Lessons of the Fields Trial

James Fields, the person who drove his car into a crowd of left-wing rioters in Charlottesville, during the Unite the Right rally two summers ago, was convicted of all counts last week. The top count was first degree murder, which means the jury agreed with the state that he drove into the crowd intending to harm people. Technically, he could get the death penalty, but the guidelines recommend life without parole. The jury will make a recommendation this week and the judge will formally sentence him in the next month.

Everyone with an interest in the case has made their position clear. The Left, of course, loves the sight of blood, so they are thrilled with the result. The alt-right people, who followed the case, are obviously disgusted at the show trial and result. They are correct that this whole thing was a mockery of justice. While reasonable people can disagree about his culpability, sending him away for life is a vulgar act of vengeance. Regardless, it is an event that should provide some very clear lessons for the dissident right.

For starters, right-wing movements in America have always made the mistake of assuming the Left is amenable to humanitarian appeals. This case makes clear that to be on the Left is to have abandoned any shred of mercy or compassion. The kid should not have been there and he certainly got mixed up with some bad people. Order requires he pay some penalty for what he did, but sending this young man to jail for life is vicious and cruel. There is no mercy on the Left. There never will be.

Another lesson, is that we no longer live in a land of laws. What has gone on in Virginia since that rally is an abomination. This is just the most recent act of lawlessness. Over the last year or so, other men have been sent away for hard time over trivial things, simply because they are white and hold the wrong opinions. Meanwhile, the blacks involved were handed checks and allowed to promote themselves off their crimes. For white people, there is no justice in the court system, so make sure you stay out of it.

Of course, this rally did not spring from nothing. The organizers who put it together and promoted it have some culpability here. The thing that leaders must always accept is they are responsible for their people. That’s part of leadership. When you lead your men into a fight, they expect that you are not leading them into a trap or into certain death. Leadership requires a sense of duty to those you are leading. The people who put this together failed in that regard and they should be judged accordingly.

That said, most involved were new to activism and can be forgiven for getting caught up in the spirit of the times. Mike Enoch, who has done everything he can to support the men being persecuted, has clearly learned a hard lesson from this. He is a guy who deserves credit for not only learning from the event, but accepting some responsibility for blundering into a trap. Not everyone involved has covered themselves in glory, though, and that’s a good lesson moving forward. Leadership is not just about being cheeky on YouTube.

That last point is salient, because that is another lesson of this affair. In fact, the best way to think about Charlottesville now is in the fuller context of the pogrom launched against dissidents this past year. The normal way of resolving disputes in a civil society are no longer available. The people in charge are slowly swinging the authoritarian door closed on us. They are corrupting every aspect of civil life in order to prevent any challenge to their authority. These show trials are just one aspect of their greater war on us.

There is no civil way forward and that means thinking different. The people who rule over us, whether you wish to use archaic terms like Marxist or socialist, or you like neologisms like cosmopolitan globalists, they do not see themselves as bound by the letter of the law, because  they see themselves as the spirit of the law. Tim Cook is not ready to declare himself a god, but he has declared himself the high priest of the new faith of the ruling class. There’s no mercy in the righteous and no reasoning with a fanatic.

Finally, the deafening silence from the people claiming to be in opposition to this growing tyranny, people like Ben Shapiro, is important. A lot of people on the dissident right think these anachronisms from a bygone age will wake up and begin to agitate on our behalf, but that will never happen. As has been explained many times, their real role is as defenders of the system. It’s why they hate Tucker Carlson so much. he actually talks about some of these things, thus exposing the perfidy of the Ben Shapiros of the world.

Whatever comes next next is not going to happen within the old system. It is too corrupt and too compromised. That’s the great lesson of the last year. In a lawless age, one has to let go of the law in order to avoid the law. A great Chinese curse is “May the authorities become aware of you.” For our age, the opposite is true. Never let the authorities become aware of you. If the current slide into darkness is to be arrested, it will happen because what comes out of the shadows is strong enough to stop it.

171 thoughts on “Lessons of the Fields Trial

  1. If only Fields were a musician… “Pub patrons had begun to attack his Bentley and Moon, drunk, began driving to escape them. During the fracas, he hit Boland. After an investigation, the coroner ruled Boland’s death an accident and Moon received an absolute discharge after being charged with a number of offences”

    HIt, BTW, is an understatement: Boland’s body was dragged under Moon’s car.

  2. In the army, lost battle is normally the thing that teaches most. All alarm bells go off and every fool understand that changes are necessary.
    Have you heard that Soviets considered Stalingrad their strategic loss ? After Stalingrad, German Army was finally reformed for winter war, this prolonged the war at least 1 year and caused Soviets so many losses that Soviet Union never completely recovered.

  3. Another excellent post, Zman. I beheld, and the same horn made war with the saints, and prevailed against them…And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High (i think this includes all who genuinely try to live good and decent lives rather than those who merely make a show of religion), and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time. Written 2500 years ago. Whether one believes in prophecy, this is worth thinking about. This may not describe what is happening currently, but it certainly feels like it it is in motion. Doesn’t mean we give up without opposing it, though. I agree, not time for armed resistance. But it is time to open our eyes and pay attention to the strange things that are happening on the earth.

  4. Meanwhile in Suffolk County the new head prosecutor, SJW Rachel Rollins, announced her office won’t prosecute negroes who rough you up, pummel a cop, break into your home and help themselves to your stuff, kill your pets, or show up in your front yard to sell your children illicit drugs. She emphatically rejects “broken window” policing.

    Presumably if you should resist a home invasion, the perp will walk free and you will be arrested. Talk about paradigm shift. If I lived there I’d be tempted to shoot ’em anyway and emplace a screwdriver in the corpse’s hand because “I feared for my life!” eliminates recidivism.

    • True and you just know Trump will want to brag that he gave this kid lethal injection with the 30 hatecrime charges from DOJ. I can forsee lots of young whites being done with Trump by years end. Boomers will brag about the dead nazi too.

  5. “The normal way of resolving disputes in a civil society are no longer available. The people in charge are slowly swinging the authoritarian door closed on us. They are corrupting every aspect of civil life in order to prevent any challenge to their authority.”



    As for James Field, accounts of the trial I read described his court-appointed defense counsel as more or less openly assisting in their client’s conviction. Their cross-examination of key witnesses never attempted to undermine the prosection’s case, even when it would have been shockingly easy for them to have done so.

  6. This was a PR disaster for our enemies, just like Waco and Ruby Ridge was, at a low cost to our side. How many people are awakened by such actions? It is crucial for the ruling class to keep people asleep, and believing in the institutions. They failed with Charlottesville.

    Yes, it was not low cost to the few people caught up in the mess, but that is always so in any action or war. The cost that matters has to do with the big picture, not at the individual level. The war that is coming will see many individuals making great sacrifices. That is unavoidable.

  7. Look ahead to where things are going. I have no doubt Trump/Huber/Horowitz have the goods on Hillary, Obama, the real Russians, Uranium 1, and so on. Comey, Clapper, Brennan, McCabe, and all their underlings.

    But the chaff dropping by the paid off media (who they also have the goods on) is going to reinforce the bubble around the Progs and many of the normies, to the point where reality will be undetectable amongst the noise. Especially if you have been trained out of actually examining evidence or thinking for yourself. That is the new endgame of the Left. You can see the battlespace being prepared for it. Think about where it leads. People here already know the answer, this will just be more fuel on the fire.

    Trump is a personally vengeful SOB, so if he holds back, the only reason is a gun to his family’s heads.

  8. Really great post, in a melancholy sort of way. ‘This’ cannot be solved within the system. I dont know what that means except that it will mean an interesting chapter in future history books. And quite a few of us will die, or rot in prison. It’s easy to be brave on the internet. But it will take more.

  9. At least now we know now that we live under a hostile Jewish occupation that is wearing America’s skin as a suit.

    • Consider that other Bernie, bro — Madoff. He was able to scam tens of billions USD almost exclusively from juice. Not even the wasps could invest that much money in such a brief period of time. Yet Madoff and majority of his investors are serfs in comparison with Rothschild-stratus (((money families))).

      America’s skin was harvested, donned then discarded by juice and it was recycled into small shoes worn in winter by money family dogs and cats. (((They))) are currently wearing NWO skin suits but once opportunity appears they’ll ditch those suits and not bother wearing anything because they won’t have to.

  10. Fields fled from people pointing rifles at him and banging on his car with bats. The extremely obese “victim” died of a heart attack….Judicial lynchings coming to a court near you, stay away from crowds and lay low.

  11. To be strong enough to stop it means being strong enough to defend ourselves as well.

    This means we need to think and act logistically.

    The northern half of the US (north of the 40th Parallel) is very very very white (we can reform a few “troubled” areas). We should make it even more white. This will mean leaving areas where our families may have resided for decades if not centuries. Roots are important but survival has to come first.

    Have a region you dominate, have a region you can defend…and you have a region that can ignore whatever crap comes out of DC – NY – SF – LA.

    This area is resource rich, lots of military bases, excellent deep water ports,etc.

    As Greg Johnson is so fond of saying: “Americans move all the time.” Implying it’s not that big a deal if we’re motivated enough.

    Many of us have moved to go to school and to chase a buck. Our ancestors left their homes a century or 3 ago which were settled during the early Holocene.

    Moving to survive, to strengthen, to resist and to act seems like pretty good motivation.

  12. Study the insurgencies of the past with an eye towards how their strategies and tactics apply to political and meta-political conflict.

    I am disturbed that there are still many out there who regard Richard Spencer as some sort of leader. He never was, and never will be. In another context he might have been a glib and effective pitchman. That context is no longer possible.

  13. JFK once said “Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable.” I think he was spot on with that.

  14. The real lesson is if you find yourself in a similar situation, and have no other means of defending youself, and If you’re gonna be put away for life anyways, take out as many of the motherfuckers as you can.

    • I don’t think Fields’ car could build up sufficient kinetic energy under the circumstances to do a whole lot of damage. My understanding is the cat lady who died largely succumbed to her own physical liabilities.

    • In essence that’s what the verdict is telling us. If you defend yourself, your life is over and you become a rape toy for Dwane and Jose until you die.

      So you may as well go full tilt boogie and take as many with you as you can.

      And drive a big SUV or pickup with stout steel bumper, That way you can keep on rolling through the Lefty masses with little difficulty

  15. Are there any lawyers hanging around here who can explain this absurd outcome?

    I’m not a lawyer and I didn’t follow the case closely, but even a layman like me, watching lazily and from a vast distance, could spot mountains of exculpatory evidence. From what I could gather, based only on viewing the thing as a fairly simple chess position, it should have been a mighty struggle even to get a guilty verdict on something as mild as reckless endangerment.

    Presumably, touchy cases like this usually come down to crafty jury selection. A single non-NPC juror could have easily hung the jury — and not even for political or ideological reasons, just for procedural ones.

    The whole thing should be reversed on appeal, on the grounds that Fields, prima facie, did not get a fair trial or a competent defense, strictly on the grounds that he was convicted of Murder One when no such conviction, to a reasonable person, was either logically or legally possible.

    • Each state has its own procedural rules, so it may be different. But generally, a “no evidence” or “insufficient evidence” point could be raised on appeal to reverse the conviction. Those are generally high mountains to climb. I did not follow the case, so do not know what was/was not entered into evidence. Ineffective assistance of counsel is another potential point, but short of showing up blind drunk every day, those usually do not fly. Doesn’t matter how credible evidence is – credibility is completely up to the jury. If there is anything, they can pretty much do what they want. Sucks, but that’s the jury system for you. Like everything else in this world, it can be and has been corrupted. Not doubt they worried about what sort of “message” acquittal would send and the ensuing mayhem if they got it “wrong.” (c.f. Rodney King). Would be curious to know if the prosecution struck any straight white male jurors, and how many.

      • Thanks for those insights, c matt.

        Still, I’m looking at this using chess logic, not actual courtroom know-how. All the same…

        Granted, procedures vary from state to state. But in my state, a standard, binding jury instruction is this: if a fact can be reasonably interpreted in more than one way, then the interpretation which favors the defendant is the one which must be adopted. MUST.

        Even the most Ernie Bushmiller-level review of the evidence shows that Fields can make a claim, based on tie-goes-to-the-defender rules, that he feared for his safety. So, premeditation goes straight out the window and we’re already down to Murder Two, more likely simple Manslaughter. On appeal it should be easy to show that the jury simply ignored a basic instruction, and therefore found falsely.

        But who knows about VA, maybe they operate under Theodoric of York, Medieval Judge rules.

        I’m only bringing this up for the benefit of neutrals and normies, to show that claims that this was a bogus finding are based on more than hand-waving and personal bias.

        • even worse, virginia is not a “proximate cause” state. therefore the coroner’s ruling of death by heart attack should have legally ended any murder charge. the fact that it did not proves beyond doubt we are now firmly in multi-tiered justice ie no longer justice for all but levels of justice for different groups. this is a key feature of third world tin pot dictatorships. the republic is no longer.

    • The conviction will be sustained on appeal unless there is evidence already on record of due process else procedural violation.

      Criminally culpable mind: intended actions to cause grievous physical harm to political opponents —-> Fields published statements promoting violence against his political opponents both contemporarily and in the days leading up to the event

      Criminal act: turned the car into a weapon by deliberately driving into a crowd —-> Field was behind the wheel and operated the vehicle which struck and killed a woman

      No reasonable exculpation —-> Field was relatively safe inside his sealed up car, no door or window had been breached and there were police present thus he should have turned off the car and waited, he also could have dialed 9-1-1 on his cell phone

      Slam dunk. Unless commuted or pardoned, which is highly unlikely, Field is going to die in prison.

      • Sometime I hate it when you are right. Field’s messed up big time; however, the difference between ending up like Fields vs. Reginald Denny is a few seconds. This is good to keep in mind if you are ever attacked by a mob. You must wait until the last possible instant before using force, and even then you need a lot of luck.

        • It also depends highly upon who you run over – and whether or not you’re dumb enough to let it get caught on camera.

          If there’s one thing I learned as far back as middle school – it’s that if somebody wants to get into a fight with you, unfortunately the best way to get away with beating them to within an inch of their life – is to let them start the fight – and you HAVE TO let them get in some good whooping before you fight back and beat the living hell out of them.

          That way you get the effect of the whole ” he was just defending himself ” defense pretty well cemented in the eyes of bystanders, most of whom are going to be subject to their own preconceptions (women ESPECIALLY) – about what was going on.

          Of course in a bar full of leftists – even this strategy likely will not work because they’re going to want you dead anyway – rules and perceptions of fairness be damned.

          You have to know your audience. And you have to play to your audience. I keep telling people this – and they simply cannot seem to fathom it.

          Trump did this when he made his comments about all the illegals being rapists and murderers – and he lit off the lefties who went around screaming and yelling about what he said. Then – he got lucky and Kate Steinle got murdered. Proving him correct. Now – a well read and betting man could probably make that statement based on the odds – and know that sometime in the next few weeks somewhere an illegal was going to murder somebody. Trump just got lucky and hit the trifecta.

          IMHO one of the ‘ smartest ‘ things that people on the right could do – is to act like a fifth column and encourage attacks by lefties – upon the “normies”.

          I can tell you that it doesn’t take much to open some people’s eyes – once they are made to realize that the Eye of Sauron is glancing their way.

          My wife for instance – gets all pissed off now whenever all the race mixing and black face commercials come on TV. Once I subtly pointed it out to her – she really ran with it.

          The fight isn’t out there running your car into crowds – the fight is at the dinner table and in your own home. Far too often I see people on the right complain about their wife and kids being lunatic leftists. How the hell do you think you’re going to take over the whole world if you can’t even control your own home?

        • Woah, was just thinking same…along lines of “how can you be safe in your car after the Reginald Denny beating?”

      • @FellowDissident: well I imagine you’re right, and also I bet you know way more about this stuff than I do.

        All the same, I can’t resist a good chess problem, so here are some counter-arguments. Again, this is chess logic, not legal expertise…

        1. Criminally culpable mind — “Fields published statements…” In the era of shit-posting, drunk-blogging, Ambien-induced Twitter tirades, in an age where half the Internet is a cross between road rage and a middle school food fight, a good lawyer should be able to make anything Fields said on social media look thoughtless and inconsequential. I remember when lots of people publicly expressed a desire to “hate-fuck” Sarah Palin; zero arrests made. I happen to have read more than my fair share of the writings of Mao Zedong. This does not make me responsible for the depredations of the GPCR. Did Fields say random nasty things on the Internet, or did he go to the deliberate painstaking trouble of printing and distributing his own crackpot newsletter? Mens rea requires a mens, not a men’s room.

        2. Criminal act: “deliberately driving the car into a crowd”. Highly suspect, given the circumstances. “Deliberately,” given the evidence, should be easily deconstructed by any competent counsel. Psychological tests, stress-induced lack of agency, fight-or-flight instincts, the fear-inducing precedents of Reginald Denny and that White guy who got beaten to death with hammers outside his car by a psychotic mob in the wake of Ferguson. This is one rabbit that can be put back into the hat with dispatch.

        3. “Fields was relatively safe inside his car” — relative to what? An angry mob was banging on his car with sticks, and sticks break windows, and windows, once broken, no longer protect drivers from mobs with sticks. This process can take less than ten seconds, and it was immanent and clear. No appeals to cops or 911 are reasonable. The guy had very recently been chased by a lunatic with a firearm, who openly bragged about doing so. So he also knew that weapons more dangerous than sticks were afloat, and police are not known for magically flying through a crowd to take a bullet for a stranger. Again, a competent lawyer should be able to make these claims irrelevant.

        Unfortunately I suspect you’re right, and this poor sap is shit out of luck. But he didn’t have to be. How did that come about?

        • The only real weakness is what he posted before the event. Anything else seems like a decent attorney could plant a lot of doubt. But his mindset ahead of time, I would subpoenaed all of the online records of the people with the bats, etc. surrounding his vehicle. I bet they were discussing violence as well. Make his mindset seem less unique but part of what was happening.

          How did the actual trial proceed? Does anyone have any good links? I am actually surprised he received more than manslaughter.

          • Oh, do they have him as having said incriminating things b4 the event? That would be a kicker, unfortunately. Nowadays, I’ve heard of cases where even if a white accidentally injures a nonwhite, for example in a carcwreck, they will comb through the persons emails and online activities to find evidence of racial bias! You know to make it look like a “hate crime.” That would mean many of us commenters are screwed.

          • Yeah, in the months before, he posted joke images about running over protestors. Looks very very incriminating. He may be guilty of first degree. He got sentenced to over 400 years! No chance of parole in Virginia. Jeez.

        • Even a few appeals judges have based their ruling on (they said) twitter posts by Trump, giving any ruling about migration an implied meaning. People are getting fired because of twitter posts. Wish they were not receiving the attention they are getting.

      • Actually, a few of the ‘facts’ you cited are not so. The coroner’s report said that the land whale Heather Heyer died of a heart attack, not from any kind of blunt force trauma. The heart attack was most likely brought on by a combination of her being extremely morbidly obese, and the stress of high heat and high humidity, exertion, and excitement.

        In addition, the still shots and video footage showed her leaning prostrate against the sloping front end of a mini van, three vehicles ahead of where the defendant’s vehicle rear ended the stopped vehicles. Had he really impacted the vehicles hard enough for a chain reaction to reach the land whale, she would have been flung ass over tea kettle. She would not have still been hugging the grill and windshield of the mini van.

        Any halfway competent defense attorney could have gotten him acquitted.

    • Show trials operate under their own logic and rules. We are going to see quite a few show trials in the near future.

    • You don’t need a lawyer to explain the verdict. 1) you had a biased jury selection 2) you had an inexperienced defense counsel 3) you had a failure to prove a reasonable fear for your life, which was essential to a self defense justification.
      I was once in exactly Fields situation. My vehicle was surrounded and being rocked by a flash mob. I had made the mistake of pulling too close to the vehicle in front of me and had no possibility of driving away or reversing (as the guy in back blocked me in as well). I was armed and now plotted my escape by shooting my way out through the driver side.
      However, I was situationally aware enough to wait until the interior was breached and there was no alternative to deadly force. Result? While looking around and plotting an escape route, about a dozen police cruisers slammed into the intersection and out of each four or so officers emerged in riot gear. Vans dumped more up the road. The intersection cleared pretty quickly and we were directed back towards more controlled and calmer streets.
      Makes one wonder if just a lack of a broken car window is why Fields is doing a Life stretch in prison.

    • It will be either reversed on appeal or greatly reduced to something like release based on time already served. There are just so many things wrong here. I can’t believe the trial was not moved out of the area.

      • Who dares pay to pursue an appeal?
        When do payment processors, etc start cutting off that avenue, as well?

  16. All this happens while the Republicans hold the Executive, Senate and even the House at the time. Plus Trump has the Justice department. How bad do you think the future will be for our kind? By now, everyone has received the message, right?

    • And Trump is cucking out as hard as he can, trying to twist McConnell’s arm to get him to pass the “let all the drug dealers and other minority criminals out of prison” bill being pushed by Rand Paul and the other libertardian wannabes before the end of the legislative session. Trump’s decided he can buy some black votes in 2020 by letting their baby daddys out of jail. He’ll compromise with the Dems next year on gun control next.

  17. A simple point that gets lost in all of the 2nd amendment blather is that the concept of self defense is under attack. Fields panicked when he was attacked by a mob. His car effectively became a weapon. George Zimmerman killed when he was attacked by Travon Martin. The police officer in the Mike Brown/Ferguson fiasco was also under attack when he fired a fatal shot. There have been many other tragic deaths in the intervening time period between these incidents, but only the ones where self defense is a part of the scenario are blown up into media circuses. A couple of different young black men were shot while holding toy guns for example–a short bit of wailing, and the media moves on to the next story. Seen from this perspective it is likely that leftist agitation will not stop with hi cap magazine control, gun bans, knife control, or even pointy stick control. Media will make a huge fuss whenever a white person defends himself. And when all white men are finally defenseless…

    • The assault on the 2A is only partly about guns. The 2A acknowledges your right to protect yourself and your own by any means necessary. Stripping the 2A is about stripping you of your right and your means to protect yourself however you see fit. The other rights will quickly fall in due course. “Rights? You have no stinking rights”. Plan accordingly.

  18. The Ancien Régime of the United States is dead, has been dead. What will follow? History tells us that it’s gonna be a strong man. The populace is armed to the teeth, the federal government is bankrupt, and Robespierre is rabble rousing in the cities. I have a little farm in the middle of nowhere that I can run to. Hope I can ride it out.

    • We haven’t had our middle class revolution yet. Just rumblings. The French Revolution devolved into terror because the right wanted to have a war that they thought would cement their gains in the early revolution. All we need to do is stay out of war if we get in charge. In other words, don’t be a Girondin.

  19. Yesterday marked 30 days since I moved from Charlottesville to a quiet farming community some 40 miles south. My only regret is that I didn’t move sooner. The entire city is overcome with a sense of guilt that is palpable the moment you step out the door. The burden of accepting diversity and tolerance has frayed the nerves of everyone to such a degree that it is impossible to drive 5 minutes in any direction within the city without witnessing an incident of road rage. From the balcony of my 4th floor apartment I could see the front lawn of Monticello, and on quiet evenings I would have sworn I could hear old Tom Jefferson spinning in his grave like a driveshaft. If he were to come back and see what has become of his beloved city and university he would projectile vomit.

  20. Charlottesville was a baptism by fire. It showed us that we really were a dissident movement and would be treated as such. The alt-right learned something important. If you cant be co-opted, like the TEA party, you will be crushed.

    • Anyone who doesn’t bend the knee will be crushed. Whites are the only group with the (potential) will and the ability to challenge Shlomo’s iron grip. Blacks? Meh. They can riot all they want. In the end they can always be brought to heel. All the other ethnic groups are too small or uninterested in revolutionary change. Ergo, Whites who haven’t bought into GloboGayplex must be crushed.

      The system doesn’t care about who can’t figure out what bathroom to use on any given day, or who wants to drug himself into oblivion. It likes movements like those because they can be framed as “freedumb.” And that’s what America is all about. Instead of agitating for real change we get the hollow echo of liberty in vice. It’s enough for most. It’s prison for any who speak up too loudly for something genuine and organic.

      • Nathan, it really is a perversion of human nature. We supposedly have agency over our genes (all the genders), and collectively over the climate by our living in caves, but not over things like self protection, association, speech, and thought. Those perversions have a way of righting themselves, but it ain’t going to be pretty.

  21. The USA is going to continue to fly apart like an out-of-control engine. Which part breaks first won’t matter, the engine is shaking to pieces. There is a dynamic at work similar to the process in Former Yugoslavia during the rise of Milosevic, that is, leaders on the left and right will find more short-term success in appealing to their radicals than to the middle. This will accelerate the disintegration process. The precise shape of the coming civil war is unknown, but it’s coming. Some type of “dirty civil war” similar to Argentina in the 1970s is likely at a minimum, running all the way up the spectrum to the shattering of Yugoslavia.

    • I agree. Civilizations can never course correct, they have to crater. Out of that comes something different, not always for the better. The Roman empire is a oft cited example. It’s like a horrible dream that you know is a dream, but can do nothing about. The forces are now unleashed for the fall of western civilization, and in my opinion the locomotive can’t be stopped. California, the mass migration UN pact, the Somali invasion in my own state, all so depressing!

      • But once this process begins, there will be nothing to stop determined communities of hard men from eliminating the degenerates within their midst. It has happened before.

    • No father in this guys life and not much future for him and many like him.
      Cannon fodder for these evil progressives and their enablers. Guide your sons well people and take Z’s advice here.

      They keep telling us how much they hate us and here is the message hammered home. What else do we need.

        • That’s because conservatives are on the same team and the few that aren’t are without any real ideology other than let the Left and global corporations ass rape America to death so long as they get a cut

          I hugely prefer the Left to these people, as the Left might believe stupid things at least they have an ideology

          Paraphrasing The Big Lebowski Say what you want about socialism, at least its an ethos

        • Find me one. ONE “conservative” male talker that is not a total effing girly man. One. ONE that doesn’t get manicures. One. ONE that changes his own oil, gets his hands dirty. And does not hang out in the green room with the same leftist talkers milking the Fall of the United States.

        • That’s the biggest problem. Cons/trads with power just sat and watched as several elections were stolen from us right in front of our eyes. The GOP gov should have fired Sykes first time she pulled this. I hear he said he was afraid of race riots. Well, he and his party almost got paid back bad by her. And now she’s fighting her suspension? Somebody in office needs to hammer these people.

        • Conservatives are nothing but another name for Republicans. And Republicans hate the white blue collar and middle-class. Who you think came up with NAFTA, WTO, GATT, Republicans/conservatives.

          They worked night and day since daddy Bush to a**rape the country and off-shore industry. Cheered on by talk radio shills like Praeger, Limbaugh, Hannity, etc.

          Conservatives want whites to die off as much as the Left does. They hate us and they are the enemy as much as the Left is. Just think of them as two separate butt cheeks that surround the same u-know what.

      • What you need are older men with enough ballsack to not accept this sort of judicial nihilism. Failing that, you need Maoism to put the cucks in labor camps where they can learn solidarity.

  22. I agree that the corruption is too deep to ever root out without a purge and start-over. They don’t even try to hide it. Mueller indicts anyone who supports Trump while granting immunity to Clintonistas like himself. He granted Tony fucking Podesta immunity! Imran Awan got a slap on the wrist for using his friendship with DWS to spy on Congress. A Clinton Whistleblower got his house raided by the FBI last week – all coincidences we are supposed to believe.

    It’s obvious and in your face now. Saying otherwise is the kind of forced lying / humiliation that Derbyshire described.

  23. Put aside childish notions. We are no longer in the nursery. To oppose naked tyranny will require blunt force. Anyone trying to sell you on “reasoned arguments made through our democratic system” is selling you snake oil.

    • I’ll have a post about this later, but I think another type of person to avoid is the one claiming armed reaction is the only way forward. Those were the sorts egging on the alt-right. They could not have been more wrong. Frankly, I assume anyone advocating armed struggle is a Fed. Ditto for people littering their social media with epithets.

        • It would take a fairly low IQ person to fall for that. And they are useless at the moment anyway. They remind me of those wacky Q Anon types.

      • Advocating is different from warning people that there is no easy way out. That we can vote our way out of this. It can’t be done because the left will not honor elections. They will even overturn elections at the least chance. As you said before, we are in another era. It’s best to warn the conservative fools now so they won’t be surprised when the hammer comes down. And it’s coming down. There will be hotheads on both sides. But, the violence has already begun at a low level. The era of identity politics joined at the hip to radicalism is now here. We should point this out at every opportunity. Events will (hopefully) convince the fence-sitting moderates that they must choose sides.

      • This is true but armed struggle is still going to happen or its going to be people pressing for peaceful means all the way to the boxcars

    • There is no doubt the system openly hostile to whites and corrupt as can be. Worse there is no peaceful fix for it. Well in theory there is but not in practice.

      However we cannot oppose it with force. It is a non-starter. Eventually the system will crash on it’s own accord and only then we can move not before. This is strategty 101. Don’t play to your opponents strength.

      In the meantime we need to get as healthy as possible; learn to be self-sufficient as possible; acquire food and medicine; move to non-urban areas; learn basics of self-defense and personal security; Learn to keep a normie profile

    • The idea this kid could even begin to get a fair trial in C’ville is ludicrous. Why was a change of venue not granted, especially in light of the local publicity the event received? Seating an impartial jury seems laughable. This has been an undeniable miscarriage of Justice but, as Z man points out, this is the new norm.

    • I read he had some hapless public defender. Sad that with all the brainpower available on the dissident right, not one decent lawyer stepped up to help him wage a real defense.

      • Given that at least two lawyers working with the alt-right faced campaigns to have their law licence suspended, I’m not sure I blame any lawyer for hiding from this stuff. The guys being sued by Roberta Kaplan and Karen Dunn could not find a single lawyer to take their cases.

        De-platforming is not just about social media.

        • I didn’t know that. The bad news is going from “worse” to “Democrats retake the House next month”.

  24. The current paradigm being employed to oppose incipient tyranny here in the US is simply the wrong strategy. It plays into the government’s strengths and sets up the patriots for failure. The totalitarians own the justice system and LEOs. They spy on everything and everyone. The infiltrate opposition organizations. Rallying into groups make that job even easier. It is literally stupid to paint a target on your back and walk into their traps. Don’t do it. There are very effective ways to beat them, but they do not include pitching a fit in public.

    • An argument I have been making for a few years now is that a) we have to think of ourselves as an underground fighting an occupying force and b) we have create a culture around resistance. America is more like Iran now than a normal functioning country. It is a strange hybrid of theocracy and democratic empire.

        • The US is the global reserve currency and can mint nigh unlimited sums for any purpose. This will end eventually in a horrible way but it can probably outlast the stave the beast crowd

          Also what you mostly pay for is old age pensions and warfare. That consumers every dime in taxes

          The rest we borrow and mint.

          Cutting back is not a bad strategy mind you given if you are a minimalist and can convince your family to go along since once the US becomes poor, you won’t even notice. I just don’t think it can easily bring down Leviathan though.

          What might work is an actual John Galt uprising where skilled workers shut everything down and either are deep in hiding or resist attempts to force them to work with violence might but this is pretty close to an EMP event and would require a lot of coordination . Its pretty unlikely to happen.

          There are also a lot of wildcard scenarios, Raconteur Report , one of the guys on our side and no hysteric notes that one screw up in the next four or five months could cause a global Ebola pandemic.

          And note the US already had a screw up with Ebola . We got very very lucky and had well trained nurses.



          No wonder everyone is jitterier than a long tailed cat in a room full of rocking chairs

      • Some version of the “Committees of Correspondence” would be in order. Just devilishly difficult to keep operational security.

        • With homes in 3 major hubs (I provide for family), and extreme mobility, perhaps it’s time I begin to cultivate the grey area of those of like mind.

          Many down here are on the same page, and I’m quite comfortable as a liason with underclass groups of all demographics. I had something of a history with that sort of thing.

          Just thinking out loud. Lists and cells. Rough men with grievances and trade skills might network into a crude spanner in the works, and many “messages” as well. Less rough men would seek to join them.

          Mirroring the professional Left, no? The criminal class doesn’t read NRO, but they all- including foreigners- are talking about the NWO.

          • Nah, this is just me talking out my ass. The judges already know all the best criminals, and pay them protection with favors.

            Still, the idea of a polar bear hunt at the latest protest has its own appeal… so community organizers will never point them that way.

            But a decentralized, diverse Freikorps? Anarchists, postwar German ‘werewolves’, and the IRA been there, done that. Not pretty.

        • perhaps you have been reading WRSA? the constant useful refrain of “meat space, baby” is the right message. sounds like either you’re behind the curve or you don’t realize the utility of what you already have, and reading your comments, it does sound like you have threads connected all over. if i knew you FTF, you would be one of mine. good luck.

      • I buy the argument.
        Especially with the FBI in your face corruption.
        We are in many ways living 1984.
        1984, Inc.

    • Both “rally into groups,” and “don’t ever rally into groups,” are the sort of bad advice you get from people who are ambivalent at-best about a conflict. Atomized individual fetishism is an old habit that will die with current older middle aged whites.

      • Ambivalent is the word!
        I think, “is it really so bad?”- but then I see a subway video from Britain. Or remember 5 apes at the airport barking at an ancient grandmother in a wheelchair. My rage and shame at my own cowardice sickens me.

        Too chickenshit to start cracking skulls, but f*ckinay I want to.

        Wish to sh*t I had something useful to contribute. Something…practical. With real results.

        • We all feel his way. Its just rare for people to admit it.

          Its also how these things start. Too much humiliation often starts revolutions.

          Its still not time though and that guy in Charlottesville is not Crispius Attucks or Horst Wessel for that matter.

          We still have time to prepare to have skills and lay aside gear

          We can get the skills and more importantly attitude to matter.

          And if we are old when it kicks off there still many ways to help> Hell if we are dying there are ways to spend that life too.

          So get hard, get good, prep and pray if that’s your thing.

          If things go bad, you’ll have your chance and wish every day to God you never did.

        • I suggest persistent (nay, never-ending), low-key, non-violent action against the IRS… or any other three-letter agency you love to hate.

          FWIW “non-violent” certainly includes actions which are actually legal, though disruptive.

          Complexity is not their friend.

          P.S. Wear gloves. And don’t lick any stamps.

  25. The show trial is a message, as are all show trials. The message is loud and clear. Badwhites will no longer be afforded the protection of the law in any circumstances. Acquiesce quietly while we eliminate you. This is the norm now, not the exception.

    • This is not entirely a bad thing on its face. Trust in the system and “its not time” are among the biggest impediments to getting things fixed

      As Claire Wolf put it America is at that awkward stage; it’s too late to work within the system, but too early to shoot the bastards.

      This kind of thing meas it rapidly is becoming THE TIME

      As an aside, divisions aside I think the biggest fear the Actual Right has is winning, They don’t want to take responsibility especially if it ends up with one of those burn everything , kill three generations on the other side reprisal grudge matches it probably will be,

      They have no idea what to do with what they won how to run a subversion resistant institution or even the basic willingness to protect or run a moral functional society . Rigid rules are required

      Its reminds me of the time many years ago my dog caught the car he was chasing, tore off a mirror than wandered around aimlessly .

      We do have a small fast dwindling obligation to keep trying normal fixes , they almost certainly won’t work but at least you can say you’ve tried. This isn’t BTW for the Lefts sake, They are all cheats and liars

      Its to placate some of our own.

      During the window we have rather than buying more guns we ought to following our hosts advice and also figuring out what we do in the advent of a win. How do we configure schools to keep the Reds out? How do we keep media clean? Do porn producers get the noose ?

      How do we rule a networked urban society in a Conservative way

      If we don’t do that in the event of a win we won’t be able to shift the culture back for very long in the face of subversion

      The winner gets the prize, in our case an interregnum of 2-4 decades to set the rules and lay the foundation

      The Right though has no plan and as such can have no prize

      • A.B. Prosper, all good questions. My own take is clearing out the Augean mess of the schools/university system will solve a lot of the other problems automatically.

        By the by, I didn’t know who this James Fields guy was but, prompted by zman’s article, I did some reading about him and his case. Occurs to me that the Enemy Class have overplayed their hand here. If they had convicted the guy of, say, negligent manslaughter, there probably wouldn’t be a lot of room to argue.

        However, as it stands, he could end up on the death row and that could be the biggest mistake of all. I wonder if the anti-death penalty crowd will fight for a commutation for him? See, there’s another litmus test in itself.

        • he got life plus 419 years. i’ve seen such sentences thrown out as excessive but they were of the non-white variety. the media colluded to poison the jury pool, showing the victim’s angelic teenage photo exclusively, hiding disgusting video of “her” on that day and repeating the “was killed” mantra even as the coroner ruled heart attack. they do have an excellent appeal though on the refusal of change of venue motion. no way after a year of propaganda would there be a fair jury.

        • The Left has no consistency

          While some Liberals are decent moral people you can’t make that appeal with the Left. They don’t have a real ethical foundation or think rules apply to them . The ends always justify the means.

          As for universities/schools in general , my take would be to restore en loco parentis and treat anyone promulgating certain values to anyone under 21 as a child rapist under law, 5 years and a life ban on teaching and to prohibit requiring seditious values for graduation

          After 21 not my problem if you want to sit around studying Cultural Marxism in grad school or for fun, its your soul

          This keeps state bloat in check a bit and is Constitutionally Compliant

          If you go the full bore 20-40 year interregnum route, you have a few decades to do whatever you have power and consent from your own side to do that you can stomach

          We probably would be better off with this approach but we may not be able to do it so I’ll take the lesser, basically the “reformation” approach is Denny’s Value Menu as vs a 5 Star Michelin Meal that is the Interregnum

          Either way the nations belly is full.

        • Like you, I tried to do some research. And while I find the verdicts to be excessive, I’m offended that the rest of us have been put in the position of defending a dull-witted chap who is responsible for a pretty ugly and dangerous crime.
          I can’t exactly share Zman’s and other’s sentiments about this as some kind of bellwether of societal injustice and a turning point for an honorable society.

          Irregardless of Field’s real motivations, he placed his fate in the hands of his dangerous opponents at an incredibly ill-advised protest and under the not-so-watchful eyes of duplicitous authorities…when he drove his car into that crowd.
          We have got to be far, far smarter than this.

          • It’s not like this is the first time something like this has happened. The normal response is to accept that events are just as much at fault as the person. Giving this kid ten years for vehicular homicide, like we do with drunk drivers, is what justice demands. Giving him 400 years is what vengeance demands.

        • I actually asked if anyone thought about it. Its hypothetical since as far as I know there is no one on the Right yet interested much less able to get power and no one here is encouraged to act in an illegal manner.

          I asked that because a sizable section of the Dissident Right is Libertarian and doesn’t believe in having or using authority and while I’d expect Reds to not have a place in society or any political power at least I’m not as sure about the rest of the degeneration express

          As of right now, its about prepping and planning and praying we won’t have a civil war and only idiots and agent provocateurs are pushing otherwise

  26. They have to clamp down now. The leftist dominated institutions are collapsing. The mass media can’t sell a newspaper, much less a narrative. The universities are pumping out brainless leftist morons like sausages and have become intellectual wastelands. The courts are infested with them and we can just flush the judiciary. The wheels are coming off, the house is on fire and we are all going to burn.

    The internet is the wild card in determining who wins in the days ahead. Sure, we know exactly what they are doing despite their best attempts to hide it… but they know who we are too, and what we say and think. When the purges start we are all going to have some nasty decisions to make.

    • Purges? Perhaps, but how to implement. There are literally millions to purge and so few resources to do so. I suspect another plan initially to reduce the numbers to a manageable level.

      • Well said. The Chicago Police Department can’t even handle a few dozen wilding “yewfs” on the Gold Coast. They herd them into the train stations. Unless there is a magical army of federal agents in orbit, no one is getting rounded up if they don’t want to.

      • Perhaps they might start putting more of their monsanto/FDA approved chemicals in the food supply/water/air, much more than they have now. In many areas across the country courts are already purging lots of people who have a lot of assets/$$$ or for their American political views… taking people off the streets and force medicating them…they basically have a monopoly on most of if not all of the main stream informaton….we are only told what we are allowed to know about from the corporate conglomerate “fake news” we NEVER hear about most of the things the courts from local to federal are doing to people all across the country.

  27. I actually had this thought as a kid growing up in the 70’s ” I am glad that I don’t live in the Soviet Union or East Germany where the government tracks your every move and you can be snatched off the street and disappear forever”. Now 40 years later, it looks like my golden years are going to be spent living under a similar repressive regime.

    • It really is incredible, when you step back and look at it. In the 80’s, when I was a kid, the line was, “That could never happen in America.”

      Now, it is happening.

        • Which really makes me hate the “conservative” fools who went along with all the “social justice” crap. If the shit hits the fan, I am personally going to track down people like Flake, Kasich, and Sasse.

      • Here’s another thing…

        Imagine even having the thought “you can’t be alone in a room with a female” back in the ’70’s or 80’s.

        And yet, the other day one of my guys here at work told me that his twelve year old son was just assigned a female lab partner on a junior high science fair project, and he told me that he felt compelled to have the chat warning his son about it. Because the females…have gone…insane…

        When I was 12, I remember sneaking off into an abandoned barn, chewing Trident, and sucking face with a buxom 13 year old early bloomer from the neighborhood. Now, I’d be branded an aggressive hetero-normative and prepared for Re-Education by The Coven.

        So yes, I agreed with my co-worker that what he did for his son was prudent. As a parent, it must be done. This is our New Reality.

        But I have to say, if things have become this low-trust between the sexes, the races never stood a chance.

        • I knew Pastors back in the 1980’s who had the policy that they would not meet with females behind closed doors. If a female needed counseling, they either had to bring a witness or agree to meet with the door to the office being open.

      • The Soviets knew this would happen as soon as the USSR was defeated and told us as much.

        They knew that the US was heavily subverted with Communists at least since the 30’s especially among its leaders. Hell huge chunks of the working people, especially Germans were sympathetic to the other sort of Socialism, the National Democratic Workers

        Some kind of Socialist state was nigh inevitable as technology and urbanization increased.

    • The Stasi could only dream of the world that we live in. They were severely hampered by technology. Recording phone calls and having an agent listen to hours of tape hoping to find something. Relying on neighbors – though, admittedly, Germans are the noisiest people on the planet so that was likely fairly effective.

      It was incredibly cumbersome.

      Today, software can search for bad words and phrases. A slip-up in nowhere Wisconsin can quickly be relayed to the proper agents in SV who can sick their media hounds on this poor guy, destroying his life over the course of a week or two.

      No need for an expensive gulag system.

      What’s more, Z-Man is right. It’s going to get worse. Say the wrong thing, and you’ll be non-personed. How are you going to live without a job, without a credit card, without a grocery store? Your name will be on the “naughty” list which will instantly be updated by every business in the country.

      And that’s before the government gets involved. C-ville shows how that’s going to turn out.

      • I forgot if it was the Stasi or the Romanian Secret Police I was reading about – but at one point they only had the capability to tap 7 phones at a time in the whole country. Now we have every phone and computer in a far bigger country tapped and monitored.

      • I assume if they don’t like your politics you can kiss your Social Security and Medicare good-bye. And you will be at there mercy once they implement their much loved single payer health care.

        • While back had a dinner table conversation with one of the IBM Watson guys that architected one of their cancer treatment tests with MD Anderson. Asked how easy it would be to add other factors like age and “social utility” into the AI. His reply, “pretty easy”. You won’t be “denied” anything…what you get won’t be was a “higher value” person gets.

          • And that goes on until you get John Q. every day all the time and surgeons and doctors don’t want to treat anyone other than a few elite if any remain.

            Civil wars get that nasty

            Of course the reason we are here is the Right is like a permissive parent. They want to be the nice guy when in reality at best we need to be locking up our foes for life, no appeal or maybe going full Vlad Tepes on them.

            This is a flaw with Conservatism in general though

            A Liberal will gladly have the State extinguish an institution, a village or sometimes a whole city that is a problem and that is a sound position to take since its cheaper to rebuild a termite infested shack the way you like than to rehab it.

            There are also huge strengths in collective punishment and ending any forgiveness (c.f aging Nazis)

            We on the Right get obsessed with fairness and sportsmanlike conduct which is nuts.

            If you imagine a Wrestling Match, we assume its all in good fun and a little fake , everybody gets paid

            The Left though brought battery acid and will actually beat you to death with a chair.

        • The Shapiros will demand cost-cutting of targeted entitlements so the military can keep defending our freedoms.

          Yes, I said *targeted* entitlements. We have all these new Praetorian-Americans to pay for.

          • If our military was defending our freedoms they would be down on the Mexican border shooting illegals as they cross. Instead they are six thousand miles away protecting Israel from its enemies.

    • “it looks like my golden years are going to be spent living under a similar repressive regime.’

      Get your golden ass in shape. Think about how you’re going to fight back. Did you think you were going to have a fun and comfortable retirement?

      • “fun and comfortable” is an entitlement according to ms Cortez et al…another day, another absurdity.

      • Crystal clear about Charlottesville, San Francisco,
        Portland, NY city etc… jurys in Idaho, Wyoming, or Montana would very likely have found Fields not guilty. This whole thing makes me sick. these young men are political prisoners, they will not be the last. This is not going to end without rivers of blood. brother against brother, so be it.

  28. There were many former military people who helped plan charlottesville. it amazes me that they did not perceive a trap.

    1) They were planning an advance into an enemy stronghold.
    2) They knew they would be outnumbered.
    3) they were inexperienced.
    4) They knew the local authorities were unfriendly
    5) They did not properly recon the territory. These people were unaware that the local university has a berkeleyesque reputation.
    6) The announced their event well in advance, allowing the enemy time to plan and prepare.

    If you advance with inferior strength into unknown territory full of fortified enemies you will LOSE.

    This displays the problem the right has with Clausewitizian thinking..trying to force decisive results. This does not work when you are vastly inferior.

    The torchlight parade the night before was far more effective, as it was launched before the enemy had time to rally its superior resources. If the event had ended there, it would have been a success.

    Those guys with the “Its OK to be white” flyers have achieved far more, at far less cost. This is Maoist thinking, which is appropriate for the vastly inferior side.

    • Hindsight is always 20/20. I say that as someone who never thought it was a good idea. That said, it has opened the eyes of a lot of people. Everyone is a bit more skeptical about high profile people in this thing and that’s a good result.

      • C-ville was a “buffalo jump” from go. It played right to the enemy strength. The guys on our side were about as bright as buffalos thinking, “I’m not going to let any damn Indian wave a blanket at me!” (Cliff, straight ahead.) Be the Indian, not the buffalo. This is not rocket surgery.

        • MB, right on. Preaching to your choir, you attended that university and as a ODU grad and husband and father to VT grads, ots my only knock against you.

          UVA post 1987, shithole of bat shit crazy collectivism.

      • I feel horrible for Fields and the others that have been wrongly imprisoned from the Charlottesville mess, and will send them money regularly to help them out. However, this was a learning experience and in the big scheme of things not that expensive of one. It is good to know where white men definitively stand in this society. I know we all had a feeling this was our status before August 11th, but we had it completely confirmed in fairly low cost manner, and this is serving as a wake up for more and more white people on the periphery. Hopefully?

        • Yes. It’s time to put Southern nationalism aside. We are playing for far greater stakes than that.

          • Putting Southern Nationalism aside means the communists, of which there are plenty in the south, have won.

            Therefore, we Southern Nationalists will never put it aside.

          • No it doesn’t Pat_Hines. It means we’re fighting for all of America’s nationalism not just part. The commies are everywhere and they are 100% united against us. We need to be the same.

          • Hoagie, not sure from where you hail. If its not south of Richmond, VA – dude, you VYWiT, fraid u aiint VYWOoT.
            You made your bed, lie in it. If you are from the north, you guys always groked why us redbecks were perpetually pissed re Union preservation at all costs.
            Well, you are now living the why.

          • I’m as Southern as they come, but we need to think of whites all over the world. We’re in a fight from Australia to Finland. We’ve got to do everything we can to pull together. Our history is practically unknown and misunderstood by people outside the South. And there are plenty of disgusting Puritans who would take the entire world down just to spite us. We can’t let them do that. Hold your beautiful battle flag in reserve for the time being. Our Northern friends are on our side, but they can’t do much for us at the moment. Let’s not make things difficult for them. Onward!

        • Maybe not expensive in the Grand Scheme of Things, but for those being sacrificed in the show trial (and their families) I expect it’s devastating.

          • Definitely. Hopefully the young men who will be carrying this struggle into the future will remember this when they are tempted to let up on their enemies

      • Z Man. I am.from VA, born and bred. UVA, in particular, C Ville, in general; SF of VA. Anyone with ANY inkling of the local AO would have known. I am not being hyperbolic. C Ville is more liberal than the beltway – SYN.

        I am OK going in under torchlight, but they either let their guard down or were undermanned for the task. Seriously, white pride march into C Ville, might as well have 10 member klan rally in Downtown Baltimore.

        The pre-op intel and logistics for this one was criminally incompetent.

        • Demonstrations only work for groups the media are fond of, which was never going to be the case for the C’ville outfit. It didn’t need “pre-op intel” or “logistics” to figure this out.

          And a bunch of white guys carrying torches? Tiki torches no less?

          Jaysus wept.

          • It may have been our host who recognized that demonstrations are just that: demonstrations of power.

            The left hasn’t run a real protest since perhaps Kent State. Charlotsville was a genuine protest, with the normal consequences of one.

          • When I saw white guys with torches I knew someone had been played. Whoever organized that whole thing was incompetent or working for the left. Aside from Spencer, who were the other guys? Where are they now?

    • Yes, but they were not planning a military engagement. They were planning a peaceful protest of the removal of civil war monuments. What occurred was a completely unprecedented violence from counter protestors and that the government apparatus showed extreme bias in its enforcement of the law. I think no average person could have anticipated what was going to happen. That’s why I think Charlottesville was useful. You have to interact with a system in order to get data about it.

      • The demonstrators had a court order, Antifa was let loose by the politicians and State Police, may they burn in hell, to disrupt things unlawfully. Prosecutors, same….know your enemy.

      • CN, as they say on ESPN, come on man!!! They did a torchlit 1926 Nuremburg march the night before. Nothing wrong with that as the optics were outstanding – caused the whole of C Ville to go into coffee klatch vaklemptness. But to think that VSP and the lefitist PTB would let that go….again, anyone who had a mental retard’s undertanding of C Ville would have handled after march festivities much, much, much different.

        Look, I am from there, 250 years family tree from there. It is not Mississippi or Alabama or South Carolina or Georgia – its Virginia, there is no other state like it re range of historical continental aristocracy, breadth of middle class industry, national geneology, topography, cultural diversity, breadth of dialects spoken, history, recent political amalgamation/change/dilution via immigration, yadda, yadda.

    • UtR leadership made the assumption that the authorities would play by the rules, follow the law, not lie to them while they planned the event, protect the free speech liberties of all, all that jazz. For much of America’s history, those would have been reasonable assumptions.

      Charlottesville disabused us of any notion of respect for rule of law on the part of the left and the authorities. As with any lesson worth learning, it did not come cheap. Making jibes at leaders and organizers for assuming yesterday’s rules still apply today is cheap after the fact criticism. Fact is, they got into the ring. That took some guts.

      Most of those who spoke out early against going did so not because they foresaw perfidy on the part of the authorities, but because they did not want to be united with parts of the right they found icky: too fashy, too homo, too southern, too THIS or too THAT.

      Some of those who led their folks into Charlottesville have learned the lesson, some have not. The former may continue to be of use. The latter ought to be ignored, but not offered up to the enemy.

      • An excellent post, roo_ster.

        While you and I may not have arrived here on the same boat, the fact is, we are here, and we should applaud those who got into the ring and we should never offer any of them up to the enemy, even the likes of Christopher Cantwell.

    • Please correct me if this is wrong, but the Unite people had a permit to protest in the daytime, around the Lee monument.

      What they did not have was a permit to do that torchlight deal on the UVA campus at night. Despite to the cool optics, this struck me as precisely the sort of “bad faith” gesure our side constantly accuses the Enemy of. And I can think of few things that would make the local PD even less-willing to abide by any pre-event coordination than that.

        • After spending a lot of time coordinating with local officials, then to turn around and do something like that, yes. That’s the definition of bad faith.

          Does that mean they deserved what happened? Of course not.

      • Ah, so by that logic the LEOs should allow a mob to set upon you, beat you to a pulp, cuz you let the parking meter run long?

    • When you believe, rightly in my opinion, that members of Law Enforcement will uphold there oaths of office and they violate them in the most egregious manner, I cannot say the blame lay so much on the planners.
      The question going forward is what can we as White Nationalist and
      Southern White Nationalist do in the way of non violent activism that won’t get us put in jail? Besides waking up in the last two or three years I have done nothing but type on a key board.

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