl.com/fc57j6pz The issue w/ plastic bags, as you mentioned, is that they end up killing wildlife and polluting the oceans. They shouldn’t be recycled (w/ is almost impossible) but incinerated.

LineInTheSand
LineInTheSand
Reply to  RoBG
3 years ago

Helpful link. If I read the article correctly then what it says it that if I am more concerned about pollution than climate change then I should use reusable grocery bags. Agree?

RoBG
RoBG
Reply to  LineInTheSand
3 years ago

It’s not my area of expertise. My takeaway was when it comes to the cotton bags you have to factor in land usage (cotton v. other crops or trees, water, pesticides, etc.) as opposed to the various plastic industries, as well as the recyclers. All factions have powerful lobbies, but only one has social approval. A pox on all their houses!

Alzaebo
Alzaebo
Reply to  RoBG
3 years ago

They should be replaced with biodegradeable hemp plastics.

3g4me
3g4me
Reply to  LineInTheSand
3 years ago

Line – consider the difference between being a Gaia disciple or earth firster, and a ‘good steward.’ The first involves worshipping the creation; the second involves acknowledging one’s right (one might say God-given right) to utilize the world’s goods, but not to waste or wantonly destroy them. Plastic bags are not the hill to die on. I reuse mine as bathroom garbage bags, or stuff I don’t want in my disposal garbage bags.

Ostei Kozelskii
Member
Reply to  3g4me
3 years ago

They’re indispensable as receptacles for cat stoonk.

jrod
jrod
Reply to  Ostei Kozelskii
3 years ago

… and dog (stoonk?) I regularly grab a big bunch of the plastic bags at the grocery store. Two dogs x three walks/day = much stoonk.

Getthemoneyfromtheseskels
Getthemoneyfromtheseskels
Reply to  LineInTheSand
3 years ago

Pragmatic?

Please, our local “recycling” goes to landfills. Yet, my elderly grandfather was ticketed, $150.00, because he put an empty soup can in the blue bin.

” I can live with the busybodies…”

Go ahead, you live with them. Among them.

LineInTheSand
LineInTheSand
Reply to  Getthemoneyfromtheseskels
3 years ago

If, in fact, recycling goes to landfills then my opinion changes. However, if we could have real recycling would you object to it?

I am not a fan of busybodies but there is no easy way to be free of them. If they are obsessing over preventing pollution then I just can’t get too worked up over it.

Dinothedoxie
Dinothedoxie
Reply to  LineInTheSand
3 years ago

Real recycling is too labor intensive.

It is mostly done where it is economical.
In third world countries where poor peopl can spend all day combing through garbage piles. And in industrial settings where the waste is uniform enough to require little post discard sorting.

The one are that could see expanded recycling is of yard waste – again because it can be dumped together into a compost heap with minimal manual sorting.

The consumer waste recycling though is complete bs kabuki.

Compsci
Compsci
Reply to  LineInTheSand
3 years ago

Prohibiting plastic bags is anything *but* “pragmatic environmentalism”. It is virtue signaling, pure and simple.

Frip
Member
Reply to  James J. O'Meara
3 years ago

“It’s like the conservative writers who signal their worldview by sneering at “men wearing sandals” while idolizing Caesar and Jesus.” Lamest take I’ve heard in a long time. So lame it’s funny ridiculous. You’re really proud of yourself for spotting this hidden “hypocrisy” huh. LOL. I bet you’ve been repeating it for a couple of decades now.

UsNthem
UsNthem
3 years ago

Back in the day when Popular Science was actually about real science, was there ever an article penned by a wammen? What a bunch of feel good crap in that one. Yeah, they’ll be all warm and fuzzy explaining why you and your kids need to get the vax – for now. Give it time – pretty soon it’ll be get it or else.

Ben the Layabout
Ben the Layabout
Reply to  UsNthem
3 years ago

As I’ve already splashed about this thread, a lot may happen in the next 7 months. Already a sizeable majority of the population in advanced nations is jabbed with the experimental product (mRNA, other), using a type of vaccine never used in humans, against a (probably) genetically engineered virus. The virus is mutating. The vax does NOT stop it from spreading. It also wears off in a few months, unfortunately just in time for peak “flu” season for hundreds of millions in the Northern Hemisphere. As they said in “Game of Thrones”: Winter is coming. Let’s hope I’m still doing… Read more »

Frip
Member
3 years ago

Good post from yesterday. Z is right about Liz Holmes. No stable-minded man would look twice at her. Her face isn’t ugly. But her face is so weird it may as well be ugly. Like if you put a cat’s head on a human, the cat head isn’t ugly but it’s so weird it doesn’t matter. It’s too bad most men don’t have top-notch creep-radar like women do. Because there are creepy women out there. Well, I guess we just call them crazy. Still, Holmes reaches creep levels. That’s saying a lot for a woman. The passage below from Z… Read more »

KGB
KGB
Reply to  Frip
3 years ago

I can’t believe that no one on the left has decided to cancel Holmes simply because she used the “white power” gesture in all those magazine spreads.

comment image?crop=1500%2C1000%2C0%2C0&resize=685

LineInTheSand
LineInTheSand
Reply to  Frip
3 years ago

Outside of mathematics and the hard sciences, abductive reason is often our only tool.

For example, all of history is abductive reasoning, of necessity. You don’t have a control group. You can’t do multiple, identical trials. You have no self-evident axioms from which to draw deductions.

(More importantly, Frip, if you meet Holmes in a bar, would you hit on her?)

Frip
Member
Reply to  LineInTheSand
3 years ago

No. I’d sooner hit on Larry Holmes than Liz Holmes. Maybe when I was a naive teenager I would have (assuming she didn’t do the scary deep voice). But even as early as college I wised up to the danger of disturbed women. And just as importantly knew how to spot them. Tried to warn a few friends. But guys in the 90’s and before were pretty blind. These days people are more aware of the signs. I do think YouTube makes people smarter. Even young teens are hip to the knowledge of all the personality disorders. Borderlines, Histrionics, Narcissists,… Read more »

The Greek
The Greek
Reply to  Frip
3 years ago

It’s not her look. That voice. Wow. It was like I was watching a high school play with a girl that got cast as a cowboy, and now she’s trying to talk with a deep voice. Truly bizzaro.

3g4me
3g4me
3 years ago

Here’s a very nice essay. I am definitely in this gentleman’s camp. A born contrarian.
https://pushingrubberdownhill.com/2021/09/08/everything-they-have-told-you-is-a-lie/

Glenfilthie
Glenfilthie
Member
Reply to  3g4me
3 years ago

Holy chit. I need to read more of his stuff…

Spingehra
Spingehra
Reply to  3g4me
3 years ago

WSRA is a regular stop.

JR Wirth
JR Wirth
3 years ago

A perfect example of this is the removal of the General Lee statue in Richmond. It wasn’t just removed. It was cut into pieces…and right away. I had to pull up more articles to to make sure I was reading that correctly. The vicious nature of the unrestrained feminine mind can be encapsulated in that one event. The same mind of the feminist who gets an abortion and enjoys watching her baby ripped apart (they exist). Events like this lay the foundation for counter revolution. May it come soon.

Enoch Cade
Enoch Cade
Reply to  JR Wirth
3 years ago

It can’t some soon enough. And every statue of MLKangz will be dealt with appropriately.

David Wright
Member
Reply to  JR Wirth
3 years ago

All those witch stories from the past have a lot of based reality to them. Reminds me of a friend years ago who broke up with a woman , living together. Everything was not just thrown out the window, but shredded, torn, and busted up before it was tossed. And that was just the beginning.
Forwarned is forearmed.

Felix Krull
Member
Reply to  David Wright
3 years ago

All those witch stories from the past have a lot of based reality to them.

Yes. Apart from a few high-profile witch hunts in the Protestant world, witches were not burned for congregation with the devil (the idea that it was at all possible, was in itself heresy to the Catholics) but for “maleficium”, which is to say poison-related crimes.

People at the time understood you could commit murder with certain herbs, and without proper forensic science (autopsies being forbidden) it could be extremely hard to prove, except circumstantially.

The majority of the witches burned were probably guilty as hell.

SidVic
SidVic
Reply to  JR Wirth
3 years ago

I wonder if anyone saved the pieces? Nice little dissident art propaganda project. Maybe add stitches and crudely reattach parts. Like a zombie Lee. The south will rise again, one way or another, would be a good title. Man, I really have developed a deep and abiding hatred for these MFers.

Felix Krull
Member
Reply to  SidVic
3 years ago

You could make bullets out of him. Or casings, at any rate.

Spingehra
Spingehra
Reply to  Felix Krull
3 years ago

Bronze pointed projectiles were a thing before polymer.
Still have a few.
A few tungsten core as well.

B125
B125
Reply to  JR Wirth
3 years ago

We’re ruled by evil people who despise us.

The person they really want to cut up is *you*.

We are foreigners in our own lands.

usNthem
usNthem
Reply to  JR Wirth
3 years ago

Yeah and they’re apparently going to bury a time capsule in the space that includes an expired vial of Pfizer “vaccine”, blm sticker, lgbtq pin and a photo of a black ballerina with fist raised in front of or near the original statue, among others. That should really excite future historians… It’s getting harder these days to put into words how I feel about these f******.

Anonymous White Male
Anonymous White Male
3 years ago

Leftists are the most fervent believers. However, they do not view themselves as believers. They view themselves as rational, science oriented, educated people. They do not think that their beliefs are just another manifestation of religion, even though they are. Its why the accusation of hypocrisy is wasted on the left. I admit there are exceptions, but these exceptions usually lead the believer from the left to the right as they age. The left’s hypocrisy is evident in their insistence on universal vaccination. Even the most “righteous” of believers notices that not that many people have died from Covid. And… Read more »

OrangeFrog
OrangeFrog
Reply to  Anonymous White Male
3 years ago

We need only remember one thing about these types: they are either agents of evil – dupes – or, they are actively evil doing it for some well-known reason. Let us get back onto our moral high ground where we belong. To hell with logic and reason. Want safe and affordable family formation for white families? Want a government that is firm but fair, and punishes actual crimes; you know, like thievery, rape, murder and vandalism? How about one that does not let unrestrained financiers and the like wreak havoc? Want the chance to be as self-sufficient as possible? Or… Read more »

David Wright
Member
Reply to  OrangeFrog
3 years ago

There is going to have to be a lot of Braveheart moments on our side to thwart all of this. Not going to be romantic and heroic looking but will have to happen often.

SidVic
SidVic
Reply to  David Wright
3 years ago

Braveheart, or chamberlain’s bayonet charge. I say this as a southerner.

miforest
miforest
Reply to  OrangeFrog
3 years ago

Orangefrog! youa re a man after my own heart! I am old, and have adult kids and young grandkids . the idea that we are going to fix the world is hubris. My kid and their friends see the disfunction and talk to me about it sometimes. I give them the same advice : faith , family , and friends . I am trad (latin mass) cath. Roosh seems to think the eastern ortho is good.
I have been blessed.

UsNthem
UsNthem
Reply to  Anonymous White Male
3 years ago

No kidding. And just watching those two Australian politicians pontificating, unchallenged about how the unvaxxed will soon be completely cut out of society is fairly chilling. We will be the “virus” that needs to be eradicated if we can’t be re-educated.

Compsci
Compsci
Reply to  UsNthem
3 years ago

Agreed, but there will have to be a lot of repression of current data developing wrt vexing and Corona. Little to do with the unvex’d, much to do with rejection of observable reality. As one of the unvex’d, I am in the crosshairs, albeit not economically as I am retired. All around me—family included—are vex’d, but they dare not say much to me. It’s somewhat enjoyable even to remind them that they now need their “booster” shots to remain in good standing or to show them my CDC vex card (made on my computer in a couple of hours) and… Read more »

JerseyJeffersonian
JerseyJeffersonian
Reply to  Compsci
3 years ago

Compsci,

I, too, am retired, and so far not subject to The Politburo That Calls Itself “Biden” and their diktats. But only so far. If they can make these “vaccinations” inexcapable to all who take federal government money, even in the capacity of a contractor, why not anyone who receives Social Security or the like? “We’re all in this together”, right? Even if it were to be justified as “for your own good, as one of our valued seniors?

This was a bad thought, but do you think that these mutants and sociopaths would hesitate to play that card?

usNthem
usNthem
Reply to  JerseyJeffersonian
3 years ago

I’ve heard that idea raised somewhere along with a bunch of other, shall we say, draconian leftard fantasies. Hopefully, stuff like that won’t come to fruition, but after bite-me’s little speech today and seeing what’s going on in the land of OZ, I wouldn’t rule out anything.

Compsci
Compsci
Reply to  JerseyJeffersonian
3 years ago

There is nothing they won’t do if they feel they can get away with it. But that’s always been the case, or the fear, in the back ground. Has it not?

Someone has to stand up and say no. This line will not be crossed. Resistance (passive) entails receiving retribution from the authorities. As old as Thoreau and Gandhi. I’m not looking to be a martyr, but I can also think of no one better positioned.

Evil Sandmich
Evil Sandmich
Reply to  Anonymous White Male
3 years ago

The re-phrasing is getting interesting. Knowing that the vax doesn’t actually keep the vaxxed from making others sick they’ve resorted to some veiled community appeal along the lines of “the vax helps You, and just so you know, your family, your community, and all that other stuff that we’ve spent decades destroying, they need You! So please think of all the Guatemalans and Afghans we’re dumping into your community and get the jab,” It reminds me of something Severian said along the lines (though I didn’t quite believe) that the regime would at some point have to make an appeal… Read more »

Norham Foul
Norham Foul
Reply to  Anonymous White Male
3 years ago

Hypocrisy does not matter to these people. An ex-friend-a mutual cancellation-reveled in removing of public displays that he thought had anything to do with white supremacy. Aside, and today, he has likely ejaculated hearing that the Lee statue has been scrapped. He, alumni of the graduate school represented by not only the inverted crotch, but by other noted fellow alumni: The Idiot, the Idiots Father, Bones of Skull and Bones, and our once rapist in chief, did explain to me that I don’t understand “nuance,” when I pointed out to him that his alma Matas namesake should be abolished as… Read more »

Ben the Layabout
Ben the Layabout
Reply to  Anonymous White Male
3 years ago

I can dig it! You forgot Matt Busby. 😀

G
G
3 years ago

If we want to win, we will have to get some of the fanatics onto *our* side.

We will have to religionize our thing, just like they do.

Mike Austin
Reply to  G
3 years ago

I don’t want them on our side. Ever. Lines have been drawn, and they are on the wrong side. Even if we let them in, who is to say they won’t flip back again? They have already shown they are unstable if not insane.

btp
Member
Reply to  Mike Austin
3 years ago

This is merely the CivNat complaint: Golly, if we do identity politics, we’re just like them!

Nonsense. Fanaticism for a just cause is just.

Compsci
Compsci
Reply to  btp
3 years ago

Don’t let your “virtues” be used against you. Leave them at the door, pick them up when you leave.

Hemid
Hemid
Reply to  G
3 years ago

In case you missed it—

A minor irrational temptation to let your believer flag fly escaped from the lab recently, and at least half of /ourguys/ leapt at the chance to become /theirfanatics/.

Harshly selecting against that trait might be job #0.

JR Wirth
JR Wirth
3 years ago

I don’t understand how this can be done in a liberal democratic framework. When John Adams coined the phrase about democracy “exhausting and murdering itself”…talk about being on point. I told a friend yesterday that I could handle a paternalistic dictatorship. Just keep your mouth shut about the power elite, and you’re free to go about your day. But what we have is a maternalistic dictatorship. “Mommy spank unless you take your vaccine and wear mask”….”Mommy spank with breathalyzer tests at the DUI checkpoint.”…. “mommy spank if you use plastic grocery bags.”…etc. etc…forever…. The hive mind is a feminine mind.… Read more »

Felix Krull
Member
Reply to  JR Wirth
3 years ago

Mommy doesn’t spank. Mommy is never angry, mommy is DISAPPOINTED!

JR Wirth
JR Wirth
Reply to  Felix Krull
3 years ago

A forced vaccine is a spank, among other things. She’s disappointed when she’s not spanking.

Felix Krull
Member
Reply to  JR Wirth
3 years ago

But that’s the point: they’re not going to force you to jab, not even the Australians do that. They’re just going to shame you and make your life difficult.

JR Wirth
JR Wirth
Reply to  Felix Krull
3 years ago

The good libertarians would say “well, that’s the free market. Just get a new job!” or, “well, that’s the free market, just stop flying.” The same people who never seem to have real jobs. It’s all so laughable these days.

Felix Krull
Member
Reply to  Felix Krull
3 years ago

Just so. Nobody forces you to work.

UsNthem
UsNthem
Reply to  Felix Krull
3 years ago

Don’t be so sure.

Compsci
Compsci
Reply to  Felix Krull
3 years ago

Making your life difficult (coercion) is just the first step. We saw this scenario play out in 1967 when the Surgeon General finally said that smoking was bad for you. Somewhere about 60-66% of US adults smoked at that time. Way too many citizens to crack the whip on, so they went with education campaigns—warnings on cigarettes, commercials against, commercials for banned, etc. Then the number of smokers began to drop, but the efforts ratcheted up, not down. The severity of anti-smoking methods increased—new age limits for sale, tighter enforcement, banning in public buildings, false arguments against “second-hand smoke” in… Read more »

Felix Krull
Member
Reply to  Felix Krull
3 years ago


But they still don’t force you. That’s the beautiful part, they give Normie an ethical lifeline to cling to, they can tell themselves that nobody forced them to do anything.

If you made it mandatory, half of the Covidians would abscond.

Compsci
Compsci
Reply to  Felix Krull
3 years ago

“ But they still don’t force you. That’s the beautiful part,…”

Stop that Felix, you’re screwing with my head again… 😉

norham Foul
norham Foul
Reply to  JR Wirth
3 years ago

“”Men just aren’t the same today”
I hear ev’ry mother say
They just don’t appreciate that you get tired
They’re so hard to satisfy
You could tranquilize your mind
So go running for the shelter of a mother’s little helper
And four help you through the night
Help to minimize your plight

Doctor please, some more of these
Outside the door, she took four more
What a drag it is getting old” Rolling Stones

LineInTheSand
LineInTheSand
3 years ago

Z’s premise is that the “need to believe” trait is inherent and distributed through people on a spectrum. I agree. Therefore, we either shape that need to believe in people or are the victims of it. There is no “live and let live” option (unless you can create a community that selects for that trait).

Imagine the Covidians devoting all that energy to our causes. Control of the media is everything.

Felix Krull
Member
3 years ago

I’m not entirely sure I buy the premise. If NTB was a constant, you’d expect more New Age bullshit in atheist Northern Europe than in Christian America. I have no idea whether that’s the case or not, but it’s not like America lacks New Age religions.

Also, there’s an important difference between Christians and Covidians (and Climaticans etc.). Christians are specifically asked to take their improbable stories on blind faith, the Covidians believe there’s an observable, measurable scientific basis for their weird behavior. Faucism isn’t a religion, it’s an induced mass neurosis, a grotesque over-emphasis on a single, tiny problem.

Apex Predator
Apex Predator
Reply to  Felix Krull
3 years ago

You are presuming there is a great deal of daylight between mass delusion & religion and I’m here to tell you that there really is not. I think you are splitting hairs a bit here but the two resemble each other to such a degree that in many ways they are indistinguishable. I do agree with you that the Scientism is strong with these people because they fancy themselves ‘above’ the religious rubes but that is just faith of a different stripe. Particularly since they go right along with the cherry picking and careful curating of this ‘science’ to fit… Read more »

Felix Krull
Member
Reply to  Apex Predator
3 years ago

You are presuming there is a great deal of daylight between mass delusion & religion and I’m here to tell you that there really is not. Seen from the outside, perhaps. But if you ask a thoughtful, honest Christian why he believes in God, he’ll eventually acknowledge that it’s all about faith and evidence be damned. A Covidian would never confess to such a thing; blind faith is anathema to him, even if he engages in it. It’s an important spiritual difference even if the outcomes look the same: if the high priests of scientism came out tomorrow and declared… Read more »

Felix Krull
Member
Reply to  Felix Krull
3 years ago

if the high priests of scientism came out tomorrow and declared victory over Corona, 90% of the Covidians would just go home.

This happened in Denmark, Sweden and Finland.

Here in Copenhagen, it happened virtually overnight. One day they gave you the evil eye for not wearing a face diaper in the supermarket, the next day nobody wore masks.

Compsci
Compsci
Reply to  Felix Krull
3 years ago

Felix, I thought that day would arrive here—particularly after the last election—but alas, I’m still waiting. Seems there is still use for Covid hysteria. Or perhaps they are riding the Tiger and now realize they have no safe way to get off.

Felix Krull
Member
Reply to  Felix Krull
3 years ago

To be honest, I might have overstated my case a bit: to be clear, the vaccine is still being pushed and my 13 and 14 yo. nephews ask their parents why they aren’t vaxxed like their friends. Also, they’ve started offering booster shots to geezers. I suspect the lockdowns will be back when the flu season kicks in.

The most surprising to me was that they scrapped the vax pass – the whole point of this plandemic. Maybe they had problems with the software solution.

JR Wirth
JR Wirth
Reply to  Felix Krull
3 years ago

It amazes me how “facts” are interpreted these days. The moon is a white sphere in the sky. It must be a large wheel of cheese. A storm blew through town, the earth is warming.

Good ol' Rebel
Good ol' Rebel
Reply to  Felix Krull
3 years ago

Felix, what is the Swedish women’s government’s self-sacrifice on the alter of egalitarianism if not a religious rite? It is downright Abrahamic, giving not only their sons, but their entire civilization as a sacrifice to their deity. What was the Bader-Meinhoff RAF group, if not the progressive Knights Templar, waging holy war against the Great Satan of capitalism? Northern Europe is awash, in fact down right lousy with religious fervor. They just all worship the God of this world… Also, a number of the Branch Davidians were Europeans. And excepting France, NW europe managed to expel many of the strongest… Read more »

Good ol' Rebel
Good ol' Rebel
Reply to  Good ol' Rebel
3 years ago

And apologies for self reply, but it is on topic. Felix, yiu are somewhat correct: salvation is possible only by excepting the gift of Christ’s sacrifice. However, existence was created and shaped by God. As such, both reality and our nature conform to belief in Christ and the word of God in the bible. For example, the first act of man is to form a stable monogomous heterosexual union with woman – the proper basis for civilization and any stable society. The curse of Adam is to labor hard for his sustenance – acceptance of this nature of our men… Read more »

Good ol' Rebel
Good ol' Rebel
Reply to  Good ol' Rebel
3 years ago

Satan is in the autocowreckd. ACCEPTING the gift of Christ…

Felix Krull
Member
Reply to  Good ol' Rebel
3 years ago

Felix, what is the Swedish women’s government’s self-sacrifice on the alter of egalitarianism if not a religious rite?

That’s how you and I may see it, but it’s not how they see it themselves, they see it as building a perfect society, based on entirely secular reasons.

If you tell a Christian he’s engaging in religion, he’ll heartily agree. If you tell a Covidian the same, he’ll vehemently protest, that’s the nub of it.

Good ol' Rebel
Good ol' Rebel
Reply to  Felix Krull
3 years ago

Sure, but you are conflating something there: “religion” is a double plus ungood thing. They would have the same reaction to calling it “racist.” If you called covidianism an “ethics-founded system of beliefs,” they would nod along (unless they see the end point).

amr
amr
3 years ago

One task for those who would rebuild society from its ruins is to address the destruction of Western Civilization’s literary, artistic, philosophical, theological, and architectural output. The ruling class cult seeks to destroy all such output, and uses ritualized behaviorism to do it. Consider the increasing attacks on library collections. An Ontario school board conducted a ‘flame purification’ ceremony that burned 30 books in a symbolic gesture and destroyed or ‘recycled’ (there’s a euphemism for you) 4,700 other books from library shelves: https://nationalpost.com/news/canada/book-burning-at-ontario-francophone-schools-as-gesture-of-reconciliation-denounced Libraries are currently being purged and museum collections are next. The greatest difficulty with this is that… Read more »

Reynard
Reynard
Member
Reply to  amr
3 years ago

I agree with this. Part of my “awakening” was in reading the classics and buying used several used books on a single topic and analyzing how the perspective changes through the generations (For instance the opening of a sociology book throughout time: “Man has always had the urge to explore” > “Man has always stared up at the sky in wonder” > “Human-beings are social animals” >”It takes a village…”) You can’t understand any topic properly without first placing it into context and understanding its origins and growth from all angles. All that is impossible when the old texts are… Read more »

3g4me
3g4me
Reply to  amr
3 years ago

amr: I rage at the cultural destruction, but fear you are wildly over-optimistic regarding who might save the remnants of Western Civilization. Women are in charge of most museums today and are directing the destruction in pursuit of cultural and racial piety. Women are the ones who burn or destroy their boyfriends’ or husbands’ old letters or photos from prior girlfriends or wives. It was not women who saved the works of the ancients that we have knowledge of today – rather, it was men – Christian men – who studied and copied ancient knowledge. And observe the celebrants of… Read more »

amr
amr
Reply to  3g4me
3 years ago

I see your point (and agree about the time capsule – horrifying). I think men will be at the forefront of any endeavor to save our civilization, and I suspect the formation of male-only groups will be a big part of this. Paul famously restricted the presence of women in leadership roles in the early church and for my part, having witnessed the degradation of female behavior and influence in society, I see his point. But there will always be a need for women of virtue. Their influence on the maturation of children cannot be avoided, and if women are… Read more »

toastedposts
toastedposts
Reply to  amr
3 years ago

If viewing things through the lens of religion, then the public library system throughout the United States is an expression of an older better religion that was alive and active in this country (and most of the western world) in the 19th and 20th centuries. They are temples: expressions of the ideals of people who saw the world in a certain way. A way that I have a lot of resonance with myself. Who could look at the Klementinium Praha or Trinity College Library, or even the more modern examples and doubt that the societies involved tried to do honor… Read more »

Melissa
Melissa
3 years ago

The covid hysteria truly manifests not only the madness of the true believers but the tremendous division which exists. It’s as though we live in a parallel universe. Masks are fairly scarce where I live and covid doesn’t seem to be on the minds of many people. For the believers, it is a way to radiate their deep and glowing virtue to the world. Many have dedicated much of their lives demanding for the right to murder their unborn babies. Now they simply wear a mask to save lives. I had to travel on a plane recently and the incessant… Read more »

3g4me
3g4me
Reply to  Melissa
3 years ago

Melissa: My son accompanied me on few errands yesterday and even he commented that we two were the only unmasked people in the store. DFW is a hotbed of wokism, filled with pious White women and various NY and Cali refugees. As for abortion, opinions vary widely, but how terribly . . . convenient . . . for ConservativeInc to resurrect that particular losing crusade at this time. One can just hear them rubbing their hands and sneering “That will get those rubes back into the voting booth.” And unfortunately, they’re largely correct. White children becoming a hated minority and… Read more »

Evil Sandmich
Evil Sandmich
Reply to  3g4me
3 years ago

Yeah that abortion ruling sure seemed staged. The regime gives up something very, almost microscopically, minor and in exchange it gets normie-cons to pump some faith back into the system (“just one more Supreme Court justice”) and enflames their leftwing base while redirecting them from having to run cover for an illegitimate government being run by an Alzheimer’s patient.

Melissa
Melissa
Reply to  3g4me
3 years ago

3g4me:
Spot on regarding conservative inc. There is a reason the Zman’s most pinned gab refers to the traitors at National Review. Forever conserving their egos and their reputations among those on the left.

Glenfilthie
Glenfilthie
Member
3 years ago

Christianity has not collapsed.

At best, it’s gone dormant.

David Wright
Member
Reply to  Glenfilthie
3 years ago

As it has numerous times through millennia.

sentry
sentry
Reply to  Glenfilthie
3 years ago

I could say the same about the pagan religions, they never collapsed, they went dormant.

I am of the opinion christianity will retract, but won’t go away entirely, kinda how the vikings were still able to exist a 1000 years in the christian era.

Jack Boniface
Jack Boniface
Member
3 years ago

By queens “seeking dominion of the rest of society,” do you mean Buttigieg?

Reynard
Reynard
Member
3 years ago

I think the Left tends to have more true believers, berserkers. Perhaps calling them Hystericals or Histrionics (Hystrionic?) would be more appropriate. The Right meanwhile has its fair share of Gruggs. Hystericals and Gruggs will always exist, and they can become useful actors in society, but they should never be left to their own devices. The church and the military knew how to deal with these types and guide their energy towards mostly peaceful and utilitarian means. For a long time the modern Left was adept at manipulating that crazy, histrionic behavior to suit its needs. But lately they seem… Read more »

Not My Usual Pen Name
Not My Usual Pen Name
Reply to  Reynard
3 years ago

??? “Grugg is a level 50 NPC that can be found in Tiragarde Sound. This NPC can be found in Tiragarde Sound. In the NPCs category. Added in World of Warcraft: Battle for Azeroth.” ???

Mow Noname
Mow Noname
Reply to  Reynard
3 years ago

Thank you, Mr. Reynard.

Word for the day is “grugg”. I’ve always wondered where I fit in this world of ours. Now I know that I am a high functioning grug: ambitious enough to read the Z Man blog, cautious enough not to join a Tea Party rally or US Capital protest.

Reynard
Reynard
Member
Reply to  Mow Noname
3 years ago

I know I could benefit to unleash more of my inner-grugg. A peaceful, high-functioning society can exist without Hystericals. But greatness is not possible or sustainable without gruggery. We betray and reject gruggery at our own peril.

Spingehra
Spingehra
Reply to  Reynard
3 years ago

Who exactly is we? As a “grug” as some of you here put it, I’ve been around long enough to know a couple things.
Those who claim to be intellectuals usually
Are full of s**t . And those who crave leadership are always the last to follow.

Reynard
Reynard
Member
Reply to  Spingehra
3 years ago

“We” as in the DR, and whatever it is that unites us here on this comment section. I’m not an intellectual, nor do I think I’m fully grugg. I hit the gym, prep, and also enjoy intellectual pursuits. I was always an athlete and somewhat gruggish, but I’ve also gone through cringey unmerited pretentious phases. Overall I aspire to live by my values, and preserve and pass on a more traditional culture. I’m currently trying to create a community of like-minded people as my wife and I prepare for children. Maybe that’s the definition of most of us in the… Read more »

Vizzini
Member
3 years ago

“… the amazing overlap in people who worship Gaia and those who are now Covidians…”

As I’ve quipped before, the same people:

“GMO foods? Heck no! That stuff will kill you!”
“Inject a poorly-tested GMO substance into my body? Sounds great! Sign me up! Times 3! (and counting)”

Not My Usual Pen Name
Not My Usual Pen Name
Reply to  Vizzini
3 years ago

“GMO foods? Heck no! That stuff will kill you!”

“Inject a poorly-tested GMO substance into my body? Sounds great! Sign me up! Times 3! (and counting)”

I hate to embrace muh inner Darwinian Nihilist, but eventually there comes a day of genetic reckoning for these existential flaws in Our Race.

3g4me
3g4me
Reply to  Vizzini
3 years ago

Vizzini: I’ve been reading a great deal about off-grid living (although at the rate things are going we are likely to have to live on our raw land in a tent). I want redundant systems because I don’t have faith in the grid and don’t trust non-Whites and women to keep things running, not because I eschew electricity and modern plumbing. Instead I’m treated to an endless litany of composting toilets, living in a tiny house, and making similar offerings to Gaia. It’s an interesting paradox to consider – if we survive, will we have to face Gaia worshippers as… Read more »

Vizzini
Member
Reply to  3g4me
3 years ago

The Gaia worshippers tend to end up cold, sick, hungry and parasite-infested when they actually have to live in nature, so it should be an easy fight.

Vizzini
Member
Reply to  3g4me
3 years ago

Also, if you buy the right property, you should just have to dig a well or develop a spring for your water and install a septic or aeration system for your waste. Composting toilets are, um, full of shit, and tiny houses suck — living off-the-grid means having to do a lot more stocking and storing. Hard to do that in a tiny house.

3g4me
3g4me
Reply to  Vizzini
3 years ago

Vizzini: We believe we’ve bought the right property, and plan to have a well dug in the spring. I’m thinking long term – i.e. both solar and a whole-house generator for backup power, although both require an electrician and a substantial sum of money. And we don’t plan on either a tiny house or a mansion, just something comfortable. But I was initially operating on the assumption we had another 5-10 years to get things set up, and that’s looking increasingly unlikely.

Good ol' Rebel
Good ol' Rebel
Reply to  3g4me
3 years ago

3g, some thoughts: Be more redundant in your appliances, too. Have a separate hot water system for 2 zones in the house. Ditto heating: belt and suspenders, esp if you are designing from the ground up. Have wood burning heat, and have a furnace intake duct that pulls from the wood burner. 2 furnaces is even better. Geothermal is great if starting from scratch. If I were in your shoes, I would get an Amish wood burning cooking stove, in addition to propane cooking. Have a seperate cellar/basement room for foodstuffs versus just storage. Figure out how to do the… Read more »

Good ol' Rebel
Good ol' Rebel
Reply to  3g4me
3 years ago

Other thing, 3g4me, is that if you cant do the expense of something on the initial build, construct to allow it later. Dont want solar in quite yet? Make sure the conduit is run for the supply to your distribution boxes, and the house power cable is run so you can have a switchable supply later. I’d suggest having one main box and three sub boxes that run to the house supply: one for grid only frivolities (the hot tub, extra outlets, etc), one for generator alternates (well, heat/cooling, water heaters), and one for solar (lights, low loads, specific outlets).… Read more »

DLS
DLS
Reply to  3g4me
3 years ago

Rebel, why the need to hide the generator?

Good ol' Rebel
Good ol' Rebel
Reply to  3g4me
3 years ago

Replying to DLS: It is something picked up from that guy who lived through the Argentina collapse in 2001-2002 and wrote about it. Generators are usually loud, and clearly running on a fuel. When the power is out and cars are rarely about, a running engine is a “rob me” sign that is detectable for miles, which clearly shows you have fuel and something worth using it on such as food or water. Same thing with light and smoke discipline. If the grid is down, everyone for miles can see if you have electricity on at night – and therefore… Read more »

3g4me
3g4me
Reply to  3g4me
3 years ago

Replying to myself because I can’t reply to Good ol’ Rebel below : Looking into all sorts of options. Initially liked the idea of a masonry heater, but that may be overkill for moderate winters where we will be building, and I’m more concerned about a/c in the humid summers. Like what I’ve read about geothermal (again, large initial cost). It can apparently be used for radiant (underfloor) heat, but then you can’t use it for the a/c. Wish I understood all this stuff better. Thank you for the idea of sub-boxes for generator or possible future solar system –… Read more »

Ben the Layabout
Ben the Layabout
Reply to  3g4me
3 years ago

Women in control of a whole world is a theme in one Outer Limits episode, 1998’s “Lithia.” It’s episode #78 on this list for a full description. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_The_Outer_Limits_(1995_TV_series)_episodes TL;DR: Only women are actively alive; there are men but they are kept in suspended animation. Their culture is peaceful but primitive. For various reasons, a man is revived. Beyond the inevitable romantic interests, the man hooks up forgotten old tech (electricity) and leads to fighting and deaths with neighboring villages. The decision is made finally not to kill the man, but put him back in limbo. I’m partial to SF and… Read more »

Gunner Q
Reply to  Vizzini
3 years ago

The reversal of the Left’s beliefs is indeed remarkable. “Get your laws off my body!” now “mandatory regular injections!”. “Don’t trust Big Pharma” now “Are you a Moderna or a Pfizer?”. “I can’t breathe!” now “Wear two masks even if vaxxed”. (This one is actually simultaneous.) “The secret Gitmo detention camps of torture!” now “permanent solitary confinement for the January 6 protesters! No need for a trial!” “I was born this way” now “I choose my gender day by day” Perhaps the problem here isn’t the degree of belief, it’s the length of time that people can maintain their beliefs.… Read more »

Moran ya Simba
Moran ya Simba
3 years ago

“What Covid has revealed is that the only path out of the madness that is infecting the West is to sort out how to manage the fanatics. That is easier said than done, as it means creating a new religion and prying these people out of power.” Bingo! I think that is a realistic handle on the problem at hand. It doesn’t suggest the practical how-to solution. But it states the task which is a good first step. And besides, what else are the comments for? So, how do we put lipstick on HBD, the need to preserve the core… Read more »

Tom K
Tom K
3 years ago

I hate to think what could be worse than Covidianism. I just thank God Hillary didn’t win. Joe Biden is a gift when you think of it that way.

Not My Usual Pen Name
Not My Usual Pen Name
Reply to  Tom K
3 years ago

Joe Biden is a gift when you think of it that way.

Verily our Creator doth work in mysterious ways.

Severian
3 years ago

What throws me the most about the NTB is how often it manifests as compulsive mothering, most especially among actual mothers who heretofore regarded their children as almost unbearable burdens. This is why I was so flagrantly wrong about Covid back in the day. Give it a month, I said, and it’ll all blow over, because in a month Karen is going to realize that she’s stuck home with little Kayden, Jayden, Brayden, and/or Khaleesi. She can’t spend her entire day self-actualizing in the BBW section of Target or getting exalted at the nail salon. In short, Karen is (I… Read more »

Mr. Generic
Mr. Generic
Reply to  Severian
3 years ago

Excellent comment. What this shows is that not only do women need the “pimp hand” (for their own as well as all our benefit to save them from themselves), but also that the so-called “maternal instinct” long ascribed to women has no natural basis. For most women, their innate need for attention, approval, feeling of security, and control through social manipulation far outweigh any need to protect and provide for their offspring. Simply put: “maternal instinct” was really just an echo of patriarchy.

Not My Usual Pen Name
Not My Usual Pen Name
Reply to  Mr. Generic
3 years ago

Mr Generic just hit on many of the points I was gonna make. Raising children is indeed the single moast utterly [physically, mentally, psychologically, spiritually] exhausting pasttime in all of Creation, but it’s also the single moast IMPORTANT of all possible pasttimes [with nothing else coming even remotely close to it]. And yet these females with the monstrously large Insulae and the teeny tiny shrivelled up non-functioning Amygdalae are instantly rejuvenated with Valhallan levels of vigor & strength & stamina from the dopamine hits of Scrotial-Media-driven virtue snivelling. PRO-TIP for the younger chads here chez Z: These personality types are… Read more »

Not My Usual Pen Name
Not My Usual Pen Name
Reply to  Not My Usual Pen Name
3 years ago

PRO-TIP #2 for the younger chads here chez Z: A chick named “Allison Williams” just resigned from ESPN because of the jab mandate; she’s a wife & a mother & would like to have even more kids with her husband [and stated so in her resignation announcement]. Go to any image search engine, such as “images DOT bing DOT com”, and search on a string like “Allison Williams ESPN”. I am loving that chick’s physiognomy – she looks like a total SWEETHEART. So if you’re a younger chad, then don’t let the cynics ruin your sense of optimism – there… Read more »

Reynard
Reynard
Member
Reply to  Severian
3 years ago

You and Zman always have a way of making me laugh and cry at the same time. Your description of Karen is hilarious and starkly real. The laughs are very much appreciated, its the sherbet that makes the pill more palatable.

3g4me
3g4me
Reply to  Severian
3 years ago

Severian: I’ve repeatedly stated, here and elsewhere, that women need to be ‘bitch slapped’ – and hard. Perhaps that’s too crude, but ‘pimp hand’ sounds too black for my taste. Any other suggestions?

KGB
KGB
Reply to  3g4me
3 years ago

Dragged by their hair back into the cave.

DLS
DLS
Reply to  KGB
3 years ago

John Wayne did it pretty well: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nm9MEBPZkcU

Good ol' Rebel
Good ol' Rebel
Reply to  3g4me
3 years ago

Zman often refers to bringing back the dunking pole or the brinks. In Anglo-Saxon society, a discordant household would be beset by a mob banging pots and pans and hooting and hollering. The man of the house would be given a cuckhold’s horned crown to remind him of his duty, and the harridan carried off and dunked publicly a few times to convey the community’s viewpoint. A scold or an irredeemable gossip might have the brinks applies to muzzle her for a while. (This is a timeless and repeating problem, you can tell).

karl mchungus
karl mchungus
3 years ago

what’s going to be funny, is when they start this “passport” shit over HIV, diabetes, obesity, etc, etc, etc.

The Wild Geese Howard
The Wild Geese Howard
Reply to  karl mchungus
3 years ago

It will be absolutely hilarious when they start denying care to USonians because their BMI isn’t within a couple points of Fauci’s.

Vizzini
Member
Reply to  karl mchungus
3 years ago

Won’t happen. You’re making one of the great conservative blunders: assuming consistency and rationality.

3g4me
3g4me
Reply to  Vizzini
3 years ago

Vizzini: Yep. You beat me to it. Never will happen to the numinous non-Whites. They be running the show, yo.

CF Omally
CF Omally
3 years ago

It goes both ways. I have a mother in law that’s very anti-vax, and is heavy into the Q thing and is sure Trump is coming back on a firey cloud pulled by 20 silver horses. She used to be churchy which was a healthier outlet.

IMO, any discussion of vaccines that doesn’t include a mention of natural immunity is disingenuous to say the least.

Chet Rollins
Chet Rollins
Reply to  CF Omally
3 years ago

> She used to be churchy which was a healthier outlet. There is a theory that Q was born because of the destruction of traditional religion, which fits the evidence very well. It’s doubtful a practicing Christian of any denomination would be able to recognize a modern Church service. From the hymns to the architecture to the solemnity, it’s all been destroyed. A bunch of uneducated farmers used to be able to create beautiful churches, and now modern architects can’t create anything but blocky eyesores. When Christians try to bring back the old sense of the sacred, our own leaders… Read more »

Chet Rollins
Chet Rollins
Reply to  Chet Rollins
3 years ago

* It’s doubtful a practicing Christian of 100 years ago

Severian
Reply to  Chet Rollins
3 years ago

Everything his worst critics say about filmmaker Kevin Smith is true, but he absolutely nailed the inanity of modern “religion” with the “Catholicism, WOW!” ad campaign from Dogma.

If you haven’t seen it, be thankful, it’s truly awful, but do please image search “Buddy Christ.” That’s modern “Christianity,” right there.

Vizzini
Member
Reply to  Severian
3 years ago
Severian
Reply to  Severian
3 years ago

,

c’mon, man, you just know JC would dominate those lesbians in the low post, flowing robes and all. The Onion had a great one back when they were allowed to be funny (and oh lord, what a different world 1996 was):

“Instead of passing to Christ, Willis took a wild shot from three-point range, missing the net completely. After the game, a visibly upset Christ stretched out His arms and said, “Kevin Willis, why hast thou forsaken me?””

https://www.theonion.com/christ-returns-to-nba-1819563859

Astralturf
Astralturf
Reply to  Chet Rollins
3 years ago

> As a Catholic, I’d accept Odinism as the state religion over what we have now. Modern society is that poisonous to the soul

Or Talibanism for that matter. Materialism/nihilism is a spiritual starvation diet!

Not My Usual Pen Name
Not My Usual Pen Name
Reply to  CF Omally
3 years ago

I have a mother in law that’s very anti-vax, and is heavy into the Q thing and is sure Trump is coming back on a firey cloud pulled by 20 silver horses.

DUDE!?!?!?!

Your Mother-in-Law sounds like a frigging ANGEL!!!!!

She has a functioning Amygdala, which means* your kids might just have a fighting chance at being born with souls.

*Unless your wife inherited sh!t-for-genes from your Father-in-Law.

DavidTheGnome
DavidTheGnome
3 years ago

I like your writing Z man, but I am always sort of straining at what I assume is your atheism. To a Christian such as myself, the need for a “new” religion is such a strange notion. The fact that the collapse of faith in Christian countries has unleashed all manner of false religions and wicked leaders is completely expected. The solution is also completely expected, but there is nothing new about it. You and I are still ultimately speaking different languages I think, while still agreeing in many ways. I should like to hear your views on the God… Read more »

OrangeFrog
OrangeFrog
Reply to  DavidTheGnome
3 years ago

An interesting response, David. I too, wonder at the need for a new religion. For me personally, the shamdemic and the immensely overt nature of the evil on display pushed me hard back toward Christianity. It has the tools. It has the history. It had (and I hope will have) significant clout. I saw the evil. And I saw a new spiritual direction open up before me. Even a rejection of Christianity itself is still coupled with an appreciation that a lot of good stuff happened when it was at it’s height. Which I suppose is really what I get… Read more »

amr
amr
Reply to  DavidTheGnome
3 years ago

As a Christian myself, I appreciate Zman’s no-nonsense approach to religion. I think Christianity has two paths open to it. Either successfully mount a counter-heretical movement to the twisted, politically saturated pseudo-Christianity propagated by our ruling powers, or serve as a guiding force to the emergence of a new articulation of the basic truths of human existence. The modern anti-human cult is destined to fall in my opinion, but it may take organized Christianity with it. It certainly seems to intend to wipe Christianity from the face of the earth. But if our adherents believe in one thing, it is… Read more »

Evil Sandmich
Evil Sandmich
Reply to  amr
3 years ago

This. The same mindset that thinks we’re one Pope away from righting the ship is also one that thinks we’re one election away from putting the country back together.

Compsci
Compsci
Reply to  Evil Sandmich
3 years ago

Yeah, but the reverse is not true. It only took one Pope to piss away everything of the prior Pope’s legacy. Truly amazing to me.

Mr. Generic
Mr. Generic
Reply to  DavidTheGnome
3 years ago

“the need for a ‘new’ religion is such a strange notion”

Exactly! We have clear evidence of the horrific consequences over the recent few centuries of abandoning Christ, but now think the “solution” is to find a “new” New Religion.

> abandon Christianity
> suffer consequences
> therefore we need to abandon Christianity harder!
Queue the smoothbrain memes.

Astralturf
Astralturf
Reply to  DavidTheGnome
3 years ago

Zman a week or two ago entertained the need for a Christian theocracy. I believe we’re either gonna get an eventual resurgence of real Christianity or the apostasy is final and we’re at the end. If Christianity does make a comeback I expect it will be more like the legendary early Church where believers make converts on account of their own meekness and sufferings. Or perhaps Russia will sponsor a renaissance in the collapsed West. I agree, all talk of a “new” religion is absurd. A new religion comes about either because it’s true or because a budding cult has… Read more »

3g4me
3g4me
Reply to  Astralturf
3 years ago

Astralturf: ” If Christianity does make a comeback I expect it will be more like the legendary early Church where believers make converts on account of their own meekness and sufferings.”

Strongly disagree. If Christianity is to survive, it will be militant, muscular Christianity backed by unapologetic men confident in their people and culture.

Good ol' Rebel
Good ol' Rebel
Reply to  3g4me
3 years ago

I agree; deus vult, Charles Martel, El Cid, the Templars, Knights of St John, Hospitalers, etc. all stand as examples to us today. I think the AINO territories are in the beginnings of a second Awakening, and this one will be a lot more cleansing fires of the auto de fe and a lot less feet-washing.

Compsci
Compsci
Reply to  3g4me
3 years ago

3g4me, you’ve got that right. Any lasting reawakening must come from those willing to die for their faith. That is why we lost it in the first place and why we run second fiddle to vile cults like Islam.

Ben the Layabout
Ben the Layabout
Reply to  Astralturf
3 years ago

It may be worth mentioning a concept I’ve only seen in some of the books by Addison Wiggin and Bill Bonner (1980s-2000s): they stated the concept of a widely-held belief, not necessarily specific to a religion. I think they phrased it as “A man [nation, etc.] will come to believe in something, when he needs to believe in it.” I take this to mean that a belief system, no matter how logical or absurd, comes into popular use when it has real — or imagined — utility for those who profess the belief. Stripped of its supernatural trappings, a belief… Read more »

Mike Austin
Reply to  DavidTheGnome
3 years ago

I never got the feeling that the Z Man was an atheist, but rather an agnostic. He certainly is no enemy to Christianity.

As for your beliefs about Christ: Agree one hundred percent.

Maus
Maus
Reply to  Mike Austin
3 years ago

Zman has stated on several occasions that he’s a baptized Catholic, but in at least one of his podcasts he spoke of no longer fully practicing his faith, i.e. faithful adherence to the sacraments and weekly Mass. He is certainly not an atheist or even an agnostic, unless that term is understood broadly to mean uncertain about the need for orthopraxis or the consequences for lapsing. I take his primary argument to be that religious fervor is biologically determined but culturally expressed. It usefully explains the nonrational aspects of our current cultural crises. Perhaps he’s agnostic about the possibility of… Read more »

btp
Member
Reply to  DavidTheGnome
3 years ago

I think the question of Christianity is probably being given not enough thought. There is a good question about why, having rejected the old religion, some think we can’t return to it. The history of the conversion of England to Christianity is filled with little kingdoms that convert, followed by a return to some level of pagan practice, followed by a final resurgence of Christian practice. Why? Well, presumably because the pagan world view had been exhausted, which is more or less the observation of one of Edwin’s thanes who made the famous observation about the sparrow who flies in… Read more »

Not My Usual Pen Name
Not My Usual Pen Name
Reply to  DavidTheGnome
3 years ago

DavidTheGnome: the need for a “new” religion is such a strange notion OrangeFrog: I too, wonder at the need for a new religion. Mr. Generic: We have clear evidence of the horrific consequences over the recent few centuries of abandoning Christ, but now think the “solution” is to find a “new” New Religion. DUDES!!!!! Z isn’t talking about classical “religion”; Z is talking about PSYCHOLOGICAL WARFARE CAMPAIGNS!!!!! The Frankfurt School has spent CENTURIES creating “religions” for the True Believers to worship. Anti-monarchisms, like “Jacobism” in late 18th Century France, and “Bolshevism” in early 20th Century Russia. Ricardo’s “Capitalism” and Marx’s… Read more »

Citizen of a Silly Country
Citizen of a Silly Country
3 years ago

Z hits on a key point about our new religions: You harm believers by not believing. Christianity was pretty insistent (to put it mildly) that non-Christians convert, but you chose to stay a pagan, it didn’t actually condemn Christians to going to hell, though God wouldn’t be happy with your failure to get the heathen to convert. But with the new religions, you’re unwillingness to convert actually harms the converted. This is a very big point. It means that they simply can’t leave you alone. Covid is one of the weirder cases of this. The unvaccinated cause no issue for… Read more »

OrangeFrog
OrangeFrog
Reply to  Citizen of a Silly Country
3 years ago

“I suppose you could argue that the unvaccinated could fill up the hospitals, but that’s a weak response.” Yes, it’s week. I have heard all sorts of ‘scientific’ responses as to why the unvaccinated are horrific. The propaganda against them will of course ramp up. My simple response is “Why would you force me to do a shot of some stuff that I don’t need. For a flu that kills hardly anyone. Because you’re an agent of evil”. The conversion piece that Z linked to is right in a way, it shows what the left do so well. Always on… Read more »

The Wild Geese Howard
The Wild Geese Howard
Reply to  OrangeFrog
3 years ago

OF-

Correct.

Choosing what enters one’s body is the most basic human right there is.

Anyone seeking to deprive others of that right is evil by default.

Vizzini
Member
Reply to  The Wild Geese Howard
3 years ago

People use the rationalization that vaccines are widely required for public school enrollment, for military service, etc., to which I respond “It was a mistake to allow those precedents.” Just because we’re reaching the logical end of where those bad precedents led us is no reason to keep walking off the cliff as if we’re powerless to change direction just because “the map led us here.”

3g4me
3g4me
Reply to  Vizzini
3 years ago

Vizzini – Au contraire – ‘the arc of history,’ you know. We’re dealing with people who fully believe they’re following a path of light laid out for all to follow. Dissenters shall be sent to Goochland Women’s Correctional Center, along with Robert E Lee’s vanquished statue.

The Wild Geese Howard
The Wild Geese Howard
Reply to  Citizen of a Silly Country
3 years ago

Islamic doctrine has some pretty interesting takes on the non-believers, or infidels, as they refer to them.

Maniac
Maniac
Reply to  The Wild Geese Howard
3 years ago

“Smite their necks”, if I recall.

A radical Muslim will saw your head off. A moderate Muslim will hand him the knife.

3g4me
3g4me
Reply to  The Wild Geese Howard
3 years ago

Wild Geese – Hating today’s wokists and weak churchians does not lead me to pine for Islamic legalism (even if I cheer how the Taliban are dealing with western-inculcated women). It’s a false and utterly alien doctrine that has no place among Western Civilization.

The Wild Geese Howard
The Wild Geese Howard
Reply to  3g4me
3 years ago

3g4me-

I totally agree.

Perhaps I was a bit too subtle in my attempt to point out this similarity in Islam and today’s Wokism.

Captain Willard
Captain Willard
Reply to  thezman
3 years ago

Yes! And the American roots of this concept are so strong, going all the way back to Pilgrim’s Progress and (later) Jonathan Edwards. You can draw a straight line from the Pilgrims through the Abolitionists to the Temperance movement to the Progs of today.

The compulsion to control your neighbor for his own good is as American as apple pie. This is why the conservatives used to joke that under Progs, “that which isn’t forbidden will be mandatory”. There are dozens of Covidian John Browns out there waiting to punish deniers – just wait.

Citizen of a Silly Country
Citizen of a Silly Country
Reply to  thezman
3 years ago

True. It always comes back to the Puritans, doesn’t it. Say what you will about them, they’ve made their mark on the world – and continue to do so.

But, yes, they’re coming up against a brick wall with diversity. Afghanistan shows what happens to American Progressivism when it meets non-whites. Same is true in the United States with non-whites.

Puritanism is a white thing.

BoomerMCMXLVII
BoomerMCMXLVII
Reply to  thezman
3 years ago

Hmmm…. ever read the story Jonah in the Bible?
Way before the time of the Puritans.

FeinGul
FeinGul
Reply to  thezman
3 years ago

Well Pope Gregory The Great did the same in 590 plague, mind you they didn’t have microscopes.

Meanwhile…new Quonverso Catholic Milo sees an opportunity to restore Theocracy if we just retask the Covidians and all these crazy women. Milo wants a Catholic Handmaids Tale, castrate and burn Pedo Priests, burn heretics, etc.
It takes a fag to put the militant in Church Militant.

https://www.churchmilitant.com/news/article/why-i-welcome-the-covid-tyranny

In all fairness I’d go back to Church if this happened.

Ben the Layabout
Ben the Layabout
Reply to  thezman
3 years ago

Yet encouraging group unity and punishing dissent has a place. I’m by nature a questioner, a skeptic. Probably most of us are or we wouldn’t be here. But anyone who’s ever been through military boot camp, or some equivalent training, has drilled into him the need to follow orders, to support the mission. In my case, screwups were punished with nothing worse than extra pushups or some other token punishment. But in the real world, in war time, one man’s failing can jeopardize the entire misison. “For want of a nail, …” etc.

Mike Austin
Reply to  Citizen of a Silly Country
3 years ago

“They won’t quit until you join or are destroyed.”

Or until they are destroyed.

Peabody
Peabody
Reply to  Citizen of a Silly Country
3 years ago

This is the single most glaringly nonsensical notion in the sea of idiocy surrounding Covid dogma. If the “vax” works than there’s no danger to those who got it from those who haven’t. If it doesn’t provide protection what’s the effin point? If the “non-vaxed” subsequently die from their recalcitrance well c’est la vie. That was their choice. As a bonus the “vaxed” can feel smug in doing their duty. How the jab pushers can’t see the contradiction in all this let alone the developing tyranny surrounding it is a wonder to behold. But then as the saying goes, one… Read more »

OrangeFrog
OrangeFrog
Reply to  Peabody
3 years ago

“If it doesn’t provide protection what’s the effin point?”

One of us!
One of us!

(See also The Matrix’s Agent Smith cloning himself again and again)

Compsci
Compsci
Reply to  Citizen of a Silly Country
3 years ago

The unvex’d are a convenient scapegoat for a failing Covid belief system—that is to say, the science and therefore the efforts to date in. fighting Covid has been shown to be faulty. TPTB are like children pointing the finger at other children to avoid punishment.

DLS
DLS
Reply to  Citizen of a Silly Country
3 years ago

“The NTB religions are extremely intolerant of non-believers.” They are also unforgiving. Forgiveness is at the center of the Lord’s Prayer. But no matter how much some public figure grovels over a crude remark he made decades ago, the NTBers never forgive. He is banished forever.

Hi -Ya!
Hi -Ya!
3 years ago

This is all female driven!

Citizen of a Silly Country
Citizen of a Silly Country
Reply to  Hi -Ya!
3 years ago

Yeah, that article truly showed how feminine our world has become. Talk, talk, talk, talk. Respect feelings. Blah, blah, blah.

Marko
Marko
Reply to  Hi -Ya!
3 years ago

When did Popular Science become Good Housekeeping?

The Wild Geese Howard
The Wild Geese Howard
Reply to  Marko
3 years ago

If you think Popular Science is bad, have a look at Consumer Reports these days.

It’s less surprising when you realize their entire executive and editorial teams are all Karens of the worst kind.

Mr. Generic
Mr. Generic
Reply to  Marko
3 years ago

When the wahmens quit keeping the house and decided they wanted to LARP as scientists.

OrangeFrog
OrangeFrog
Reply to  Mr. Generic
3 years ago

Women are strong, powerful, independent and roar like lions when they want to, you bigot.

Who do you think: Constructs and cleans our sewerage system, correctly cambers the road, chops down trees, keeps the power stations running, has intimate knowledge about the grid, founded all our great institutions of learning, pioneered engineering mathematics, beat down our enemies at home and way, drive trucks, flies cargo planes?

Oh wait, it was teh blokes.

Mike Austin
Reply to  OrangeFrog
3 years ago

Women believe that they can be as good a Marine as any man. Then they cry over a pronoun.

OrangeFrog
OrangeFrog
Reply to  OrangeFrog
3 years ago

Reply to Mike Austin: There was a video that did the rounds many years back, quite famous if I recall, of a boxing match between an allegedly boisterous female and some bloke. Both in the armed forces. The video, I think, was taken in Iraq. It is a great demonstration of the natural physical advantage men have over women. This roaring lion was decked within the first exchange of punches. And was then whacked about many times more… A firm hand indeed. For a demonstration of the great mental advantages men have over women; see almost every explorer, inventor and… Read more »

OrangeFrog
OrangeFrog
Reply to  Hi -Ya!
3 years ago

Heh. This morning’s company meeting over Teams – whilst a good chance for me to watch videos of Marvelous Marvin Hagler fights – was full of feminine garbage. After the usual Covid platitudes (“It’s been a tough year”, “What a year!”, “In these unprecedented times…”) and then the comical over prediction of future revenues, we were informed that a ‘Staff Health Survey’ had been undertaken. Now, I had seen the survey email, but chose not to do it because, well, actual work. But my goodness, what a silly thing! Mental health, stress at work, is work “fun”? and all the… Read more »

3 Pipe Problem
3 Pipe Problem
3 years ago

Nice post Z! Makes me long for those good old days of religious intolerance. No matter what, the worst a dissenter could face in those halcyon days was Hell in the afterlife; now, we have it as a constant.

Marko
Marko
Reply to  3 Pipe Problem
3 years ago

Yeah, before it was eternal torment in the afterlife. Now, it’s eternal torment in life, only to be ended by sweet death!

Spingehra
Spingehra
Reply to  Marko
3 years ago

Theirs preferably

Outdoorspro
Outdoorspro
3 years ago

What has been most amazing to me, are the people who really should know better, are usually the worst fanatics. I work in the medical laboratory field, where most people have more training and education, and practical experience in immunology and virology than your average MD. Yet, they are often the most hardcore enforcers of masking. One of them is a true Fauci fanatic. On industry online discussion boards it’s not uncommon to find experienced professionals saying that people who won’t get the jab shouldn’t be allowed to work in the profession. Years of education and experience go away when… Read more »

3 Pipe Problem
3 Pipe Problem
Reply to  thezman
3 years ago

“Ignorant men raise questions that wise men answered a thousand years ago.” — Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

Mike Austin
Reply to  3 Pipe Problem
3 years ago

So true. When I was a teacher I would listen to my colleagues berate and laugh at Christianity. They had no idea that their questions—if that’s what they were—were answered by the Church Fathers 1800 years before, or by the Greeks 500 years before the birth of Christ. Ignorant fools the lot of them.

Chet Rollins
Chet Rollins
Reply to  Outdoorspro
3 years ago

> Yet, they are often the most hardcore enforcers of masking. One of them is a true Fauci fanatic These professionals may be true believers because of institutional arrogance or general midwittery. Another possibility is they cynically know that these policies give them more power and so support them. Either way, there is a vested interest in them believing and regurgitating lies. Talking to a nurse who is forced to get a vax to keep her job, it’s the MD’s that are the most fanatical. She has a history of life-threatening reactions to vax’s, but she still is having trouble… Read more »

Götterdamn-it-all
Götterdamn-it-all
Reply to  Chet Rollins
3 years ago

One of these MD fanatics is my neighbor. How DARE I not come forward and rededicate my life to Branch Covidianism!!!

Chet Rollins
Chet Rollins
Reply to  Götterdamn-it-all
3 years ago

A lot of these guys jack themselves off on how much smarter they are than the plebs. Anything you say will just reinforce their viewpoints, regardless of how right you are because official sounding people and late night comedians say you’re wrong. The only effective strategy seems to be refusing to engage them and deny them the dopamine rush.

KGB
KGB
Reply to  Chet Rollins
3 years ago

Like cops, they thrill in the face-to-face power they wield. Also, again like cops, they deal almost exclusively with credulous people who defer to their authority. It’s no wonder they’re astounded when their wisdom and directives are questioned, and that they demand punitive retribution against non-conformists.

Mow Noname
Mow Noname
Reply to  Chet Rollins
3 years ago

Well, it’s a free country.

You don’t have to take the jab.

You are free not to ever go into a public library, government school, medical office or private business ever again. Oh, or go to work or hold down a job.

Luckily, you ARE free to go into a hospital, be put into an isolation unit and die, but our betters are working on that…

Vizzini
Member
Reply to  Mow Noname
3 years ago

“Well, it’s a free country.”

You’re a funny guy!

3g4me
3g4me
Reply to  Outdoorspro
3 years ago

Outdoorspro: This is incredibly depressing, although not surprising. Anyone who received a college degree in the last 20 years was specifically selected for conformity and adherence to the official narrative. It’s what has enabled them to succeed (of a sort) in clownworld. Why I don’t trust doctors or scientists or anyone who fancies herself a ‘professional.’ Why I buck all faux authority.

BoomerMCMXLVII
BoomerMCMXLVII
Reply to  3g4me
3 years ago

Right out of college I had a very high opinion of scientists… (doctors never so much) but working in a biological testing and research lab 1970 – 1982 cured me utterly and forever of that misapprehension.

Whitney
Member
3 years ago

I like to read dear Abby type columns. They’re a bunch of them they’re just mindless entertainment for me but what is a unifying principle of all of them lately is that at least once a week there’s a letter from a covidian upset about her anti-vaccine, non-believer whomever and the advice columnist du jour always tells her that she is sane and they’re insane. The advice is always to cut them out of your life until they do ias they’re told. It’s really something. Such coordinated propaganda on all levels is really impressive

3g4me
3g4me
Reply to  Whitney
3 years ago

Whitney: It is impressive, and it’s lack of this coordination that makes our side so weak. It’s why I tell people to cut the covidians out of their lives, whether they be pseudo-friends or relatives. People have to accept that the old adage of ‘live and let live’ is utterly unworkable in today’s multikulti madness. There needs to be a clear and brutal divide amongst people. It will happen regardless, whether it’s racially or covidian-based, but I would prefer to see the reality-minded choosing to separate themselves before all the luke-warm ‘reasonable’ types are forced to pick a side (which… Read more »

Ben the Layabout
Ben the Layabout
Reply to  Whitney
3 years ago

Even the advice columns? Wow, that is scary. I scarcely interact with the MSM. Precisely because so much of it is, as you say, propaganda clearly advocating narrow aims, or better said, a narrative often shifting but clearly dishonest, usually provably false with some fact-checking, and to me at least, with evil intents.

Eloi
Eloi
3 years ago

The thing that has long amused me in the campain against covid is the line that “as vaccination rates dropped, cases spiked.” This, of course, is insane. If the rates drop, the total number still increases. And, if the vaccines work, then the cases would still decline, albeit at a slow rate (if we completely ignore natural immunity). The shamanistic, ritualized adoption of the vaxx cycle is clearly a mass initiation for other rituals that our overlords have planned. Though I do agree with Z that most of our local leaders are morons, I have to disagree when I believe… Read more »

sentry
sentry
Reply to  Eloi
3 years ago

“The shamanistic, ritualized adoption of the vaxx cycle is clearly a mass initiation for other rituals that our overlords have planned.”

it’s woke baptism, vaxx brings salvation for braindead citizens

& just like christianity did not end it with baptism(you still had to eat holy bread, drink holy wine & holy water & confess your sins & attend all sorts of rituals) so will globalism require you to do other stuff like eat bugs, get chipped, receive boosters & admit being responsible for jerome being a fuckup good for nothing dindu & for glaciers melting.

Vizzini
Member
Reply to  Eloi
3 years ago

Most people are completely ignorant of anything but the screeching media panic porn. A friend was worried about our unvaxxed daughter maybe dying of COVID. I showed her this graphic, telling her “You have a hard time even finding the age 30-39 mortality line on this graph, your daughter is going to be fine”: ?resize=768%2C383&ssl=1 When she saw the current death rates, she said “Wait? If that’s all the current death rate is, why are people making such a big deal about it?” I’ve received the same response from random people online when I show them the actual data on… Read more »

Evil Sandmich
Evil Sandmich
Reply to  Vizzini
3 years ago

BigMed being BigMed means that everyone knows at least one person in the “medical trenches” (I don’t know that many people and I know several) and they’re more than ready to feed horror stories to their acquaintances. As someone in this thread referenced they’re unable to overcome their career myopia: if all they ever see day in and day out are the worst of the worst WuFlu patients then that will consume their world view, even though that’s all they would see since that is their friggin’ job. Someone related, I have a med buddy who is absolutely paranoid about… Read more »

Ben the Layabout
Ben the Layabout
Reply to  Eloi
3 years ago

It’s human nature to think there is deliberate controlling evil behind the scenes. Of course this is possible, but it’s also possible, perhaps even probable, that what seems like a vast conspiracy is “emergent behavior.” This isn’t to say that cabals, conspiracies and evil plots never exist. Of course they do. That’s an aspect of being human. But to think there is always some central evil running everything, whether you call him Satan, or the Council on Foreign Relations, the Illuminati or the WEF, probably overestimates the skills and resources. An analogy from the animal kingdom: a flock of birds… Read more »

Jack Dobson
Jack Dobson
3 years ago

I’m glad you hiton the religious fanaticism of CRT, Climate Change, Wokeism, whatever. There is no arguing with True Believers. The only effective response is to find a way to make thrives of their manipulators horrible.

Biden will be declaring a de facto Covid martial law today
The tome is now to find how to inflict the misery.

The Wild Geese Howard
The Wild Geese Howard
Reply to  Jack Dobson
3 years ago

If they push the jab mandate out to Federal contractors, that ought to cripple the MIC’s ability to replace the gear lost in Afghanistan and their ability to develop new vehicles, aircraft, and comms gear.

Almost as if someone was trying to cripple the US military establishment by design….

Jack Dobson
Jack Dobson
Reply to  The Wild Geese Howard
3 years ago

Let’s hope that happens.

Vizzini
Member
Reply to  Jack Dobson
3 years ago

Definitely, since we’re going to be fighting it in a few years. I’ll be glad if the Prancing Pink Trans-Berets are low on tampons.

The Wild Geese Howard
The Wild Geese Howard
Reply to  Vizzini
3 years ago

Well, thinking about it a bit more, it’s reasonable to assume the equipment lost in Afghanistan was frontline, state-of-the-art gear.

The reserves, if any, held in warehouses are now the frontline gear.

Based on all the supply chain and staffing problems, those reserves won’t be replenished any time soon.

Cui bono?