A Tribal Dilemma

For as long as anyone reading this has been alive, Jews in America have been firmly on the Left of American politics. Milton Himmelfarb famously quipped that “Jews earn like Episcopalians, and vote like Puerto Ricans.” It’s not just voting patterns. Jews have been the intellectual engine of the Left since the Second World War. Members of the Frankfurt School took up positions in the American academy, transforming the soft sciences into a cultural force. Jews were front and center in the radical movements of the 60’s and 70’s.

Jews are not a monolith, despite what some may claim. There are divides within American Jewry and some degree of geographic diversity. German Jews that came to America in the middle of the 19th century have different cultural patterns than the Pale of Settlement Jews who arrived in the early 20th century. There are sectarian divides, as well, with Reformed and secular Jews having different cultural patterns than conservative Jews and the Orthodox. Still, the bulk of of Jews fit neatly into the stereotype of cosmopolitan Jew.

For liberal Jews, the world is becoming increasingly complicated as the American Left becomes not just the coalition of non-whites, but the coalition of anti-whites. For a long time, liberal Jews were able to be allies to non-whites, arguing for greater access and participation, while also being viewed as white by heritage Americans. As the American Left becomes anti-white, this is no longer possible. In the world of identity politics, it is impossible to hold two passports. Everyone gets one team and only one team.

Another complication is that Team Brown is not all that fond of Jews. Blacks have always had a bitter relationship with Jews, despite Jewish support for black causes. Hispanics are casually antisemitic at levels most don’t understand. The Left has also always had a complex relationship with Israel. The BDS Movement that flourishes in Progressive bastions further complicates things. Most important though is the fact that the brown hordes see Jews as white and therefore the enemy, regardless of their politics.

This does not mean that Jews are about to be evicted from the Progressive coalition, but the winds are certainly blowing that way. As much as resistance to globalism is viewed as a force on the Right, the Left’s hostility to order, any order, a legacy of the Frankfurt School, means trouble for anyone trying to harness the forces of the Left. Look around the rest of the English speaking world and you see a similar phenomenon. The Left’s anti-Zionism is slowly curdling into a quiet hostility to Jews in the generality.

The neocons are the obvious exception to the stereotype of liberal Jews. In the 60’s and 70’s some disaffected Jewish intellectuals made the journey to the Right, mostly over the issue of the Soviet Union and Israel. Their embrace of cultural conservatism was a matter of necessity, in order to fit into the Republican coalition. Critics have described them as Trotskyites, because of their advocacy for revolutionary democracy around the world and their lust to use military power to “move history in the right direction.”

The situation for neoconservatives is vastly worse than for liberal Jews. The neocons went all in on opposition to Trump’s primary run, launching the NeverTrump movement and then worked to undermine Trump in the general. It was a disastrous miscalculation as it probably helped Trump tap into the deep well of resentment among whites toward the neocon elite that captured the party in the Bush years. Rather than remaining in the coalition debating policy, they have placed themselves at odds with the Trump coalition.

Even though people like Jonah Goldberg could probably waddle back over to the Left, most neocons don’t have that option. Opposition to an aggressive foreign policy has been a plank of the American Left for generations. The hyper-violent neoconservatives and their desire to invade the world is never going to work. Then there is the general opposition to Israel and support for the Palestinians. Add in the explicit identity politics of the modern Left and there’s simply no way to square neoconservative ideas with the modern Left.

Taken together, what’s shaping up for Jews in America is a political arrangement where they have no natural home. Liberal Jews are increasingly at risk in the Left coalition due to looking a bit too pale for Team Brown. The new opposition that is forming up in opposition to Team Brown is explicitly white, as well as nationalist and populist. While it is not explicitly antisemitic, despite what some claim, it will certainly be hostile to the sort of cosmopolitanism Jews have historically preferred. Jews could be left without a home.

Ironically, Jewish exceptionalism is turning out to be their undoing, as they have managed to transform the American Left and the American Right. Domestically, the Left is every bit as radical and disruptive as anything the Bolsheviks imagined. On foreign policy, the Right is as revolutionary as the communist radicals of yesteryear. The result is a political class at war with itself and at war with the majority population. It is beginning to look as if the Jewish century is curdling into a Jewish disaster for Jews in America.

That said, Jews are the most adaptive people in human history. There’s no reason why Jews in America could not simply throw in with the white majority. Just as the neocons broke with the Left over opposition to the Soviets, perhaps liberal Jews will break with the Left over the issue of identity politics. After all, in a balkanized country, the only way for a tiny minority to survive is to attach to the most powerful tribe. Given the options on Team Brown, Team White is going to look like a better option, assuming the option is open.

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Maxwell Demon
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Maxwell Demon

I’ve told you this before, but it bears repeating – you were one of the major forces that helped me come over from the conservative/libertarian right to whatever the dissident right is currently calling itself. I’m Jewish, and the guys who fancy themselves Nazis don’t especially bother me. I’m well aware there may be no place for me in the future of the American right, but I’ll support it anyway, in whatever capacity I can.

Ed
Guest
Ed

There will always be pro-jewish sycophants like this guy to brown-nose your fellow Jewish parasitic brothers, rest assured. Thing is, next time the shit hits the fan for your parasitic people, sycophants like ZMan wont be in a position to help you like the Allies did last time around, in the 40s.

A. Kalshnakov
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A. Kalshnakov

and then of course there will be some high IQ “parasites” who will have identified threats like you, and who will be three steps ahead, lying in wait

Ed
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Ed

There will always be pro-jewish sycophants like this guy to brown-nose your fellow Jewish parasitic brothers, rest assured. Thing is, next time the shit hits the fan for your parasitic people, sycophants like ZMan wont be in a position to help you like the Allies did last time around, in the 40s. 😘

BTI
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BTI

0.000025% of your fellow Jews agree with your stance.

Maxwell Demon
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Maxwell Demon

Maybe a few more than that, but nowhere near enough. It’s fucking tragic.

Ivar
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Ivar

I used to yell, jew, jew, jew, with the best of them, but I realize that was lazy and incorrect thinking. I am Anglo Saxon to the bone, but my folk handed over the country without a peep, so who’s fault is that? The patronizing, busybody New England bluenoses (of impeccable Old Stock) have done more damage to us whites intellectually than the jews ever did. If we want to truly know what went wrong, self-examination is in order instead of looking for scapegoats. As far as I”m concerned, jews are welcome in the white coalition, as long as they… Read more »

Jaqship
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Jaqship

Of course, Ivar, they MUST extend the same courtesy to the other European ethnicities and tendencies.
And, you’re quite right about the bluenoses. It wasn’t only intellectually, unless you call Prohibition etc. “intellectually”.
That BS came well before Jews had any power here.

ronehjr
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ronehjr

Believe me, our side is so self destructive even the most helpful and pro-white jews will be ostracized out of principle.

Jaqship
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Jaqship

And, ronehjr, the very significant number of truly open-minded Jews will feel the most poignant incredulity, for the experiences of those Jews to whom you’re referring.

LineInTheSand
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LineInTheSand

ronehjr, how do we identify these “most helpful and pro-white jews”, given that the most salient characteristics of Jews throughout history have been ethnocentrism and subversion?

It’s like the GOP promoting “conservative” blacks, most of whom voted for Obama, due to tribalism.

You want the Jews to like you, but they care more about their tribe than your values.

Maxwell Demon
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Maxwell Demon

I completely understand. The problem is a corrupted communication channel. You can’t trust any communication coming through the channel because the channel itself is suspect. Nothing can be done to undo this. My analysis is that, when it comes down to it, what will need to be done, if Whites accept the support of Jews, is that Jewish allies not be entrusted with anything critical, nor with leadership positions. Let the Jews prove themselves useful with works that will not prove fatal to the cause in the case of betrayal. And if they earn some trust, fine, but let Whites… Read more »

wxtwxtr
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wxtwxtr

Go all in. Алиса Зиновьевна Розенбаум, interestingly anti-conservative / anti-libertarian, has done more for “the right”, whatever that is, than perhaps anyone in the Twentieth Century. Although labelled “to the right of Barry Goldwater”, she laid the artistic foundation for liberty and individualism, and the most powerful attack on tyranny … ever. Both “The Tribe” and Conservative Inc, are fundamentally social metaphysicians and “second handers”, and will not defend a vocal supporter of liberty. We’re on our own.

Simone
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Simone

I’m also Jewish. Female. Husband is Jewish. Kids are being raised Jewish. Like you, I have always supported Christendom and Whites, both online and in real life (my beloved father is 100% Anglo-Saxon, so maybe that explains some of my thinking on the issue). Anyway, shortly after reading Zman’s post a couple of days ago, I found myself in the dentist’s chair. The post-appointment conversation, which is invariably political in nature, covered the following topics: Brexit (my husband is English), Brett Kavanaugh, overturning Roe v. Wade, abortion in general, quotas for women and Trump. The dentist took all the approved… Read more »

Jaqship
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Jaqship

Hang in there, Simone.
The fact, that such a respected figure as Zman is so tired of these hotheads, should lead you to expect that they’re going about burning key bridges fast enough.

C Martel
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C Martel

Ed and those who feel like he does are a cancer. The rest of us should be more vocal about this, I agree.

Maxwell Demon
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Maxwell Demon

It’s tremendously heartening to read this from all of you. Thanks for taking the time to share your opinions and experiences.

C Martel
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C Martel

I tried to post this last night, but my comment got killed due to an internet outage: there is absolutely a place for you in the Dissident Right. From Lawrence Auster to Paul Gottfried to Ilana Mercer to Nicholas Stix, there have always been Dissident Right Jewish writers. While the restoration of Western Civ must be built around Christianity as the dominant moral code, there is no reason that Jews cannot live as a prosperous minority within our system. The Jews have been a part of the West for over 1000 years now and have made important contributions. Israel is… Read more »

Maxwell Demon
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Maxwell Demon

Thanks – and I love your screen name. Totally agreed re Christianity as the core of the West. Not only because it must be, but because it deserves to be. It is a profound system of morality and faith that has done more good for humanity than virtually any other doctrine.

Tykebomb
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Tykebomb

The problem is that Jewish culture has curdled into a hatred of white christians. Every once and a while, the Ben Shapiro/Daily Wire Crew drop some red pills about how Jewishness is explicitly anti-christian. Andrew Klavan’s biography mentions how his Father would’ve disowned him had he become a christian. A centuries long cultural adaption doesn’t just stop.

Ris Eruwaedhiel
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Ris Eruwaedhiel

A friend of mine’s in-laws disowned her husband because he married her, a blonde ethnic German Christian.

Lance_E
Member

While I’m sure you could apply this to a nontrivial segment of the Jewish population, the astoundingly high intermarriage rate between Jews and white Christians suggests that this isn’t really “Jewish culture”, it’s progressive culture.

In fact, people on the alt-right who like to Name the Jew, actually end up naming half-Jews with surprising regularity. I understand why this is hard for many non-WASP Europeans to grasp, but the Jewish elite and the WASP elite are the same thing.

Jaqship
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Jaqship

Spot on as usual, Lance.
And, this progressive culture started to be formed by the bluenoses over a century ago.

Member

I was going to quote a bunch of lines from Z’s post above. But why bother. Dear half of you crazy morons on this site…read every effing word of it…then read it again. Absorb it. Understand it. It’s in the top 5 of anything Z’s ever written. It’s ultra on point. Like, every fucking line. I knew this post was coming, and it couldn’t have come any better.

John Smith
Member

Cuck-A-Doodle-Doooooo!

Member

>”There’s no reason why Jews in America could not simply throw in with the white majority.” Yes, what you suggest that they do is rational, but their hatred for Christianity and for Europeans is far beyond rationality. They’d sooner die, literally, than genuinely embrace us. And if they were going to do that, they’d have done it before one of the other 110 times they got kicked out of white Christian countries. Believe me, I don’t say this because I want it to be true – just the opposite. But we are the fox and they are the scorpion. They… Read more »

pyrrhus
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pyrrhus

I’m afraid so…The other problem is that Jews in America are becoming dumber, which has been noticed by people like Cochran and Harpending, perhaps too many shiksas…While others, like Vox Day, have noticed that their purported intelligence has been exaggerated, while their clannishness and nepotism accounts for most of their success.My life long experiences with Jews and Jewish business confirms VD’s work…

Lance_E
Member

Vox’s analysis was a misrepresentation (perhaps unintentional) based on Israeli IQ statistics. It’s generally understood that when discussing Jewish IQ, people mean Ashkenazi IQ – but Vox (perhaps unintentionally) ignored the fact that the majority of the Israeli Jewish population is NOT Ashkenazi, and therefore not comparable to the 90+% Ashkenazi Jewish population in the USA and western Europe. This may also explain why Israeli Jews are much less cucked on race and borders than American/European Jews. Lower IQ, but higher negative ethnocentrism. Of course, I don’t dispute that Jews in America are getting dumber – but everyone in America… Read more »

Observer
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Observer

“Jews are the most adaptive people in human history”
—- ZMan

That’s been noticed before…

“When Jewish Communism begins to get too ‘hot’, as it has here in the U.S., because of the millions who saw the parade of Jew Communist spies, they slide out of that skin and become Zionists. And when this also gets too hot, then they molt and become ‘anti-communists’ or something else. In the excitement, nobody ever seems to
notice that it is always the same snake.“
—- George Lincoln Rockwell

Ed
Guest
Ed

“Jews are not a monolith, despite what some may claim.” – A group who votes 80%> Democrat. But they’re not a monolith. I won’t say your sentence is retarded because you and I know it’s just disingenuious.

Issac
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Issac

The cost of being perfectly honest on this subject is too high.

Whitemale979
Guest

Not every Jew is attempting to destroy Christendom, and not everyone trying to destroy Christendom is a Jew, but the 80/20 rule is definitely in effect.

Member

4:1 isn’t a “monolith” in my estimation, but where, exactly, do -you- draw the line?

Lester Fewer
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Lester Fewer

There’s far more intelligent things to be said in discussion of this highly astute post (Zman, though always astute, has really been on a roll lately), but instead I’ll trot out an old joke, for the benefit of those youngsters who may never have heard it before… “First they came for the blacks, but I didn’t speak out because I wasn’t black. Then they came for the Jews, but I didn’t speak out, because I wasn’t a Jew. Then they came for… well actually, now that I think of it, once they got rid of the blacks and the Jews,… Read more »

Member

Sorry, it doesn’t stop like that. Real world: They came for Roy Moore, and now they’re coming for Brett Kavanaugh.

Ed
Guest
Ed

“ Team White is going to look like a better option, assuming the option is open.” – Indeed: if pro-Jewish sycophants like you have your way. By the way, when are you writing your next embarassing little article decrying “anti-Semitism”?

John B.
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John B.

No no, god no. We don’t want ’em. Nation wreckers. That would be the worst possible thing. They are the group that MOST needs to be kept out of a functioning nation.

Member

Too late. What’s your Plan B?

Ed
Guest
Ed

Everytime an Alt Boomer like you writes about dark-skinned non-whites (be they Blacks, Hispanis, Arabs, etc) you always do it with ostensible scorn, hostility and even hate. But when it comes to Jews… nothing. (Actually, you morons see them, unironically!, as your fellow whites LOL). You speak about them in neutral, dispassionate terms, coaching your text with inanities and empty cliches (“Jews are not a monolith” is a typical boilerplate). Gosh, this is all so tedious. I’m surprised you didn’t finish tour text with #NotAllJewsAreCommies or #JewsCanBeOurAlliesToo 😂

Lorenzo
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Lorenzo

Mentioning Jews lights the signal fire that summons Ed on and similar thinkers. It’s like a bug zapper to moths.

Ed
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Ed

Hey, loser, let’s hear you trashing Blacks, Hispanics, Arabs and all dark-skinned non-whites, shall we? They’re garbage people, they’re wrecking our nations, aren’t they? Now let’s hear your views on this specific non-white group, the Jews? Now, they’re a totally different case aren’t they? Trashing blacks is edgy but trashing the k*kes is unsophisticated among your Alt Boomer friends, isn’t it? 😂😂😂

Jennyonenote/onevote
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Jennyonenote/onevote

Hey, how do you think it makes women feel? Jews can vote 80% incorrectly, you say, and that’s fine. But just let less than 50% women vote wrongly and all women have to be smacked back into the 19th C. Plus we even give birth to you! Talk about ingrates, sniff.

Lance_E
Member

Slight problem here, Jenny: Jews are 2% of the voting population while women are 50% of the voting population. 100% of Jews and Blacks voting for the left would still be less effective than just 35% of women.

Member

Ashkenazi Jews are of course white. You are a loon to deny this.

joey junger
Guest
joey junger

If the left/democrats really do scare the Jews away/kick them out, great. But it means they’re not just crazy, but incredibly stupid, as almost all of their funding comes from a small group of incredibly powerful Jews. I was reading some of White House staffer Ben Rhodes’ book about his time with Obama, and Obama was butting heads with Rahm Emanuel and David Axelrod about the Palestinians, and someone finally blurted out, “The Arabs are not going to pay for your presidential library!” I also have to respectfully disagree with Dr. Gottfried about the main division among Jews being between… Read more »

Corn
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Corn

“The problem isn’t religious Jews for me; the problem comes with people who just happen to be Jewish or are culturally Jewish (like Jon Stewart) or even just half-Jewish (Tim Wise or Bill Maher).”

Yeah, going by what I see in the media and interwebs the most zany leftist Jews are secular Jews or maybe Reform Jews. Orthodox Jews seem to be sensibly centrist or even conservative.

Alex
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Alex

RE Orthodox/UltraOrthodox: they are not allies, but not threats either. They hew to Jesus’ teaching to render unto Caesar that which is Caesar’s, and unto God that which is His. Interesting post Zman. I am conflicted on this issue b/c I grew up in an integrated (w/ Jews) environment, and some of my oldest and closest friends are Jewish. They are seeing things turn in ways not to their liking (aka Team Brown) but seem unable to cross the divide, even as they change their once Liberal mindset on things like the 2nd Amendment. This is a very challenging issue.… Read more »

David Davenport
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David Davenport

“Time will tell”

… Tomorrow is another day …What lies ahead remains to be seen… Predictions are hard, especially about the future … More research is needed.

phaedris
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phaedris

They are seeing things turn in ways not to their liking (aka Team Brown) but seem unable to cross the divide, even as they change their once Liberal mindset on things like the 2nd Amendment.

The jews helped create this monster (or ‘golem’ if you prefer) and now this monster has them backed into a corner.
Gee, what a surprise…

Jaqship
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Jaqship

Hang in there, Alex.
Them changing on things like the 2nd Amendment is fantastic, putting them very well on the right road, esp. if they’re otherwise starting to see the real deal on Team Brown.
Them seeing the score on Team Black should follow quite soon.
Then, how about Team Pussy hat?

Whitemale979
Guest

And this was despite the fact that many of the Bolsheviks’ most important leaders were Jews—though Jews who viewed their Jewishness as an incidental artifact of their birth, with no meaning for them either religiously (as they were atheists) or nationally (as they regarded themselves as internationalists). Most famously, when Leon Trotsky was asked what his nationality was, he replied “socialist.”

Rod1963
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Rod1963

Thoughtful article. Jews are indeed painting themselves into a proverbial corner. We can see it in Europe where they are already looking for new homes. Not all, just the more perceptive ones who see storm clouds forming on the horizon. In regards to switching sides, It all depends on WHEN they side with us. If it’s early on, then it’s not a issue. If they continue to ride the progressive crazy train to the point it derails and we end up in a civil war and blood is spilled. Well it won’t be pretty for them or anyone else. I… Read more »

Jaqship
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Jaqship

Rod, very many are well on their way to our side, and with bemused disgust/ contempt for those who continue to ride the progressive crazy train.

Whitemale979
Guest

>And they really don’t care if they get strung up, shot or burned to death as long as they can bring down the house.

AKA the Sampson option. It definitely has pretends to.

M
Guest
M

A list of Jewish US nationalists here:

http://www.xoxohth.com/thread.php?thread_id=4049776&mc=60&forum_id=2

Good post by Z Man but I agree with one of the above posters that Jewish hatred of white Christians will prevent them from ever joining a white alliance.

The unjust thing is the 20-30% of Jews that are not this way (such as myself) are lumped into the rabidly far leftist majority, and I’d strongly prefer not to be judged in relation to them.

If there’s a way – and maybe there is today, with current technology – to judge a person on their individual merits (or leftist demerits), that would be best.

Ed
Guest
Ed

You will find at least 20-30% of “based individuals” in any group. So effing what? How many “based” Arabs or “based” Blacks is Israel admitting every year?

“Hey, 20-30% of my people are not complete scumbags, therefore we have the right to go on living like blood suckers in your country, goy” – I don’t think so, Shlomo.

Member

The unjust thing is the 20-30% of Jews that are not this way (such as myself) are lumped into the rabidly far leftist majority, and I’d strongly prefer not to be judged in relation to them. The thing is, not being a globalist or a cultmarx enemy of America isn’t enough to make you tribe. Just like I don’t become Jewish by not being an anti-semite, Jews don’t become Europeans by not hating us. Even if every Jew in the world started working for the salvation of Western civilization, they’d still be Jews. The 21th C. will be the century… Read more »

Jaqship
Guest
Jaqship

Felix, the Jews who marry Gentiles generally have such a minimal Jewish identity, that, in their raising of the kids, their American identity is utterly dominant, and the Jewish part is at *most* an afterthought, *unless* Grandma is really into Jewish identity.

In the raising of kids (at least within intact families), the role of Grandmas is a factor apparently much overlooked by most analysts.

Jaqship
Guest
Jaqship

What I say here, about a minimal Jewish identity, is particularly true of the fair number of them who care beans about Israel.

Member

Ashkenazi Jews are of course, a European race.

LineInTheSand
Guest
LineInTheSand

My guess is that J*ws who say, “Please let me stay with the whites, I’m not like those crazy left wing J#ws” would often just start up the whole subversive drama over again. But maybe I’m wrong. M, you ask if there is a way to judge a person on their individual merits. Here are a few tests of assimilability. Will an individual J#w accept: • That almost none of their people should be allowed to immigrate here, because most are ethnocentric and anti-white? • The repeal of laws that punish questioning the Holocaust? • The dismantling of the Holocaust… Read more »

Darth Curmudgeon
Guest
Darth Curmudgeon

Regression to the mean. If the 20-30% “based” members of various ethnic groups could be discerned from the rest and allowed to stay, 70-80% of their offspring would be indistinguishable from the 70-80% that were expatriated the first time. Outlier’s children are rarely ever outliers themselves, you see this in IQ, athleticism, and political preferences.

Member

What fantasy world are you living in where “Holocaust Studies” is a program on every campus and we have laws “here” that punish Holocaust denial?

Of course, 320 million or so is enough.

Member

There’s no reason why Jews in America could not simply throw in with the white majority.

Not for their part, perhaps.

Othmar
Guest
Othmar

.. and this is why we must shout from the roof tops about all the jewish crimes against )))us((( we must never allow them to “return” to team White ever.

Member

“Their embrace of cultural conservatism was a matter of necessity, in order to fit into the Republican coalition.” Exactly. Neocon Jews and liberal Jews are operating from the same basic premise – further the interests of Jews and Israel. There is no dichotomy. There’s also no real problem in the current situation for Jews. Rich people are insulated from the wider societal problems, they live in their gated communities and behind the armed guards (and in their 5 *+ hotels and first class+ travel). The Jews will adopt whatever spectrum of political stances are required to keep funnelling money and… Read more »

Member

Yeah, Jews have armed guards. Like Kennedys.

Except most Kennedys don’t, being unrelated to dead presidents.

Traction
Guest

I used to be an rah-rah Israel sort of guy. Crossed US and Israeli flags as avatar, for the pleasure of making the pro-terrorist leftist explode with anger. Then I got a job in finance, where I quickly learned about Jewish attitudes toward whites… Let’s just say that Hillary’s “deplorables” and Biden’s “dregs” are tender and caring compared what your average Wall Street kippa’ed manager feels. A few years of that, and I’m firmly in the “lets add another country to the long list” mode. I have never seen more obnoxious, sociopathic bunch of ingrates. They make the average ghetto… Read more »

Issac
Guest
Issac

Ezra is Canadian, and a neocon par excellance. What in the world would you accomplish by sparing him? I just hope he never males aliyah to bother the rest of us.

Parker
Guest
Parker

Read it thrice, still not sure I get it. Is this article a troll, or a very subtle “ironic piece” celebrating the coming political homelessness of the j-men? For example: “The new opposition that is forming up in opposition to Team Brown is explicitly white, as well as nationalist and populist. While it is not explicitly antisemitic…” Oh yes it is. Or: “In a balkanized country, the only way for a tiny minority to survive is to attach to the most powerful tribe. Given the options on Team Brown, Team White is going to look like a better option, assuming… Read more »

Member

“Zman = Zimmerman, Zuckerberg?”

Jews live in your head for free.

Red Forman
Guest
Red Forman

It has always been interesting to me how many of the older generation “race realists” are so hard on blacks and so easy on jews. Here in the rural South, we have always been realistic about black/white differences, and have more or less lived in peace together. Both as Christian tribes, in a pretty idyllic way. Until the revolutionaries came to help us out….

Altlander
Guest
Altlander

The breakdown of the post WW2 narrative that this country has been riding on for 80 years is now going into overdrive. As a country of diverse regions and peoples we need an over arching national pageant to serve as the glue to create cohesion. A replacement has not been forthcoming. War has served as a backdrop 3 times, the American Revolution, the Civil War, WW2, War is inevitable, the Jews soured Whites on foreign endeavors with the Gulf War, so now unless China or Russia can be cornered into starting a war, the chances of a domestic one are… Read more »

Johnny
Guest
Johnny

“There’s no reason why Jews in America could not simply throw in with the white majority.”

Except for the fact that elite Jewish interests mandate the destruction of
White civilization, of what Belloc called ‘Christendom.’

Gore Vidal said back in the 80’s in the pages of The Nation that Jews have always served as a Fifth Column in America. He caught substantial fire for that bit of truthiness. Jonah Blobberg is to NR as elite Jews are to America; a force of vitiation.

Chaotic Neutral
Guest
Chaotic Neutral

This sounds like wishful thinking to me. The neocons are still having their way. We are still in Syria, the Middle East wars are still expanding, only in a cryptic way. If the left mishandled the Jews, I’ll bet you the army would be there to correct it. Just look at the mass media and the weird symbolic/esoteric stuff we are aware of, which has grown utterly pervasive. That’s an indicator of hegemony in my opinion.

This was the protocols of Zion stance 😉

DeBeers Diamonds
Guest
DeBeers Diamonds

Whenever a synagogue is attacked by over-eager South African blacks, the ANC quickly cracks down and arrests the perpetrators. This is despite their official anti-Israel stance. FWIW, the same also happens when a mob attacks a mosque. Now compare that with the Boers, and you see who truly has power. Also consider the argument from silence, I’ve read of Indians being attacked by SA blacks, but never the Chinese.

Chaotic Neutral
Guest
Chaotic Neutral

I don’t get what you mean. What’s the diff between Indians and Chinese?

DeBeers Diamonds
Guest
DeBeers Diamonds

The Indian government doesn’t care about its diaspora to the same degree that the PRC does. Attack a Chinese company and you probably get a death squad sent after you. Indians have also been the biggest beneficiaries of BEE, which blacks feel should be theirs alone.

Chaotic Neutral
Guest
Chaotic Neutral

As opposed to the white countries, which actually favor the nonwhites! *deep sigh*

Member

Moslems are a power behind the scenes in ZA? Who knew?

Babe Ruthless
Guest
Babe Ruthless

I’m actually not quite sure what Zman is saying in this article. But trying to get the Jews on our side is the same kind of wishful thinking as Conservative Inc. trying to get the Latinos on their side. It’s simply not going to happen. After thousands of years of being on nobody’s side but their own, they’re suddenly going to be on OUR side? Ah, castles in the sky. If we want our history to last as long as theirs, if we want our children to stand in the shade of that tree that the Zman is always talking… Read more »

Member

“After thousands of years of being on nobody’s side but their own, they’re suddenly going to be on OUR side?”

Nobody’s said this. Everyone’s on their own side. If Jews being on their own side is incompatible with membership in what’s becoming Team Brown, then what?

3g4me
Guest
3g4me

@1Gandydancer: “Nobody’s said this. Everyone’s on their own side. If Jews being on their own side is incompatible with membership in what’s becoming Team Brown, then what?”

Who GAF? The Jews can figure it out for themselves; their future is their own concern. My concern is solely with Western Civilization a/k/a Christendom. Everyone being on his own side means White Europeans of Christian heritage looking out for other White Europeans of Christian heritage, not wondering where Schlomo will find his next political home.

Member

Christendom is dead. Brain-dead, too, so it deserves that fate. No point tying WesternCiv to a corpse.

Member

I don’t think they can be trusted. They will always operate as a tribe. Eventually, they will pursue their own interests at whitey’s expense. As they are doing now. No reason to think this will end once they come aboard the Good Ship Europa.

Member

How does this bode well for the right or the cucked republican party?
If all the leftys that can’t tolerate the increasingly crazy democratic party come to our side, what would be the result. A stronger rightist movement? Hardly.

Look at National Review and that will be us. Let them form a third pRty and stay away. Jews in neocon form sure effed up this country and the world.

JWatson
Guest
JWatson

Good article Zman, but I believe your projecting what you want to happen or what you believe should happen. The best current example of the JQ is the bloodbath in the Middle East, I believe we’re at over 1 million dead and untold numbers of refugees. Who is responsible for this ‘Mexicans’? You let them in any organization and it will be corrupted, let team brown have them. Better on the outside then inside putting it in your back.

John Smith
Member

I dunno enough about Joos either. Historically they’ve been kicked out of every country they ever settled in, and to be honest, American politics would be better tomorrow if every Joo politico were turned into soap today. But the same could be said of pretty much all the liberals too.

When we start hanging the traitors and internal enemies of our nation it won’t matter to me one whit what flavour of vibrant they are. As long as they die hard and serve as a warning to the others, I am good with it.

Chaotic Neutral
Guest
Chaotic Neutral

Hey, OT sort of, except with regard to the JQ, my comments about Paulism vs libertarianism and the flow of talent from libertarianism to the alt right. There is a great short essay by Jared Howe in the new book A Fair Hearing from arktos media. Many great essays in this book, but in that essay he discusses the “libertarian to alt right pipeline,” and what is driving the alt right conversions at the high levels is a sort of buckleyite purge of anyone who dares to discuss closed borders in a positive light. Yes, he fingers exactly the same… Read more »

Whitemale979
Guest

Libertarianism makes sense when you believe that there is one correct value hierarchy, which everyone will come to if they think about it. Once you accept that biology and culture shape your values, it’s a nice, slow roll to the fourteen words.

bob sykes
Guest
bob sykes

Why do the Jews have to go anywhere? As long as they are willing to take a back seat in the Democrat Party, and to allow the Keith Ellison and Roy Perez’s to be the Party’s front, they can control it and them via funding. They also have a great deal of actual control on non-Jewish individuals in Congress, the Executive and the Courts. Witness our absurd and fundamentally anti-American policies in the Middle East, Africa, Central Asia and Eastern Europe. These policies are generated, controlled and imposed on the US by Jewish neocons. Even Trump has been forced to… Read more »

Lallo
Guest
Lallo

I have a great admiration for you, but: 1. Please do not fall into the group rationality fallacy. It is the fundamental flaw of the MacDonald thesis. Group rationality is a very poor concept to predict behavior. Elementary Nash equilibrium analysis shows that when the effect on the outcomes of the group of individual actions is small (infinitesimal) group interest is sacrificed in the computation of the optimal strategy of the individual. A group from this point of view is large when the number is larger than 10, imagine when it is in the millions. 2. As an example, the… Read more »

Member

The Jews did not create Google. I know. No dividends in the mail.

Member

The problem with the idea of the Jews “throwing in” with whites is that, at least since the destruction of the ancient northern kingdom and the Lost Tribes, the Jews have never thrown in with anyone. That’s why they’re still Jews.

Member

And why are you still whatever you are?

pyrrhus
Guest
pyrrhus

I’m afraid so…The other problem is that Jews in America are becoming dumber, which has been noticed by people like Cochran and Harpending, perhaps too many shiksas…While others, like Vox Day, have noticed that their purported intelligence has been exaggerated, while their clannishness and nepotism accounts for most of their success.My life long experiences with Jews and Jewish business confirms VD’s work…
As an attorney, I have seen Jewish businesses crater due to very excessive nepotism and group identification.

Dr. Dre
Guest
Dr. Dre

My bro-in-law, a well-regarded financial planner, has noticed many Jews seeking out non-Jewish professional services in recent years, lawyers, accountants etc. They work you hard, he says, but will promote you to others if you do a good job.

Severian
Guest

It seems like the Tribe’s in an impossible dilemma. Even if they wanted to join Team White — I mean 100%, all the way, everyone changes his name to Slade Jackington van Pelt IV — half of Team White wouldn’t let them. “Once a Jew, always a Jew” seems to be the rule — Karl Marx was antisemitic enough to give the Stormfront guys wood, but as his father was Jewish, Marxism is forever a “Jewish movement.” (Ditto Lenin). Every other white group in America gets a pass — nobody seriously suspects you of being a Vatican double agent if… Read more »

Parker
Guest
Parker

They’ve got a country, you know, and it’s not Madagascar.

Severian
Guest

The Irish have a country, too…

DeBeers Diamonds
Guest
DeBeers Diamonds

*Had

Ireland is not a country, its a tax haven for globohomo that intends to become Nigeria North.

Honorable Al Sharpton
Guest
Honorable Al Sharpton

So the jew has worn out his welcome and will find himself scrambling for a safe haven yet again, since time immemorial. Why would we accept the scorpion, knowing he has his stinger pointed at us, locked and loaded, ready to strike. The jew are a diaspora for a reason, but they have thier homeland now, so let them go home. we sure as hell don’t want them here.

Drake
Guest
Drake

I always assume the tribe would break up. The Orthodox and Conservative Jews (the ones who still have religion) leaning to the right. The secular ones going wherever their leftist brothers take them. The actual Israelis continuing to do whatever is in Israel’s best interest.

Member

There are a lot of people on this thread who insist the Jews are a “monolith”.

For sure, whatever I “join” can’t include them except as a fringe.

JohnTyler
Guest
JohnTyler

IMHO jewish voters will never leave the leftist socialist / progressive ideology and will vote accordingly; excepting the Hasidim, who are held in contempt by reform and/or Ashkenazi jews. If the left becomes even more blatantly anti-Semitic watch as jewish “leaders” bend ever greater backwards to remain within that ideological fold. Notice that neither Chuckie Schumer nor Diane Feinstein have uttered one word expressing any concern of the anti-semitic rhetoric emanating from their party nor have they said anything about the influence that Linda Sarsour (who should be deported to Syria to join what remains of ISIS) has gained within… Read more »

Jaqship
Guest
Jaqship

OK, John, Schumer and Feinstein may’ve laid low on Farrakhan, but Dershowitz sure as hell hasn’t.

Jaqship
Guest
Jaqship

The way things are going, Dersh could give one of them fits, if he were young enough to run against one of them.

james wilson
Guest
james wilson

Dersh is a unreformed Prog. The fact that he is not pointing that particular gun at his own head doesn’t mean he’s not your enemy.

Member

The fact that he’s still Left doesn’t salvage the claim that he is “bend[ing] ever greater backwards [tolerating antisemitism] to remain within that ideological fold.”

Member

The constant in elite Jewish politics isn’t left or right, it’s revolution vs accepting the status quo, with Jews always on the side of revolution. That’s why Trotskyites were able to transition so quickly to becoming neocons, because the neocon idea is to make the US the engine of worldwide revolution rather than the USSR. Trotskyism was actually reactionary as it looked back on the day before Stalin when it appeared possible that the USSR could be the base for revolution (when Stalin took over he consolidated power and eventually turned the tables upside down on the Jews). This is… Read more »

Member

“When the 6 day war happened in Israel the Trotskyites realized that the revolution was going to be happening elsewhere.”

Not following you.

Member

That said, Jews are the most adaptive people in human history. There’s no reason why Jews in America could not simply throw in with the white majority.

That would have worked 20 years ago, even 10 years ago. Maybe even 5 years ago.

Not now.

Toddy Cat
Guest
Toddy Cat

I have nothing against Jews, and admire many of their accomplishments. And, as noted above, a significant number of Jews (although far from a majority) are on our side and wish us well. But this knee-jerk hostility that a good many Jews display towards Christianity really does have to be addressed. For example, David Cole over at Taki’s mag is about as based a Jew as you’ll find; he’s even questioned some aspects of Holocaust Industry mythology, at great, great cost to himself. And yet, in a recent column, he goes off on a tirade against the late Lawrence Auster,… Read more »

Jaqship
Guest
Jaqship

Toddy, my sense of this is that Cole is an eccentric outlier, and that most Righty Jews have very respectful, if not outright warm, attitudes toward Christians (particularly really serious ones), esp. since 9/11 rubbed all of our noses into the degeneracy of most of Islam.
See e.g. the writings of Kalman Kaplan, and other Jews who write for the Journal of Psychology and Christianity.

Toddy Cat
Guest
Toddy Cat

Given the hostility of most Lefty Jews (the vast majority) I certainly hope that you’re right…

Jaqship
Guest
Jaqship

Well, Toddy, my sense of things is that, a certain number of far Lefty Jews (esp. the pro-Arab ones!) do indeed despise the Righty Jews’ warmth toward Christians.

This gap among Jews, between those with warm attitudes toward Christians, vs. the pro-Arab ones, is a far bigger deal than most Americans (incl. righties) understand.
I’ll *guess* that Europeans have a rather better feel for this.

Toddy Cat
Guest
Toddy Cat

Of course, it doesn’t help that it’s (mostly) the anti-Christian, pro-open borders Jews that you see on TV and read in online, whereas most pro-Christian Jews are either muted, or found on right-ghetto sites like VDARE (Stephen Steinlight)

Jaqship
Guest
Jaqship

Now we’re really getting somewhere, Toddy!
The MSM crams the worst down our throats, and systematically marginalizes the best.
I’ve a friend who was a player in Steinlight’s crowd, who could give you an earful about how the MSM brass play things, for open borders, vs. its cogent critics.
Google Sheldon Wolin on “inverted totalitarianism”.

Jaqship
Guest
Jaqship

Jews and Gentiles each have a similar problem, but with a subtle difference.
When a Zuckerberg sees to it that his (Jewish) foes are marginalized, JQers say “yeah, typical Jew!”
When Gates, Bezos, etc. do the same (incl. to their Gentile foes), nobody says “yeah, typical Gentile!”
Tho JQers might try to spin Bezos as being a Jew.

Ex-Pralite Monk
Guest
Ex-Pralite Monk

A few years ago I took a world religions class in college. We had guest speakers and field trips: we visited the local mosque and Hindu temples. We spoke with Muslims, Hindus, witches, evangelical Christians. They all discussed their faith and what it means to be a follower of their religion. Except the rabbi… He spent the entire time discussing the Holocaust, how gun control is good, and how Israel has to defend itself from its enemies. Not one word about what it means to be a Jew (unless being a Jew means lecturing everyone on the Holocaust and gun… Read more »

Drake
Guest
Drake

I’ve heard that is what reformed synagogues are like – not the scripture (Old Testament) reading and preaching I would have expected.

Is it the same in an Orthodox or Conservative synagogue? Or do they actually practice the religion?

Tax Slave
Guest

Did you ask him about “gun control” in Israel?

Ex-Pralite Monk
Guest
Ex-Pralite Monk

I think that falls under the heading “Israel has a right to defend itself.” Oh there was one more topic he discussed: money. He explained that Hannukah services are really expensive if you want to attend.

The entire field trip was a breeding ground for anti-Semitism. Whereas the other religious speakers were kind and compassionate in their own way, the rabbi was wound up, strident, and verbally aggressive. Really unpleasant man.

Lester Fewer
Guest
Lester Fewer

Strictly speaking, it wasn’t a breeding ground for “anti-Semitism,” which doesn’t exist as a separate category (viz., we already have a word for bigotry, and that word is “bigotry”). Based on your description, what your experience was, was the basis for beginning to form an unfavorable opinion of a particular human type, based on your observation and personal interaction. If you were to meet three more rabbis, and two gave you a favorable impression and one did not, then your judgment would simply grow more varied and complex. But “antisemitism” is effectively a racist term and concept, as it implies… Read more »

Member

A sample of 1 tells you squat.

There are SJW preachers and priests, too. A SJW Pope, for that matter,

Tax Slave
Guest

Zman, just wanted to let you know I appreciate all your efforts in sharing your observations, perspective and opinion. I also tend to agree with you on this matter. It’s a pity that so many here reflexively flip out at the mere mention of Jews. Yes, they have wrought a level of destruction but have also contributed greatly. Here’s a question to the frothing Jew-loon: was the Frankfurt School entirely made up of Jews? You sure they didn’t get their orders directly from the temple in Jerusalem?

Jaqship
Guest
Jaqship

Tax, the Jews’ main trouble is that they’re so damn vivid.
When a Jew ruins something, everyone notices that he’s a Jew.
Similarly with the Irish, but at least they’re Christians, so some fellow Christians sort of stick up for them.
But if, say, we Bohunks ruin something, virtually no one (at least since Hitler) uses it to tee off on us as a group. We’re just better at laying low.

Whitemale979
Guest

Okay, I’ll bite. was the Frankfurt School entirely made up of Jews? No, of course not. Ever heard of the Pareto Principle? When the bulk of a problem comes from a single source, that’s where you direct your attention first. You sure they didn’t get their orders directly from the temple in Jerusalem? Yes, I’m sure. Just like I’m sure the British don’t have to be told directly by the queen to be stoic, and sub Saharan Africans don’t have to be told to have tons of children despite malnutrition and poverty. People have natures, and the different nations have… Read more »

Member

It’s not just sub-Saharan Africans who have tons of children when in a state of malnutrition and poverty. You’ve got the causation backasswards.

Whitemale979
Guest

You know what? You’ve got me dead to rights there. But there are differences that I don’t think can be explained away by socioeconomic status.

Member

No disagreement there.

A 30 point difference in IQ between Icelanders and Somalis explains a lot. But Icelanders too were once tribal. And probably had lots of kids when early death was more common.

Johnny
Guest
Johnny

Genetic evidence indicates that ashkenazi men intermarried with goyische women in Poland, Silesia, Germany about 600-800 years ago, and thus… who’s Jewish? Not to mention they are tribe of Japheth, not Shem. Japheth who begat Gomer who begat Ashkenaz. Who’s Jewish? Whatever. Letting an alien elite, whatever they want to call themselves as, take control of our currency (and all Western nation’s currencies) and then use the monopoly power of wealth creation to come into possession of all major media, in an age of technological advancement that makes media the most powerful propaganda tool in human history, was probably not… Read more »

Burner Prime
Guest
Burner Prime

Whites on the left are starting to be displaced by Cortez-like and other POC candidates. There are more and more calls to replace the old whites like Pelosi and Feinstein. Feinstein is a good one to watch. It’ll be interesting to see how she tries to navigate. She has held some (relatively) conservative views, but always knew to toe the liberal line in order to get re-elected. Other old white lefties are going with the flow, trying to stay relevant as their party lurches to the left of Che. They may indeed be left out all alone (a very dangerous… Read more »

ristreto
Guest
ristreto

Jews are around thousands of years. Why not ask people, who crossed them in history? Like Russian Tsar family, some peasants in Europe or they neighbors in Middle East…. Because there are not killing fields in America as results of Jewish policies, you should probably align with them. Some people complaint about opioid deaths, but there is no connection to Jews 🙂 This time it will sure work well with goys .

TomA
Guest
TomA

If (or when) the time comes to fight for our lives, evolutionary history teaches that (over the long run) it will be the strong and smart that tend to persist and endure. It really won’t matter much how you came by those attributes (e.g. parent’s genes, inherited identity, absorbed cultural biases, or personal dedication, etc.), you will either prevail or expire based upon the best you can put forth. Lots of study/analysis has gone into forecasting what a future conflict might look like, and fealty to esoteric group affiliations is unlikely to be determinative. Our species is not a hive… Read more »

Brooklyn
Guest
Brooklyn

“Still, the bulk of of Jews fit neatly into the stereotype of cosmopolitan Jew.” The one thing that you could say unifies almost all Jews is being an urban people. Being almost entirely city folk does explain a lot of Jewish positions and outlook on most issues. (This actually was one of the positions Zionism was trying to fix, the argument being that the Jews were not a healthy people because they were overly urban and needed to return to the land to become normal as a people.) “Another complication is that Team Brown is not all that fond of… Read more »

Jaqship
Guest
Jaqship

Super stuff, Brooklyn, esp. on the urban and intermarriage aspects, and on “Liberal Jewish identity is mostly hollowed out”.

One of the things most irritating things about most JQ-ers is that, they’re stuck fighting the last war.
Maybe they just don’t actually know any Jews well enough, to see what’s quite obvious to those of us who do.

Member

“…NeverTrump was a good thing; it helped to flush the system a little faster. The problem we have is that we could use new blood but the people in power don’t want to retire.”

Ryan, Flake, Corker… McCain…

Trump is no panacea, but no one said this would be easy.

chedolf
Guest

Michael Medved, writing in Commentary magazine: https://www.commentarymagazine.com/articles/why-are-jews-liberals-a-symposium/ “For most American Jews, the core of their Jewish identity isn’t solidarity with Israel; it’s rejection of Christianity. …. Jewish voters don’t embrace candidates based on their support for the state of Israel as much as they passionately oppose candidates based on their identification with Christianity—especially the fervent evangelicalism of the dreaded ‘Christian Right.’ This political pattern reflects the fact that opposition to Christianity—not love for Judaism, Jews, or Israel—remains the sole unifying element in an increasingly fractious and secularized community… “The anti-Christian obsessions of American Jews lead not only to skewed perceptions… Read more »

Parker
Guest
Parker

Hmm, one wonders if the animus against Christianity hasn’t transferred to “Christendom”, i.e., white people, generally.

TBoone
Guest
TBoone

The Tribe has the very real problem. Not “us”. I don’t sit on any of the mythical “our thing” committees that have all the power to make decisions for all…. I am willing to associate with. work next to any one who proves to have similar values/standards as me/us. Some who post here, or elsewhere will not make that ‘cut’. I shant be welcome in all places either. This is a thought exercise. As I understand it. Not a Bitch!!Hunt!!. Where we bitch about who & why we should ‘hunt’. We always need to discriminate. Wisely. Based on what is… Read more »

Frank
Guest
Frank

I know this is a bit out of context but …… within the last couple of weeks, Ben Shapiro has replaced John Bachelor on WMAL’s 8-10 pm time slot. That pisses me off to some degree. John Bachelor has a very interesting show discussing history, books, big events, etc. and it is free from the shrill talking points of the day and focuses on longer term and issues from a historical perspective. I know Ben Shapiro is supposed to be the voice of modern conservatism or something, but, he sounds like a guy posturing for something, and after listening to… Read more »

james wilson
Guest
james wilson

If there is one single thing I sense is most lacking in the small Jewish plantation of dissident thinkers, it is an unapologetic, continuous, firm, and vocal disparagement of the Jewish political culture. It would need be in quite the same vein as Glenn Filthie took with his own family. A complete break. The price is what it is. Absent that commitment, may they find their latest advantage anywhere else. The Right does not seek an advantage, it seeks a home.

Jaqship
Guest
Jaqship

There is no real “Jewish political culture” apart from the broader culture, except for the Israel part, which is dying anyway.

Jaqship
Guest
Jaqship

dying, except for among the Orthos.

Jaqship
Guest
Jaqship

The one aspect of Jewish “political culture” worth a look, is the poll-data voting gap between the single females and the rest.
I’ll bet that this owes to some gripping subtlety.

Padre
Guest
Padre

E Michael Jones has been writing on this for years

Jaqship
Guest
Jaqship

James, does the work of Ron Unz fit your bill here?

Member

Not following you. What does, e.g., Stephen J. Miller or Dennis Prager not say about Feinstein and Schumer?

Jaqship
Guest
Jaqship

Gandy, it’s not clear which comment about those 2 a-holes you’re addressing.
Nobody in this thread raised Prager.

JohnTyler raised a beef about how those 2 didn’t squeal vs. Farrakhan, and I mentioned that Dersh did.

Lars and I referred to Miller in other threads late yesterday.
Please clarify your query.