The Hot House Flower

Way back in the olden thymes, there was a pop act called Milli Vanilli. They were sold as an R&B duo from Munich, but both members were black. That added to their appeal, even in the pre-woke 1980’s. Their debut album was wildly successful in Europe and the US, selling millions of copies. They won a Grammy and had a world tour. The whole thing fell apart when they foolishly revealed that neither of them sang the songs on their album and their shows were lip-synced. They were disgraced and that was the end of the act.

There is a whiff of that with the fallout from the Ben Shapiro interview on the BBC that has been making the rounds. He agreed to be questioned by Andrew Neil, without bothering to learn anything about the format of the show. The setup is the host grills the guest, giving them a chance to rise to the occasion and show their stuff. Alternatively, as in the case of Ben Shapiro, it is a chance for the guest to reveal themselves to be a lightweight incapable of playing with the big boys. It was not a good day for Ben Shapiro Inc.

Of course, this exchange confirmed what many people have observed about Shapiro for a long time. That is, his reputation as a great debater was built on beating up emotionally unstable coeds. At one point in that interview, Andrew Neil seems to allude to that before Shapiro starts yapping like a whiny dog and cuts him off. YouTube is full of videos titled “Ben Shapiro destroys…” and the victim is a teenager or a girl. When confronted by an adult male with some skills at debating the issues, Shapiro became the sobbing coed.

What was revealed in that exchange is that Shapiro is a hothouse flower, created by a marketing machine, in the same way pop acts are created. Some talented marketers decided he had the right look and presentation, so he was hired to be the front man of what amounts to a political marketing machine. Shapiro is not exactly gormless, but his status has been inflated by a public relations effort, as well as big money backers, elevating him well beyond his talents. That was revealed in that interview.

Another analogy is the boxer who has built a record beating up bums. The first time he faces someone who can fight back, he does not know what to do. That was largely the case with Mike Tyson back in the day. People who knew boxing saw the flaws in his game, but Tyson mowed through aging stars and over-hyped bums, so the fans and media never noticed those flaws. Then he met a guy who did notice those flaws and trained to exploit them. Tyson was knocked out and never the same afterward.

That’s what you saw in that BBC video. Andrew Neil is a professional, who has built a career pressing his guests. He’s heard every trick by this point, so Shapiro’s efforts to derail him were quickly turned against him. Like that fighter who suddenly realizes the other guy is not going to just fall down. Shapiro started to panic and things got progressively worse for him until he just quit on his stool. The only thing missing was his handler rushing in to throw in the towel and protect his fighter.

In fairness, Shapiro is not unique in Conservative Inc. or even the mass media. All of them are hot house flowers, play acting as intellectuals. Most are smart enough to know it, so they never get in the ring with anyone who can fight back. If they do agree to talk with someone that is actually smart and capable, they make sure the game is rigged. They either scream over the guest or make sure the guest is willing to play along and make the host look good. That’s the world Shapiro is built for, not actual debate.

Getting back to the Milli Vanilli analogy, the thing that did it for the duo is they were an all or nothing proposition. Their back story is what sold them, as much as the catchy tunes created for them. In other words, it was the origin myth, not their music. For Ben Shapiro, what sold him to conservative readers was the legend of him being the super-debater, destroying liberals and bathing in their tears. His catch phrase, “facts don’t care about your feelings” now seems like an ironic epitaph to his career.

That said, there’s a lot of money invested in Shapiro. The sorry state of conservatism, as a firewall between the people in charge from the growing ranks of the disaffected, leaves them no choice but to re-inflate their hero. There are a lot of smart people scripting Ben Shapiro and the rest of Conservative Inc will be told to rally to his defense. There are a lot of suckers willing to excuse the whole affair and remain defenders and supporters of Ben Shapiro Inc. These rackets always find a way to bugger on until the bitter end.

Still, it is a bit of a green shoot. It is a reminder that these people are not that smart and not that tough. Most of their best fighters are like the Greek city-states under Athenian rule in the fifth century BC. Instead of supplying men to fight, they had shifted to just paying tribute to Athens for their defense. They forgot how to fight. Their men became accustomed to seeking favor from men who knew how to use weapons. That’s what you see all over the ruling class. They have power, but the muscles to use it are atrophying.

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200 thoughts on “The Hot House Flower

  1. That said, there’s a lot of money invested in Shapiro. The sorry state of conservatism, as a firewall between the people in charge from the growing ranks of the disaffected, leaves them no choice but to re-inflate their hero

  2. Perhaps I am too cynical, but are the Shapiro fans just being marketing managed? Is this just bug media (autocorrect from “big,” but I’ll take it) having a character who lost market cache “turn heel?” I’ve got 20 shekels that says we see 1-2 more bouts of public verbal diahrea, followed by a period of struggle, then contrition, then a comeback redemption just in time for the next election cycle and The Littlist Chickenhawk’s next book.

  3. At least “Blame it on the Rain” was a nice pop song, whoever sang it.

    Shapiro delenda est

  4. Ok, I just listened to the interview. To be honest, I think the interviewer was a typical ruling-class janitor, a kind of SS operative working for the globalist paymasters. BBC interviewers are in effect trained assassins, and as much as I dislike Shapiro and reject the thesis that he speaks for me or anyone like me (you know, ‘conservatives’), I’m touched by his naiveté. Could it be that he didn’t realize he was walking into a slaughterhouse?

    God bless Jordan Peterson; he held up against his SS interview from the ridiculous broad whose name is lost to my mind; Mister ‘I destroy liberals’ was reduced to a teary-eyed baby by the same brand of well-known rhetorical viciousness deployed by Neiill. Maybe it’s all part of the plot, like Rutherford et al confessing their crimes on the telescreen. I don’t know – I just know that everything is scripted now, and that a giant EMP that throws us back into 1820 is what I vote for.

  5. Z man, I apologize for hijacking thread in this way but I know you like to occasionally link to Chateau Heartiste. Seems like his site has been suspended by Word Press.

  6. You could write an entire article on this statement alone if you simply changed a few words –

    “Instead of supplying men to fight, Europe had shifted to just paying tribute to America for their defense. They forgot how to fight. Their men became accustomed to seeking favor from men who knew how to use weapons”.

    Along those same lines, hopefully the upcoming Swiss Referendum will keep the EU’s grubby hands off Switzerland’s current weapons laws.

    “The government argues the changes do not compromise Switzerland’s gun traditions and merely impose new administrative formalities on gun users while providing better protection against the misuse of weapons.”

    Das kann doch nicht wahr sein!

    But of course, with the bullies in Brussels, it’s their way or the highway. Arrogant ba$tdards!

    • Thanks Karl. Damn..sorry to hear it. The rot is everywhere. As we say here…Keep your powder dry.

  7. Somebody who has to defend a narrative that is not in line with reality, will eventually go down. It’s just a matter of time.

    At least the left is ‘honest’ about this, they have an ideology and are not ashamed of it. But cucks don’t like to be shown to be just another ideologue.

    I do not think that Shapiro ever had a chance, and I do not think he will try again…

    • The ironic quotes around ‘honest’ are important. The Left is not honest in the sense that you and I understand honesty – but everyone knows what they’re up to, which is more than can be said of the cuckcons. The Left wants to reshape the world into a massive kindergarten-cum-deathcamp in which no healthy human being would want to live after the age of 40.

      The ‘Right’, as approved and corralled by the Controllers, is narrowed and defined by kapos like Shapiro, officially standing for nothing except maybe holding off on the death camps.

      ‘Conservatism’ is now essentially an appeal at the feet of our rulers for our lives.

  8. It’s late in this comment thread, but I did a quick search and it looks like no one has brought up my “favorite” hot house flower, Sen. Marco Rubio.

    It infuriated me in the run up to 2016 that this guy was being pushed by Republican opinion leaders as the “future” of the party: an empty suit of the Right to follow the one of the Left; another Rick Lazio-like nobody to give an excuse for losing to Hillary Klinton; the plaything of wealthy bastard Norman Brayman who was a little too obviously the only person of Hispanic ethnicity willing to memorize 10 years of editorials from National Review and dutifully regurgitate then when prodded.

    I remembered NR’s initial cover story endorsement of Rubio, and Lowry’s feeble (and weird) gushing over him (“His wife’s a former NFL cheerleader!” he enthused).

    Of course I felt great satisfaction (and vindication) when Trump and Christie set Little Marco up for exposure as a parrot in that famous debate. But more than that, the fact that this kid had been foisted upon us as a figure of presidential timber was what convinced me about the cynicism of the GOPe and Conservative Inc. I’m thankful that when I turned my back in them for good, there were other paths open to explore.

    • We can vote GOP, and be betrayed. Or, we can vote Dem, and earn some scout points that might keep us out of the camps once the enemy seizes power – for good – in 2020 or 2024.

      Must think ahead. I urge that everyone enroll as a Democrat, and send Joe Biden to the White House with 100% of the vote. His riffs against the deplorables won’t make much sense if we’re all behind good ol’ Joe.

      We are all citizens of a silly country now. As Telly Savalas used to say in those auto ads, Live it!

    • If I could give the 10 upvotes I would. I was infuriated by this traitor almost as much as by Jeb. He runs as an immigration restrictionist that turns around and allies himself withChuck Schumer. Only an idiot would do that then think it would not cost him in a primary dominated by the base.

    • Conservative Treehouse had theory about this. Having a large number of candidates during the primary is a way to prevent anyone from getting a large share of the voters other than the annointed candidate (Jeb!). Then as the candidates drop away one by one, the chosen one picks up their voters. But it didn’t go to plan in 2016.

      By this theory, Rubio was just ballot fodder.

      • I’ve thought about this. Jeb was the choice of the rulers as the candidate who – like Rpmney and McCain – loses ‘with dignity’. The money was there, the name recognition was there, the absence of a vigorous alternative was there. The appearance of an opposition is necessary to the sustenance of an oligopoly that gains legitimacy through ‘the voice of he people.’

        Trump was the Pat Paulsen in the mix. And ‘Pat Paulsen’ won, because the Republicans – the stupid party – didn’t bother to rig the outcome the way a sensible party like the Democrats did.

        At a guess, the monopoly capitalists who now tell the Democrats what to say, how to smile, which groups of everyday people to attack and demonize, will direct a Biden/Harris outcome.

        I’m voting against prisoners and illegals now. Maybe I’ll just sit back and enjoy the show.

  9. I remember the Milli Vanilli fiasco. It was hilarious! The wiki fairly accurately covers it. However, the wiki does leave out the most hilarious part of it. The concert in summer of ’89 when they were caught lip-syncing, they were caught because a father was there with his daughter and her friends (you see, Milli Vanilli was popular among the “tweener” girls) who really did not want to be there and was, thus, in a critical state of mind to begin with. It was him who make a big stink over the lip-syncing and demanded his money back. He sent several “letters to the editor” for several news papers and that is what brought the fiasco to a head. The whole thing was really funny and, yes, it did destroy the group. I remember Arsenio Hall (remember him?) making fun of the Milli Vanilli guys a couple of years later on his show.

  10. I want to add Dana Loesch to the hall of shame. All she does is look pissed off and whine about threats to her family. And the NRA pays her for that. Ugh!

    • Don’t shoot right. If you dont have something constructive to say about an ally on the right (even if they are to your left), please say nothing.

  11. Very good point about powers’ “hired hands” or cats paws getting over confident and not being best quality. It would seem that the masses are long used to having hired help get them out of trouble, too. This is a narrative theme eg Shane. We can’t depend on the Andrew Neils of the world to be our men, but so much of what happens is spectacle and propaganda. How do we return to real things eg gathering in the agora, market shopping, kitchen table meals etc when we have atomised shopping malls, broken families and non-stop screen based propaganda imploring us to believe what is probably 95% rubbish? Not to be black pilling but we do need to get our community in healthier shape for the chemo down the track.

  12. watch?v=nVNw03gyLmk&t=1474s

    Not the first time Shapiro was out of his depth. The former Canadian PM does his best to remain polite while he easily parry’s away Shapiro’s arguments.

    Stephen Harper was a legitimately bright leader who is not unaware of the way the tides are shifting globally.

  13. I agree w everything here except the Mike Tyson part. Since that’s hardly the message of the post, maybe Im being too OT here?

    As soon as you start a martial arts discussion, there will be very strong and passionate opinions disagreeing with each other. Most often, no one walks away from such discussions w new insights, ideas or inspirations to test on the canvass. Z’s term ‘complicated systems of unknown truth content’ comes to mind b/c ppl often do not test their systems against others. After all, who wants to lose face w an art you may have spent 20 years perfecting? That’s a serious investment and why MA instructors are often reluctant to accept challenges (legal issues and other ‘legitimate’ concerns are also important of course). So some are not going to agree w me on Tyson here.

    And to be sure boxing is not my style and I do not claim any expertise whatsoever. When Ive tried it on rare occasions I found it extremely hard to resist the instinct to kick or do leg sweeps. I found it literally frustrating to confine the legs to a purely ‘logistical’ role but that’s how it is.

    Tyson was not the greatest technical boxer of all time, for sure. But he taylored his style well to the anatomy he had been given. He is fairly short and w short arms compared to many of his opponents. Hence he was outgunned in reach. So he perfected the ‘peek-a-boo’ style and the hook. The peek-a-boo involves covering your head w your hands and scooping down below opponent strikes and then hitting back. It looks like you sort of hide behind your gloves. Using this approach turns an anatomical disadvantage to an advantage, namely low stature. It’s obviously easier to duck fast if you’re shorter.

    And in that situation your arms are already bent and you are fairly in close and often want to come in from the side in your counterstrike as the opponent misses his mark. That makes the hook, and the uppercut, obvious choices.

    So I personally think Tyson taylored his style to suit the anatomy he had to work with. His disaster fight, well the first one haha, against Buster Douglas, was a classic case of ‘victory disease’. He had eaten his privious opponents alive up to that point. That makes you complacent. I regrettably see signs of the same in the US military. It was much in 2003 where Tyson was in heavyweight boxing in 1988, pretty much the biggest game in town. So the Pentagon didnt plan for post-conventional combat phases and such. And the navy ships, having ruled the waves for 70 years, started bumping into other ships and such and the air force got careless w moving nukes around (also similar to gun owner getting careless w not unloading guns after use and such).

    I think that’s what happened to Tyson. But, Im not a boxing expert. And I didnt mean to distract from the issues this post was really about so if this is too OT just ignore it or delete it. Fighting is just fun to talk about haha 🙂

    • I too leftTyson out of discussion, but since you brought it up….

      To call Tyson some sort of phony is ridiculous. Some history here (IIRC). Tyson come upon the world with HBO attempting to unite the heavyweight championship, which was divided among three competing organizations. To say he was a phony, punching down to weak opponents, pre-selected, seems difficult to imagine. These guys then holding the heavyweight championships were weak and nowhere in Tyson’s league, but they still each wore a championship belt. Tyson won, and won convincingly against them.

      Then catastrophe, Tyson’s manager died. He was an honest old white guy that pulled Tyson from the gutter and cared for him. I forget the guy’s name, but he was the last of the honest ones. Tyson then fell under the spell of that felon huckster/promoter with the weird hairdo—forget his name too—and it was downhill from there. Not sure of the fights Tyson had after his managers death, but he seemed to do well and I can’t imagine that Tyson was avoiding serious contenders.

      What happened somewhat after is Tyson was convicted of rape and sentenced to prison. When Tyson got out of prison, he was pretty much not the fighter he was before. The crooked fight system had used him and abused him. Tyson had won the biggest purses ever in the profession and yet was broke and in debt.

      Not making an excuse for Tyson. He was, and still is, a low IQ individual who needed a “keeper”, but he had skill (such as it is) and that is what got him to the top—not fixed fights or weak opponents. Perhaps you are confusing the plot from Rocky III. 😉

      • You’re thinking of Cus D’Amato and Don King and I agree w your assessment of both of them.

        And yes, about Tyson. To use one of the most common expressions in MA circles about separating the wheat from the chaff, he was ‘the real deal’ as a fighter. Not the greatest ever. But, there IS no ‘greatest ever’in MA. Jeet Kune Do practitioners have elevated Bruce Lee, another ‘real deal’, in a style about as far away from boxing as you could imagine, to ‘the ultimate bad-ass martial artist of all time’, ie a deity for JKD fans. That’s also BS. There is no ‘the greatest of all time’ in MA, there are genuines and fakes, or ‘bullshidos’, a term I always found funny.

        The objectively greatest human close combat fighter ‘of all time’, was probably killed by the first saber tooth tiger that his spear missed 10,000 years ago. But, we re getting pretty OT here hehe

        • The great philosoper Mike Tyson:
          “Everybody hathe a plan… until they get punched in da face”

          • P.S.- you want awful?
            Try having a supercuck MA brother who actually makes the weird Bruce Lee noises of Jeet Kun Do.
            “Weee… ooooo… ahhhh….”

          • You guys are thinking of Bill Cayton and Jim Jacobs. Two Jews, along with Cus, who tried to save Tyson from Don King’s sociopathic talons. They failed because blackness. King convinced Tyson he was with a bunch of white devils. Tyson believed him and left them. Screw Mike “The Rapist Ear Muncher” Tyson.

            Very good interview here with Cayton from when it was all happening back in early 90’s.

            Cayton: “I’ve been told that Tyson was ready to walk out on King time and time again, but couldn’t bring himself to do it because he doesn’t know how to face his friends, particularly in the black community. Yet King is the worst racist imaginable. He has the racist pitch, but with the exception of Tex Cobb all his victims have been black.”


          • Derb has a Bruce Lee story! When a strapping lad, he worked in one of Bruce Lee’s movies. Look him up for shits and grins! He heard the real utterances from Bruce.

    • Tyson was well-trained and prepared for fights – until Cus D’Amato passed. That’s the moment his “prime” was over and he became a very undisciplined beatable fighter.

      Even during his “prime” D’Amato was careful to avoid any hint of a match-up with George Foreman. Tyson was too similar to Frazier in size and style and could not have bullied big George.

  14. The worst thing for me was watching and thinking “OK, Shapiro should parry with any of the following quite effective responses”, and instead he gets owned. Particularly on the pro-life barbarian accusation (I need to attach a third arm so I can do a triple face palm).
    It was to anyone else a softball: 1. So the BBC should show an actual 4D ultrasound abortion and the “products of conception” so we can decide on what is barbarity”. 2. London has imported Sharia barbarians that intentionally run people over, knife them, and throw acid – and they get light sentences so you have decriminalized barbarity. 3. miscarriages are when you don’t pay someone to stick a tube in and use it to rip limbs off and crush your baby’s skull – how is it barbaric to consider that murder.

    It gets worse, but I should thank Benji the Hunted, since if anyone accuses me of wanting to gas Jews, I can say “no, only Ben Shapiro’s JINOs”.

    Even more fun is the in-group preference that can’t abandon him and let go of the anchor pulling them to a deep watery death.

  15. Shapiro is a particularly loathsome little goblin and it was a pleasure to see him get his comeuppance. He has always suffered from that pampered whiny jew-boy syndrome of assuming he’s the smartest guy in the room, so to witness the humiliation of this wunderkind of the intellectual dark web at the hands of an unflappable old goy like Neil was particularly satisfying. During the course of the interview you could see that Neil had quickly sized up this petulant pygmy and was goading him on. All Shapiro needed to do was to answer one question honestly and thoughtfully, which he was incapable of doing because Ben is all about sticking to the script that has served him so well. Shapiro is what happens when conservative inc. meets vaudeville and his schtick, which was never smart or funny, is now shown up to be hollow and tired.

  16. Another thing that’s struck me, is how dishonest and left-wing everyone is. You had the Left screeching that Shapiro was a “fascist” and should not be interviewed. You had fake conservative Andrew Neil attacking Shapiro on abortion and “racism”. You had fake conservative Ben Shapiro refusing to support Trump or say anything pro-life. And hawking a book about how “we” need to be “less angry”. Did anyone watch that horrible BBC panel afterwards? It was hard to find an Englishman, let alone a conservative.

    • Today, any thought or sentiment, or observation even, that isn’t in harmony with the correct line is ‘fascist’. Think about what that must do to an old-school liberal, who retains faith in what he believed in the olden days about the working man, exploitation, even the environment; He can either embrace the 32 sexes and accept open borders, or be declared one of the enemy he has fought all his life – the “Fascists,” aka regular people like us here at the Z blog.

      “Hmm, To stick to what I believe, or be dismissed as a clone of Hitler. Oh what to do?”

      That’s a real problem if you have any social cachet. These kinds of decisions involve loss of friends, of self-image, and above all of income, if you aren’t yet enjoying a fat public pension.

  17. I’ve never seen Shapiro on TV, and I was shocked. First, the guy has a TERRIBLE voice. How is this guy given a radio show? Second, he’s still LYING about Monica Fields and REFUSES to support Trump. What a FAKE CON. Third, he was NOT given tough questions. The Shapiro quotes were controversial things that he said years ago. He’s had YEARS to think up a defense to his attacks on Palestinians or his calling Obama a fascist.

    Compare him to Buchanan, Coulter, Levin, etc. These guys get trashed EVERY TIME they go on the MSM. Coulter would’ve demolished Neil. So would Vox day or Z-man. But Shapiro couldn’t even say why abortion was wrong.

    • Everyone who published the hit piece in NR before the Trump election indicated their “side”. (The only one I’ve come to forgive is Dennis Prager, who I believe was a genuine principled individual and now unfailingly supports Trump—but won’t lie for him.) These folk form the intellectual core of the anti-Trump Republicans.

      Shapiro chose the wrong side and continues to lose by attempting to claim he “supports” Trump. The posted YT video shows yet another attempt to sidestep his former position on Trump without pissing off his anti-Trump buddies. Like I said before, Shapiro is “a young man in a hurry”. Nonetheless, Shapiro does well on liberal campuses with his shtick. I doubt however if he will ever drop his civnat inclinations.

  18. Shapiro and the English guy both looked like total scumbags to me, just with different styles of scumbaggery. That was some serious scum-on-scum action.

    • The Babe: “Serious scum-on-scum action.” Sounds like a blurb for a porno movie. Shapiro takes what I can only assume is some textbook approach to debate. That is to “attack, attack, attack!”, and never let a personal insult slide. This makes him look like an immature brat. Since he’s not a normal human, this aggressive posture is all he knows. He’s too dumb or autistic to realize that in public discourse it’s about winning the audience as much as it’s about winning the argument.

      P.S. Anyone who thinks Shapiro may replace Tucker, or head any mainstream TV show, is out of their mind. There is no way the top brass at even mega Jewie Fox is thinking this. If I’m wrong I’ll drink a bottle of mustard in one go and post it on YouTube.

      • “The Babe: “Serious scum-on-scum action.” Sounds like a blurb for a porno movie.” Ouch…way visual. Am dashing for eyedrops to cleanse my eyeballs.

        Ages back, to me Shapiro was Big J smart rapid fire brain to mouth will climb the high mountains type. I’m a bit late to this game, didn’t pay attention because he lost my interest, but thanks to Z, am scrutinizing him from different angles. You folks have analyzed what comes out of the mouth.

        I can’t get past how his looks have changed and, yea this is hyperbole, this is like watching his transformation into Golum. Now you may think this is a Tolkien thing artistic license only, but I have seen this weird transformation of the body mirroring the soul. I know…I know…there’s a lot of goofy looking FarSide folks out there that don’t have crappy souls. Just crappy teeth. However, Little B creeps me out. He’s running a racket and it shows, he’s tight as a spring, and there’s anger just below the surface that was not present when he was younger. I wish I could be charitable about his voice…as someone here pointed out…I would rather listen to Jiminy Cricket. Jiminy wasn’t wound and pissed. Shapiro is more disturbing and disturbed than even annoying. Not going well for him inside. The rot starts from within. And we now see it.

    • Scum-on-scum action is usually popcorn time lol Great expression, ‘scum-on-scum action’ haha

  19. “Their men became accustomed to seeking favor from men who knew how to use weapons.”

    A better analogy would be the Byzantine emperors paying off the barbarians to go elsewhere. They ended up in Constantinople because that is where the money was.

  20. I live under a rock and have only seen Ben in a handful of debates where he did fairly well.
    Real debates are hard for me to watch. Take something like The View or any of the old mass media talk shows… and they turn into food fights between clowns where I just want to shoot the TV with an AR15 to stop the noise. You get all the idiots talking at once, or talking past each other and it just turns into a big chit show.

    Yes, I admit now that Ben is a lightweight. Z, if he WERE a heavy hitter he’d never get close to a microphone. He’s young, he’s pliable, and he can be intimidated. I still think he did alright for a kid. Maybe he learned something from the beating he got, and maybe a few more years of cucking will give him the lumps he needs to come all the way over to our side.

    It’s been an odd week of scalp taking. Earlier this week, Canada’s Rag Sheet – The Globe And Mail – announced a big round of layoffs coming. For those unfamiliar with it, it’s Canada’s answer to the NYT. It’s writers are aging scarved harridans, spaghetti armed homosexual flimps and vibrants. Apparently their work was so bad that not even other lefties can stand it anymore. It made my cold, mean old soul happy to think of those cretins faced with the prospect of working in the real world. Then I learned they got Chateau Heartiste the other day. Bastards.

    We’ve got to up our game, boys. Z, you need to allow guest bloggers. I dunno how you feel about Heartiste but idea is sound. We need places where we can regroup after social justice warriors attack, and set up alternate sites and keep the pressure up on these chit heads. Can you help us out in this regard?

    • Z, if you believe your site is fortified against proglodytes who’d love to pull the plug, why not open it to guest commentators? Only ones you think are worthy of it, of course, not just anybody who comes knocking.

      • This is the Z Show boys, not gonna happen.

        Heartiste knew he was vulnerable on WordPress. Like a rapper who gets sent to prison, it’s a badge of honor to get deplatformed. He’ll be back.

      • I’m not running a flop house for dissident dead beats!

        Seriously, that’s not a terrible idea, but I’d need to change software or modify WordPress. Maybe that’s another project for me. Create a space for high quality dissident writers.

        • Z, I don’t see you as a dissident aggregator — at least not right now. I think it would dilute your stuff. That said, maybe when the fancy strikes you, you could do an interview or two.

          Preferably short, like the length of one of your usual podcast segments. As one of your podcast segments, even. (I don’t watch / listen to long interviews. I figure if an interviewee has something to say, it can be said fairly quickly. Likewise, the interviewer can start with an interesting question, rather than dragging things out for an hour.)

          • It doesn’t even have to be that. An occasional visit or courtesy call from the better dissidents – done right – could be good for everyone.

            What if CH dropped by for some rude jokes, and then told us where his new site is? What if you stumble across some worthy kid at a secret-handshake-society function that could carry the weight that Shapiro couldn’t? Maybe some Carefully chosen guests at random that maybe need a boost, or a hand up after going into the boards with Lefty…?

            You boys are right, we have aggregators and flop houses. But… how about a role as an advocate, Z? Done right… it might even bolster your own brand. There’s any number of guys out there that do great social commentary but there are only a handful of them that can do real, meaningful advocacy work.

          • Why yes it is, bile. But Unz comments go on and on and on and on and on…

            Some of us working lads really need the punchline. No time to get lost in the weeds.

            Keep learning the equipment, and keep it short and punchy, Zman.
            Demand the same of any guests.

        • Roosh was on WordPress. You are on WordPress. What is stopping them from doing the same to you?

        • The practical technical skills of alt-media Zman is learning are invaluable and hard-won.

          Let’s hope for a Z-university some day!

          • Z-university: I’ve always wondered if there is a support role ppl could play, like running a backup hosting server or something, to mitigate/avoid the censorship issue. Runs against my above comment, but it’s different when it’s me I’m talking about.

        • The idea of guest bloggers/authors other than as a one-off novelty (like if you take a month off to evacuate Bodymore, Murderland or something, and some one temporarily fills in) strikes me as a bad idea with good intentions. This might be the front lines, but everyone can get their own foxhole. Links to suggested sites seems like as far as that idea goes without asking for trouble. Like they say, a secret can only be kept if only one person knows it. I don’t want to hear of some Pantifa goon making our host the next Steve Scalise bc someone managed to dox Zman. Opsec is real, relevant, and necessary. There is a reason baader meinhoef didn’t hang out with RAF.

  21. It’s one thing to steamroll half-witted college kids and another to take on a seasoned questioner and debater whose heard it all. When that happens as Z points out the shill implodes on air.

    Now that the Left has seen Shapiro’s weaknesses he will have to avoid any Lefty with a brain because he will be taken apart. Sure Fox’s talking heads will have him on their shows and feed him softballs to rehab his image such as it is. But the blood is in the water. He better stick to the college circuit.

    This is why you don’t see Tucker interviewing GOP/conservative shills because they are afraid of him. The same thing happened with Lou Dobbs, Conservatives ran from the man.

  22. Z: “The setup is the host grills the guest, giving them a chance to rise to the occasion and show their stuff.”

    Yes, and that’s British culture generally. Shit testing to size you up. “What manner of man is this?” If you don’t acquit yourself intellectually, that’s one thing. They’ll still give you a pass if you maintained your manhood and cool. (A bit of charm helps if that’s all you’ve got going. Do not be obvious, predictable, boring.
    It’s a cynical country, they’ve heard it all before). The twerp failed all tests.

  23. Heartiste has apparently been de-platformed by WordPress because they violated their terms of service.

    Bad sign for our side.

  24. Perfect commentary. What’s even sweeter is that much of this was about the Israel/Palestinian issue. Talk about winning on his home turf!

    Shapiro couldn’t win that argument, because you have to admit that racism sometimes exists for a good reason. He would have been better off just saying, “yes, Palestinians are dirt people, they are culturally inferior to Israel and the west. Not ALL of them, but certainly the vast majority.” Had he been honest, and said that, it then opens the door to say ‘yes, Mexicans and Guatemalans are culturally inferior to Americans, and you can’t just become an “American” by plopping in here.

    For Shapiro to win, he would have to abandon the “people as an idea” schtick. And that schtick is going into the political cemetery with Shapiro and Conservative Inc.

  25. Much as I despise Shapiro (can’t stand to even look at him, much less listen to him, much less admit that people actually pay attention to the noises coming out of his mouth), and as much as his little performance was not only intellectually and emotionally embarrassing, worse is that it was plain old poor sportsmanship, and by extension a blemish of shame to actual American humans, not just the wearers of Tiny Hats…

    Still, I had to feel a tiny bit sorry for him. He walked straight into a giant trap, which had 20-foot-tall neon “Danger! Warning! Now Entering Trap!” signs flashing all around it. The combination of arrogance, stupidity and shallowness needed for ANYone, let alone an ostensible Professional Debate Guy, to be so blithely unaware, is simply breathtaking.

    I used to argue over dinner with these Oxford Union types all the time. (I mean real, literal Oxford Union types.) They’re exasperating in their unearned presumption of superiority, they seem to think they are automatically intimidating to an American simply by trotting out the accent and the air of weary grand intelligence. They love to put on the air of a cat playing with its dinner. Shapiro had an internal right to be exasperated, but he was childish to let it show. You have to sidestep it and painfully take things apart for them; I used to respond to them in the tone of a garage mechanic patiently explaining to a little old lady that her brake pads were shot, and that “brakes” are the things that make the car go stop. That used to get under their skin. Being leftists, it always turned out that their thought processes were made of cream cheese and Jello pudding.

    Z is of course right that the questions were rather pathetic softballs (and Shapiro’s inability to place his replies in any sort of moral or intellectual framework that would explain his viewpoint is revealing: the kid is shallowness on stilts). It’s the frame around and underneath the questions, the presumed assumption that one’s own position could not possibly be serious, that sandbags so many people before they’re even out of the gate. Shapiro should have known this; how is it possible that somebody in his racket has never encountered one of these mortarboards before?

    • You can win an argument with that presenter as long as your mic isn’t cut off, that’s the real danger. They all have the same pattern, whether BBC or NBC. They pepper with questions, each question containing its own response and each question laden with its own presupposition. So what you have to do is 1) delineate lines between questions “we’ll get to that but let’s handle this question first. 2) Unwrap the question from its presupposition, “Actually, your question could be better worded this way, as it contains (insert falsehood).” and 3) rattle the line of facts that answer that particular question.

      Rush Limbaugh is a member of conservative Inc., but he is very good at doing this. He comes from a line of litigators and I think it’s in his genes. Most of them are terrible. Marc Levin starts shouting them down and calling them stupid before ejecting them. Shapiro has the least amount of talent I’ve seen.

      • Simple way to unwrap his abortion question is “It’s barbaric to prevent the murder of innocent children?” You’ve laid out a moral framework in one question.

        • Well that is a very smart suggestion, but to me personally it just underlines the reason I prefer conversation to debate. I don’t like seeing people scoring points with zingers, even good zingers; I don’t think anything useful is gained by zingers except in unusual circumstances or for entertainment value.

          I prefer to discuss abortion the same way I discuss gay marriage…

          1. To many religious people, abortion violates a very serious moral prohibition.
          a) granted in our society we don’t let people impose policy based solely on their religious preferences.
          b) but that doesn’t mean religious beliefs should be flat-out ignored. It so happens that our entire society is based on these very same moral and religious principles. They are not to be discarded lightly.
          c) which would you rather do without, abortion or electricity? The same civilizational principles which give you electricity and running water may be the ones which also prohibit abortion.

          2. Even if you discard the religious perspective, which is unwise, it can still be shown that permitting abortion is simply bad policy, even from a secular perspective. (Won’t get into the nuts and bolts today.)

          3. It is extremely harmful to society in the long run to go around mislabeling things, to say that things are true which are clearly not true, that a human fetus is not human when it clearly is, even if it seems “nice” or convenient to do so at the time. Road to hell, good intentions, etc.

          That’s not a slam-dunk debate “win” but it at least lays out the grounds for thinking seriously. I prefer that mode to “Clever way of saying abortion is good!” parried by “No, no — clever way of saying abortion is bad! Take THAT!”

          The English seem hopelessly addicted to witty little epigrams which are quite shallow when you untangle them. They also seem to love clever little logical gotcha traps which fall apart when you employ multiple lines of logic rather than just one. (While Richard Burton was busy triumphantly proving that a tomato is a fruit and not a vegetable, Paul Newman was busy making delicious tomato sauce.)

          Like the kids say today, It’s all so tiresome.

          • Andrew Neil is Scottish,attended Glasgow university.
            He was interviewing Shapiro about his book and the claims he makes in the book which Shapiro does not live by.

            Seems absurd to judge English people by this. Or even your conversations with Oxford types who are not the majority in England.Lazy thinking akin to little epigrams .

            The nature of a news segment limits the extent to which a person can explore all of the moral implications of a problem,especially when Shapiro refuses to answer the questions or tries to interview Neil.

            The adversarial nature of the interview is one way to encourage the interviewee to better explain their viewpoint. You start with a claim,the interviewee responds and you build on their response.The initial claim or statement made by the interviewer is not necessarily indicative of their moral/political views and is often shaped more by the stated views of the interviewee. You have made the same mistake Shapiro did.

            Bit rich to talk of limited thinking and gotcha traps when you suffer from the same problem.Your argument is based on a misreading of the interview process and the agenda of the Scottish interviewer.

      • There was an episode of Yes Prime Minister that explained this very well. “if you have nothing to say, say nothing. Better still, have something to say and say it. Pay no attention to the question, just make your own statement. If they ask the question again, you say ‘that’s not the question, or I think the real question is.. And then you make another statement of your own.”

    • Cigar: “Still, I had to feel a tiny bit sorry for him. He walked straight into a giant trap, which had 20-foot-tall neon “Danger! Warning! Now Entering Trap!” signs flashing all around it.” What are you talking about? He gave an interview with another adult about basic morality politics. The old man didn’t ask anything that any NPR shrew wouldn’t have asked.

      • That’s a perfectly fine view of the situation, I just think there are other views as well. Somehow I doubt Shapiro would have lost his marbles so hilariously, if the same sort of questions had been put to him by a middle-aged American harpy.

        But who knows. The important thing is, we all get a good laugh at the evil little sh!t’s expense.

      • @frip

        Neil did ask a question Benny Passports wouldn’t get in the US: he hit him on his racism against Palestinians. The BBC is a Kosher media outlet, but outside of the US you can’t just openly insult them as savages. In the heart of the Anglo-Zionist Empire support for Israel is so strong the prog media (NPR/NYT) mostly leave Israel alone. There’s some muted criticism here and there, and if it goes further it’s America that’s forcing Israel to be an apartheid ethnostate (the Chomsky/Goodman crowd).

      • Exactly. There was nothing unusual or brilliant about the questions. Neil just asked him about his controversial past statements and some current events. Shapiro just failed completely. He tried to turn it into a debate or a insult match and he couldn’t even get that right.

  26. Almost all of the Paycheck Conservatives are law-schooled, but I would only respect a small percentage in an actual courtroom. Ann Coulter is a small sample size. IIRC, Shapiro is a UCLA law grad – normally something we respect, but he’s never been an actual litigator. I tangled with Paterico on Twitter, Los Angeles Assistant DA, and he was no better at debate than Tom Nichols. The legal profession is a savage example of reversion to the mean nowadays. Cornell West faux verbosity + stupid levels of self confidence do not a real lawyer make. It does get you a seat in the TruCon clown car, though.

    • Ann Coulter kills it. She’s knows how to crystalize and cut the bull. Women I know like that are lesbians. They have very male brains. You know she takes scalps because they start making fun of her looks, calling her horse face, a hag, a harpy, etc…she’s not perfect, I don’t know how you can get on the Chris Christy train for a year. She definitely elevates the suffering downtrodden negro to win extra points on the immigration issue. Not a fan of that either.

      • She definitely elevates the suffering downtrodden negro to win extra points on the immigration issue.

        There’s an almost irresistible urge to champion some POC to show yourself you’re not a real racist. Christopher Hitchens did the same: he would make big bank bashing Islam, but he’d wear a Kurdistan lapel flag.

        Some time back, I noticed myself white-knighting some lawyer and FoS-activist, Jacob Mchangama, a mulatto adopted by Danish parents and 100% Danish in everything but skin color.

        At some point I asked myself, why I was so fond of him: granted, he was solid on almost everything, but a lot of people are, and I had to face that I’d never go to bat for him so fervently, if he’d been white.

        It’s the same phenomenon that gets someone like Candace Owens half a million subs overnight: we NEED to embrace some POC to demonstrate our non-racism. “Look, ma! Watch me fawn over this POC – it’s about ideas, not skin color!”

        That said, Ann has a point: blacks have actual beef to grind (if you’ll excuse the mangled metaphor) but people who just came in from Guatemala yesterday, do not get to play the racism-card: if they don’t like America, they can go back where they came from.

    • Shapiro says his undergraduate degree was taken at UCLA and his LLB or JD ( whatever it’s called these days ) at Harvard. Nonetheless your point remains intact.

      • Harvard & Yale are the most overrated law schools, cruising on the fumes of yesteryear. I worked for a 1957 Harvard grad senior partner with mid-class ranking who would BTFO Harvard’s best of 2019. Michigan produces better lawyers, so do Boalt Hall & Stanford.

  27. Spot on for Benji, disagree some with Tyson. Mike destroyed really good fighters in his prime and theirs, but when he his power wasn’t enough and was matched with someone with a great chin and skills, he didnt have the depth or character to summon from.

    Did you notice the concession from Benji on his whipping?

  28. Watching the old Firing Line Buckley show in light of where we’ve ended up makes one consider long-term consequences with a more heightened awareness…but comparing the quality of debate then with what goes on today is definitely a black pill.

    Censorship turns the vaudevillian trickster into a serious public figure.


  29. My dad always had an expression “If you can’t dazzle them with your brilliance, you baffle with your bullshit”. The later part of the expression is Ben Shapiro to his core. Even if the Andrew Neil interview didn’t happen, you can watch all of his other content to see how canned his phrases are and when he is supposedly describing something in detail, its all run on and it gets broad by the end of the explanation. You’ll notice in the Andrew Neil interview around right before they start talking about Palestine, he says, paraphrasing “If you want to stop getting me with the gotcha questions, please ask me about my GENERAL philosophy”.

  30. I believe it was around ’03 or ’04 when, as a 21 year old college undergraduate, Ben wrote an article in something (I forget what it was) where he stated that we should invade all of these various Middle-eastern countries for the purpose of ‘remaking” them into liberal democracies, like what we did with West Germany.

    My immediate thought was, why should we listen to this 21 year old college student over, say, a military or business veteran with 20 years experience working in and doing business in the Middle-east. What special knowledge does this 21 year old student have about the region that the 20 year military or industry veteran does not?

    I never read any thing from this Ben Shapiro guy ever again.

    What is truly astounding is the number of people who took him seriously.

    • I wouldn’t dismiss ALL 21-year-olds, though that was a good call in the case of BS. Most (all?) of those 20-year vets are time-servers and, from what I hear, the worst (best?) ass lickers and boot kissers, as apparently that’s how you get anywhere in the modern military. Maybe there’s a truly independent private-sector think tank with good advice re ME, but if so I have yet to hear about it, and prefer the default position of staying the f*uck out.

      • I failed to clarify what I meant by a 20 year military vet. I was referring more to someone who works as a long term consultant or contractor to, say, the Emirates or House of Saud on strategic military matters. I agree that a lot of the rank and file who move up through the ranks often lack perspective or even a natural curiosity about the world around them. The former will certainly have better working knowledge of Middle-eastern peoples and government than a 21 year old college student who has no real-world exprience whatsoever.

        My point was how a 21 year old college student with no real world experience could understand Middle-eastern peoples and government better than someone who has spent years working in the region. The only way the college student could have such knowledge is if grew up in a family that had such experience or had spent a lot of time around such individuals. There really is no other way to acquire such knowledge.

      • The average infantryman doing several tours worth of patrolling in the sandbox will have a much better perspective than any pampered college kid who knows absolutely nothing about the world and people and who will be spending most of his time boozing and f**king.

        As for the career men, some are really decent human beings and intelligent. Some aren’t. It depends on the MOS you are dealing with. The same applies to the officers. I’ve know some fine Lt. Col’s who ran some very high profile programs who knew the situation for what it was and were consummate gentleman as well.

        Now I have met some lunatics – Basically the military version of some our Alt-Right types like Spencer and his supporters.

        • There was a website/blog I ran into awhile back, but don’t remember the name (too lazy to look it up) where sandbox vet’s recounted their stories of interaction with the “natives”. All stories hilarious of course, but I couldn’t help analyzing these with the knowledge of the basic differences between the GI’s recounting and the native population wrt race and culture and religion. The unwoke (not all) GI’s were scratching their heads wondering how these things could happen, while I was just saying to myself, yep that seems about right.

    • Proudly blocked by SE Cupp(s) for ragging her about telling guys my age about what “muh Conservatism” really means. Hubris is their only skill. We eat these chumps for lunch in the real world. Sadly, they still prosper because the think-tank charity racket is a perverse selector. We need to destroy the Citizens United managerial state of fictitious “entities” to put these clowns’ skin back in their game.

      • The media searches for SE Cupps, who by the way stole her act from Kennedy (of MTV). Kennedy for all her libertarian craziness, is smart and sassy, SE Cupp is fake sassy that you want to slap across the face. I’m against hitting women, but SE Cupp needs a slap.

        • EE Cupps is just a clever businesswoman. Tomi Lahren is another. The thirst for a hot “conservative” wahmen ensures these broads a nice paycheck. Show some leg, pose with an AR15 and watch the shekels roll in. Try taking away their abortions? Forget it!

          They all play the “conservative but I Iove gays, and Islam is bad because I wouldn’t be able to be a slut” shtick. Can’t risk those cocktail parties with your beach frens by going too far right (like back to 2008).

          • Yes, unfortunately most of the women who claim to be part of the movement are in it for themselves and have no real principles. They want to lead or be pedestalized. They belong at home with a White husband and children.

    • He was just parroting standard neocon doctrine, probably angling for an internship.

      • That is true. However, people took him seriously and treated as his own insight, which is what blew me away. Either way, I thought the guy was full of crap from that point on and never paid any attention to him. I really despised the neo-cons at the time (I used to call them neo-nazi-cons) and still do. I am very happy to see them politically discredited.

    • Oh no. Second fave after our host.
      They don’t want us to see and learn from the Danish interview.

      Godsdammit. Thank you and bless you, Z, you changed a lot of lives.

        • Nazis burned books promoting communism and sexual degeneracy. Yeah, those guys are the problem. Why did you say “Nazis” and not “Communists?”

          • Reflexive Nazi / Hitler bashing and Holohoax sanctimony are another product of post-WW 11 Jewish propaganda, and now seem to have a tighter grip on right wing tradcons than on the left.

          • Line, I meant ironically like the Danish guy. You are 100% correct.

            Ratf**king Web Commies!!

            (Never again will I disrespect my people and the German Holocaust, millions of human sacrifices after the war. Baal’s victory feast.)

    • Just noticed and immediately checked on Z, who I hope has a backup plan for when (not if) the c*nts at wordpress come for him.

      • Z is not on WordPress, he just uses their software. He could still be shut down by the DNS-provider, mind you.

    • He’s been expecting that for some time. BRICS can’t get that alternative web built fast enough. In a generation’s time the Lords of Poz have turned me from a Reagan patriot to a Russian troll somewhere between Karlin & Saker.

    • I loved reading there. Never commented (not my place as a woman) but I learned a lot I wish I’d understood back in junior high! Seriously interesting insight into the dance between the sexes, plus nationalism plus snark/humor. I really hope he finds a way to repost somewhere.

      • How sad. We all take it as given that Z man’s blog is doomed. We know the score, and for all our piss and vinegar, we know that in a few days/weeks/months it’ll be over. It’s like being an East Prussian in early 1945, removing the decorations from our Christmas trees, saying hello to our neighbors, riding into town to buy a new clock, that sort of stuff, trying to ignore the impending apocalypse we are not allowed to talk about because it is ‘defeatist’.

        The Donald should be championing freedom of thought on the internet, but he doesn’t, though he enjoys tweeting well enough; it seems to be the main substance of his presidency.

        We can’t withstand what’s coming without a soldier-emperor leading an army into DC, purging the bureaucracy, sending congressmen into exile, and lining up lobbyists against walls and cutting them down with machine guns.

        • Daaammn….you sound like my husband. A lot of us sound like you. Now I’m going to do something mindless, watch reruns of Inspector Lewis, as I can’t take any more for the moment. You said it and that vision is the roll-out. We all know it. We have to seek moments of mindlessness to survive until we know what we are dealing with. Give the brain a rest so we can again think under stress and duress as the future becomes now.

  31. Meh. The Left doesn’t have any debaters who can stand up to an intelligent grilling either, so what’s the big deal? People are not persuaded by facts anyway, so why bother debating?

    • We debate because we must change the minds of many undecided and unintelligent people whose support we unfortunately need.

      Debate in such cases is almost always rhetoric, psychological manipulation, ad hominem, and obfuscation. But is absolutely necessary to grow our numbers.

      When we debate with those with whom we share the same objectives, then we use logic and facts and it is one of the pinnacles of white society.

      • I concur we need to debate. The problem is that the Left argues from EMOTION, not facts/reason/logic/evidence/history. And therein lies the problem. The Left will show a picture or video outlining something… point to how horrible it is and how we must do something. Only later, when the truth comes out, is there any retraction – IF there is a retraction.

        In my own attempts to counteract Pallywood, my experience is that an emotional conclusion cannot be dispelled through reason. Once must induce dissonance, emotional dissonance and distress, at which point that emotional conclusion is in flux – THEN hit them with facts and so on.

        E.g., there’s a “famous” picture of a young woman who got SPLAT-ified. Published in multiple Arab-language newspapers as an example of Israeli atrocities it’s actually a screen grab from one of the Final Destination movies. Only when people see the newspaper articles with the horrific picture, but then see the movie clip from where it comes, do they say “Waaaaait a minute!”

        People naturally, IMHO, have an aversion to being grossly lied to. And when they understand they’ve been lied to, ONLY THEN are they open to new information. Otherwise, they’ll remain Teflon Intellects, utterly immune to any information that’s contrary to what they “know” is true.

        • My gosh, you’re right, Nitzakhon, that’s supremely important.

          After cucking for YKW my whole life, what redpilled me?

          My emotion- my growing rage at finding out I’d been lied to.

          Pointing out the lie is step #1.
          I see everything differently now.

      • Hi Line. Glad you are carrying the torch, as I have dropped it and walked away leaving a sputtering torch, drowning in it’s own spilt oil. In my own little experience, I have never once had the opportunity to engage those on the other side of the divide in a meaningful debate/conversation.

        The last time at work this happened, began as a mere talk with two fellow Sr. Distribution Operators, Lefty guys, about the merit or not of school vouchers. I said yes on that, they blew up and one of the guys believed so strongly that the schools would die because of school choice (duh!), he became so angry with me he half sprung out of the chair eyeballs bulging poised to wallop me. I yelped we’d have to agree to disagree and sprang out of the way disappearing from the control room.
        This was in 2005.

        There is no talking with, to, or at them. I’m done! If you have great stamina, you go for it. I’m bitter and now a realist. The phrase that comes to mind is…..Eff ‘em and the horse they rode into town on, too. I’m an ex-Lefty. I know how pigheaded Leftys can be (Ha! Says the Husband). I never physically threatened anyone. However, in typical Lefty manner, when losing the argument because I had no argument, I’d attempt on to shut down the discussion by calling them a stupid name…..You’re a Racist, etc. This is the argument for God having humor as he’s absolutely laughing his ass off at me right now (the big booming voice proclaims…Got a taste of your own medicine, Girlie Girl!)

        THIS IS A RELIGION…..ALL EMOTION….THERE ARE NO TALKING FACTS AND REASON TO A TRUE BELIEVER. Everything we say is, to the Left Divide, like conjuring up their version of Satan in front of their eyes. And they go completely nuts, hysterical or physically violent. They are defending the sacredness of their religion.

        So I’ll leave it to you, Z, Derb and so on to form the arguments and fight the good fight. Your clarified arguments help me to think, refine and grow. Not the Left. Civil war is coming. Few people will wake up by discussing the issues. People wake up when they get walloped. A few more Dead Beckys here, a few more street riots there, a few more pro-life people beat up here, a few more shootings like Steve Scalise there, we win an election and the Left goes hysterical and burns up the nearest business district, while the Blacks blow up, befoul their own nests and burn down their own businesses.

        Some Normies see this and form a defensive posture and begin to awake. I did. Normies do not see the tech tyranny descending. They awake only if they are really, really threatened….and even then many retain their blinkers because the pain of leaving the herd is often greater then the pain of threat and death and tyranny. No joke! Not fun to have an ex-Lefty around, eh!

        • I don’t find debate very useful either due pretty much to the reasons you’ve stated. Folks can’t agree on the facts and especially lack knowledge of formal thinking and logical fallacies. So as you’ve pointed out, one might mention the FBI statistics showing crime being disproportionate in the Black population and the response is not agreement—or even to question the FBI stat’s—but to respond that you and your ilk are “racist”.

          Do I really have to diagram the problem with this response in a “debate”? Am I expected (even if I could) to provide every person I speak with on the subject a short course in critical thinking and logical fallacies? Am I my brother’s “teacher”? 😉

          I applaud Z-man’s efforts in this blog, but I can’t help thinking it would not be near as popular and useful if his general audience was not as “woke” as it is and not at the level of understanding of even the most basic principles he elaborates on.

          • Evening Compsci and 3g4me.
            “Am I expected (even if I could) to provide every person I speak with on the subject a short course in critical thinking and logical fallacies? Am I my brother’s “teacher?”

            The destruction of our public education system has been achieved. There is no critical thinking. It’s all about emoting and staying within the confines of the tribal religion. Bless you my brothers for having the testicular fortitude to continue attempting to reach across the universe. Agree that there must be a slow wake-up as testified by Z’s great success. So very grateful for those of you putting your time, energy and good name on the line, often to get a blowtorch in the face. You’re good men.

            “Anyone who still insists on denying reality has made his choice and will have to deal with the consequences – not my problem.”

            3g4m4…you have shown a light on a deep and wide paradox. Not just a few but millions make a statement by picking up and landing in a safer location. Yet people are so cowed they do it on auto-pilot. To see and voice why they leave would bring down the entire Lefty pantheon of gods on their head. Their eyes are mesmerized on this matter, which is … ability- nay right- to choose with whom I freely associate also implies my right to be free of “you” should I choose. We have lost that fundamental right. Yet people do it without thinking and twist themselves in knots to deny reality, and not get caught. Yes, the eyes not seeing yet the feet walking away from the crummy neighborhood, the bad school, the elites move to gated communities, is the walk of the Stepford people.

            Not my problem!

        • Hear, hear, Range Front Fault. I had a similar experience with Christian school moms. Merely the mention of race being detectable from skeletal remains made them wince and change the subject. They would later twist themselves into pretzels to explain why they were moving their nubile, blonde daughters to a different Christian school (more options and programs, rather than admit it was fewer Negroes admitted to be on the football team). Anyone who still insists on denying reality has made his choice and will have to deal with the consequences – not my problem.

    • This is the big thing Shapiro doesn’t get. His “facts don’t care about your feelings” schtick is designed for appealing to mildly-spergy, well-educated white males who like to think their political ideas are derived from pure rationality (a group I am more or less part of). And that’s a great strategy for getting YouTube fame.

      You know who does care about feelings? Actual human beings, who are 100% of voters.

      Shapiro is the guy yelling “you’re only doing this because you don’t have a coherent intellectual response” as the football team shoves him headfirst into the trash can. And he’s right. And still in the trash can.

      • AKA libertarians. He’s Randroid catnip. Guys like him are why normies correctly read the libertarian right as heartless spergs.

      • Sam, I’m not trying to be argumentative, but I believe my political ideas have a basis in rationality. Specifically, my understanding of HBD—leading to individual and group differences—leading to political agendas, seems to be well backed up by current scientific understanding. So where do I have to get more emotional and less rational?

      • Spencer always counters that with “feelings don’t care about your facts.”

        It’s true. You have to get people on a gut level. It’s a small minority who try to coldly evaluate facts to come to a belief system: those people are called spergs, and most people are unimpressed with their ability to quote crime statistics. (It’s for that reason I don’t have much time for IQ nationalism.) You could better redpill a normie by taking him on a cruise through the ‘hood than showing him IQ charts.

        I went down the Neocon road briefly because that’s about all there was in the late 90’s/early 00’s. Once I found St. Pat I was done with that forever. I saw the country changing and I wanted it stopped. That simple. I didn’t need a chart.


        • I think the “chart” (IQ) comes in (if at all—your point well taken) is with folks like my brother in law. They readily admit to the discrepancies you cite (via the hypothetical cruise through the “hood”), but fall back on the old tropes: That’s the exception, not the rule; or, Those are a minority, not representative of the entire population; or, Yeah, that’s bad, but I work with a “good one”, so you’re wrong.

    • Mostly they can rely on gatekeeping to lock us out of corporate media exposure. But I would not feel confident going head-to-head with any of the goons on the NYT editorial board.

  32. Because I have friends who love Shapiro, and because I don’t want my rhetoric to blind me to reality, I notice an article he wrote in June 2018 where he provides a “Giant List Of All The Dumb Stuff I’ve Ever Done.”

    His first topic is one of my favorite anti-Shapiro arguments, which I often hear from other dissidents, that Shapiro supports the ethnic cleansing of Palestinians while demanding multiculturalism in white lands.

    His retraction seems tactical because while he calls his previous argument “inhumane” he doesn’t say how his current position is different. His current beliefs seem unchanged.

    • Non-Jewish cons are rarely accorded the same amount of mulligans. Steve Sailer was blacklisted from mainstream media for pointing out that New Orleans blacks were immoral. McHugh was blacklisted for making a less outrageous comment about Muslims than Shapiro. I’m not sure why Kmgvictoria was blacklisted, but his old boss Ezra Levant is still living large.

      • KMG is just a weirdo. I always felt kind of bad for him when he went off on some twitter rant against another dissident right figure and put their name in a hashtag instead of actually tagging them so they could respond.

        Smart guy, but I question his mental health.

        • KMG seems determined to defend the untenable position that he is not a civic nationalist but not in favor of an ethnostate. He’s like Andy Nowicki, whose position seems to be, “race is real but it must be irrelevant!”

          White people are the only ones who feel bad when they judge a person by a trait that they did not choose.

          I felt bad for him when he was on the brink of homelessness a few months ago.

        • I’ll second that diagnosis. I like KMG but he’s deeply conflicted. He’s based but can’t bring himself to accept it in a lot of ways. The first time I heard of Z-man was KMG’s interview where he talked about black guys being scared of their own women. He also interviewed McHugh before her bizzarre goy-grovel.

    • I’ve always liked, “an unborn baby has a medical condition which is self correcting in a short period of time”.
      Should we kill someone whose cancer will take longer than 3 months to cure? 6 months? 9?

      I’ve been using it for years and been met with not much more than gob-smacked visages,

    • His first topic is one of my favorite anti-Shapiro arguments

      That was the bit that Andrew Neill pulled him up on, and in all honesty, Ben was right pointing out that he had regretted that stance. If Ben had just kept his cool, he’d have had no problem with Neill, his mistake was that he took Neill for a regressive and got passive-aggressive about it.

  33. Eh, I think some of this is a little backwards. What’s exposed here is not any lack of intellectual heft, but his lack of emotional IQ. As you said the other day, TV is a cool medium, and if you come across as angry guy, you lose. His willingness to push back on the interviewer’s bias and loaded questions is laudable. Most mainstream conservatives wouldn’t have done it, and he deserves credit for not backing down, e.g. on abortion. 90% of mainstream conservatives would have looked to distance themselves from the Georgia law, and props to him for not doing that. The problem is that the way he did it was so snotty and pissy.

    It’s also wrong to say smacking down coeds is the only place Shapiro does well. He holds his own fine in long-form podcast type conversations with people like Sam Harris, who are serious intellectuals and also very fairminded and honest. You may not agree with his ideas, but he doesn’t come across in those interviews as the douchebag he does here.

    Left media types are, in general, NOT fair-minded or honest, and they DON’T want to seriously engage anyone’s ideas. They’re bringing you on to smear and attack you, and when you get angry at them on TV, they win.

    As someone said above, the proper way to handle this is to do what Jordan Peterson did to Kathy Newman.

    • His reply on the abortion question was comically bad. He could have easily replied that a miscarriage is not going to get you sent to jail and that he didn’t know murder stopped at the state line. All Benji did was accuse the host of being a Leftist. He could have also pointed out the more restrictive European laws.

    • His first problem with the abortion response was accepting the premise that banning it is barbaric or a return to the dark ages – easily could have harkened back to the good old pater familias days of yore, where dad set out junior on the hillside at two days old to die. The Romans had late term abortion up to two days – so who is heading in what direction? Killing your own offspring seems a wee but barbaric to me.

      Second one was Obama’s speech being fascist. Again, double down rather than deny, and start with what you mean by fascism – it’s one of those terms everyone uses, and no one understands. Simply say it was fascist – and here why (1) fascism means X, and (2) Obama proposed X.

      As pointed out above, Lil’ Ben is designed to stir controversy and heat up the divide by his very nature (voice, mannerisms). So writing a book calling for more civility, and then going on a show to defend his civility are two bad decisions building on each other. He is simply not particularly civil by temperament, so Neil kind of had him by the short hairs to begin with. And then Lil’ Ben just proved Neil’s point, even if, substantively, Lil’ Ben’s responses were not all bad. But in the age of image is everything, losing your cool simply does not prove you are a cool-headed interlocutor.

  34. The comparison to Milli Vanilli is even closer than you realize Zman: “A vocal track skipped and repeated itself over and over again during a live concert, causing Rob and Fab to flee the stage in confusion and embarrassment.” just like little Benji

    • “Girl you know it’s…….Girl you know it’s…….Girl you know it’s…….Girl you know it’s…….”

      Ben Shapiro gets publicly humiliated and I get to re-live an obscure, hilarious early 90’s moment? Looks like everything is coming up Milhouse!

  35. Shapiro can redeem himself and toughen himself up by joining the U.S. Army, which he still can do at age 35, and fight in the wars he has backed.

      • He’s been in the public eye non-stop since he was a teenager, straight through college and on to professional punditry. There has been no time out for military service and it is not mentioned on his Wikipedia page. I don’t think he has ever served for any country.

      • Someone once asked me why I didn’t serve my country. “Because,” I said, “it’s not my country.”

    • Putting chicken-hawks like JPod, Kristol the Lesser and David French on the actual front lines would be Day 1 priority in my reign of terror. Pinochet can hold my beer…

  36. shapiro has a radio show that also reveals his mental limitations. he has a lot of time to fill and comes across as talking shit about things he really doesn’t know anything about. Plus he sounds like Jimminy Cricket

      • When we still had a Huwite society we could have pure children’s entertainment like “The Littlest Hobo”

    • Plus he sounds like Jimminy Cricket

      That’s almost the worst part. There are several youtubers I don’t bother with, simply because I can’t stand their voices or their mannerisms, like Stephan Molyneux,Tim Pool or Lana from Red Ice.

      Sargon, on the other hand, is quite boring but he has such a pleasant baritone, so he gets my patronage from time to time.

      Ben is both boring, annoying, smug and trite at the same time, all delivered in his signature ear-itching whine.

      Plus he hates heritage America and wants to destroy it, but that’s another discussion.

  37. In natural evolution, when the weak encounter serious hardship or existential threat, they typically die off and, over time, their DNA is weeded out of the gene pool. In our modern era, society writ large intervenes to ensure that natural evolution is defeated. This perpetuates weakness, which then festers and ultimately degrades the entire species. Shapiro is not a savior of the Conservative Movement, he is the vanguard (and poster boy) of the destruction of the species.

    • Shapiro’s species is doing quite well in age of MIGA. So well that triumphalist idiots like Shapiro, Stephens, Noah Rothman and Michelle Goldberg crow about White Genocide over the Cathedral megaphone. Chutzpah brings Nemesis. Pogrom or suicide? Choose one, Whitey.

  38. We had a similar situation here in Denmark, where the newly notorious provocateur, Koran-burner and parliamentarian in spe, Rasmus Paludan – whom the late Chateau Heartiste re-tweeted in his penultimate post – was invited on DanMarx Radio (as the Danish national broadcaster is almost called) to a fluff talk show.

    But no sane establishment politician would face him, because in political terms he’s a nobody and he’s a known wild man, so they invited Mimi, a washed-out, octogenarian, commie yenta with a solid track record of argumentation ad hitlerum, and a pivotal role in opening up Denmark’s borders back in the eighties.

    And less than sixty second into her first incoherent rant, she delivered on the one job she was there to do: “this reminds me of something we saw in the thirties, senilemumblemumble, what comes out of your mouth is Nazi-ism.”

    Now, just a few moments previously, Paludan had explicitly told her that he talked civilly to people who talked civilly to him, but if people wanted to fling turds, he responded in kind. Hence:

    “And you remind me of Adolf Hitler”, he told the evil old bolshie, without missing a beat.


    What the actual fuck? Can he do that? The two commie hosts, the old commie bitch and some commie ‘political expert’ dropped jaws simultaneously.

    “WHAT?” gentle Mimi screeched. “What did you just call me?”

    “You’re a Nazi swine”, he coolly doubled down.

    She physically reeled in the chair and her eyes started tearing up, her three handlers were dumbstruck. They’d all been in the business of Nazi-calling people for twenty years plus, but THIS was new. Now, Mimi was talking over him, so the insult was half lost in her senile ravings, but one of the hosts caught it:

    “Sorry, what did you just call her?”

    “A Nazi swine”, Paludan helpfully repeated, clearly enunciating each syllable for the benefit of the mic.

    So her handlers collected their wits and went through a lot of Jewish sophistry in explaining to the viewers that Mimi never called anyone a Nazi – perish the thought! – no,no, she merely expressed an opinion on his views. His views, you understand, his views! Mimi wasn’t being personal with anybody!

    “I’m going to leave now”, sniffled Mimi.

    “Goodbye”, said Paludan.

    I’m sorry I can’t link to the video, it keeps getting copyright stricken, but here is the video that Heartiste posted just before he got shoah’d. Alas, I couldn’t find a subtitled version, but the clip is all about the soyboi looks on the globalist candidates around him, when he gives a pretty standard Pat Condell-style rant on Islam.

    I advise you to keep Denmark on your radar for the next few weeks. The prime minister has called for a general election on the 28th, and Paludan just made Danish politics fun again. Every word he says in the linked rant is 100% true, and every globalist in that room knows it, and they know that the voters know it too – they have no antidote to him.

    I’d put him at ten percent of the vote. That may not sound like much in America, but when you have 13(!) parties in parliament, it’s a big deal, especially since he’s basically just a clown – a character in the best Danish tradition of Blockhead Hans, but not an actual politician.

      • Thanks, alt tech to the rescue. And at least people can behold her evil commiecunt face – the Heartiste would have a field day physiognomy-splaining her.

        I must admit she’s more collected than I recalled, but she’s clearly struggling to put together coherent sentences. She caught a bad case of Lyme’s Disease some years back, and never fully recovered – I haven’t seen her out and about in the public debate for the last five years.

        And I almost forgot the cherry on top. After the debate and the ensuing shrieking and pointing fingers, it transpired that Mimi, on her FB account, had called Paludan a Nazi – straight up and with no rhetorical camouflage – only four days previously.

    • Good for him. Never cuck. Ad Hitlerum only works if you are dumb enough to stand on that hill and die.

      • Yes. He has clearly been paying attention to what’s going on in America, how to handle chaimstream media.

        I’ve said unironically, that America will once again come to Europe’s rescue, this time by pioneering the voyage into the unknown we face in the coming decades. Just like European shitlibs take their cues from America, the European right learn immensely from the experiences garnered by besieged American nationalists, both in terms of ideology and strategies.

    • Wow…impressive. Thanks for bringing us up to date on your neck of the woods! Expands my awareness beyond my immediate world. As Alzaebo said, “Standing Ovation, Felix!”

      • Just watched the Youtube of Paludan/MimiCommie. Okay, didn’t understand a word, wish I could, but rather interesting watching the body language. That old gal is so far over the hill, she has one foot in the swampy swale. Uncomfortably like watching Nancy Pelosi unable to control her mouth muscles and having mini-strokes while gaslighting. Can dish it out but can’t take it.

        • Yes, trotting her out was a sign of the fear and desperation now gripping the globalists. She must’ve been VERY far down their list, I bet more than a dozen people said no thanks until they got to her.

          Her career ended before social media took off and while Danish state media still had a virtual monopoly on television, she’s been glad-handed all her career. She probably thought “hey, I’ve been bashing the fash for thirty years, I can take on some runt,” but she doesn’t understand that in $CurrentYear, you can bypass the bolshie gatekeepers and speak to the voters directly.

          The only problem with Paludan is that he’s an ugly SOB but then, another ugly SOB lawyer nuked the staid Danish parliament in 1973, after having compared tax cheats to WWII freedom fighters, “doing a dangerous, but patriotic job.” He produced his tax receipt on live television, showing a big, fat, patriotic zero. He was also the first in Denmark to warn about the Mohammadan danger.

  39. I don’t follow Shapiro; like the BBC interviewer I didn’t even know who the guy was. Now I do … and what an incredible lightweight. Disagree with Jordan Peterson all you want, but at least that guy has a mind, some gravitas and good rhetorical skill. Shapiro has ALL the negatives for televised debate; he’s whiny, precocious & smarmy.

    Since Shapiro claims to take his Judaism seriously, why isn’t he familiar with the Proverbs, like this one: “When words are many, transgression is not lacking, but whoever restrains his lips is prudent.”

  40. The Tyson comparison is an apt one for Little Benji. Like most of the chattering classes, he is useless going off his script of clever talking points.

    When I was 12, I started playing basketball at the “urban” YMCA and it was a baptism of fire. It was humbling, but you have to beat the best to the be the best.

    Every time I played with the kids back home, I could see a massive improvement. If not for sharpening iron with iron, I likely would’ve never played in college.

    Benji never did this, instead he feasted on the weak and never had to defend his rubbish in a real debate. He also didn’t do his homework and it showed.

    Was it me or did he sound squeakier than usual?

    I’ve always found him a sanctimonious little prick and con man. He’s someone that probably got a steady diet of wedgies and swirlies in school.

    I have right-leaning friends who are fans of his and they always throw out the anti-semite card when I criticize his nonsensically inconsistent views.

    It’s fascinating how the ruling classes keep finding ever-weaker “conservatives” to keep us on the egalitarian plantation. Rush was OK, Hannity was a New Yawk-bred bumbler and Benji, well…the less said the better. I’m hopeful that this depantsing will be another nail in the coffin of Conservative Inc.

  41. I remember when one of the milli vanilli crew tried putting out an album of his music with his own voice. Holy crap it was hilarious. He had such a thick german accent. “Blame it on ze rain jaaaah jaaaah!”

  42. I subscribed! That was a goat ropin! I still like Milli Vanilli. I never understood why it mattered if the guys in the videos sang the songs. Makes you wonder how many other pop acts are like that though.

    • Madonna couldn’t sing for sh*t. They pioneered voice-mixing to make her career. She was the OG lip-syncer, basically a DJ groupie who wanna-be’d long enough to get a break.

      • Her singing abilities are minimal and relative to many other attractive women, Madonna is not all that good looking. She is a genius marketer and little else. She’s an object lesson in how far one can go on skillful manipulation.

        • Not to mention subverting the one religion is OK to subvert and pushing degeneracy generally.

      • They pioneered voice-mixing to make her career.

        The first to really do this was ABBA, only they didn’t have the equipment back then, so they had to do it live. Most of the time, the two front girls would sing the exact same voice in perfect sync, which is what gives the metallic, echo-ey ABBA sound.

        Those are two girls singing, not one girl and an echo machine.

        Of course, you have to be able to sing to pull it off, but back then, singers who could sing were fairly common.

        • It’s not called the casting couch for nothing. Nothing new. Move along. Move along. Women have been advancing their status for thousands of years by busting the move.

    • I never understood why it mattered if the guys in the videos sang the songs.

      Ha! I always wondered why people would go to concerts. The sound is shit, the beer is expensive and watered down, and the crowd is annoying. A comfy recliner and a couple of headphones beat the concert experience into a cocked hat.

      • Ha! Only went to concerts when friends talked me into it. Last concert was Springsteen in the Oakland Coliseum. The crowd was immense. He was a small ant on stage and the first jumbotron plastered his image on a giant TV screen. Sucked! Never went again.

        Now he thinks he’s the great moral arbiter….typical Lefty beat you over the head with his BS this is how you should live you dumb shit people.

        After all the wailing about the working class, Jersey Freehole boy, my home town crap I bought hook line and sinker, read today his daughter is a high class horsie girl high jumping at the Royal Windsor Horse Show. Mommy Patti bought a middling farm for Little Miss Salt of the Earth daughter when she was 5 so she could be tutored in elite horsemanship. Then was sent to Duke. Wanna bet The Boss pulled some $ strings to get her in. Now she rides the Royal horsie circuit.

        Huh..get hold of big $ and there goes all the romantic horse crap about My Home Town and so held down by the “man” am workin’ at the car wash! Turned his head in a New York Second, never looked back and couldn’t run away from it fast enough. But Damn It All you’d better bend over and save the planet! Meh! Still have shite on your heels.

  43. What I don’t get about Shapiro is him being touted as a “destroyer of Liberals!” and “owning the left” by saying things that, to anyone with half a brain, ought to be obvious. Sure, it sets off the Trigglypuffs of the world, but so does clapping.
    “Facts don’t care about your feelings.”
    Yeah, we already knew that ..
    “There are only *two* genders.”
    Whoa, you’re really on fire today, Ben…
    “Advancement should be merit based.”
    Yeah, really dropping the heavy ordnance aren’t we; bunker busting truth bombs eh?
    Its like the debate topic equivalent of room temperature tap water, but it gets hyped up as some newly discovered Elixer of Truth. I think if Shapiro got pressed on *actual* heavyweight topics, even by a novice thinker, he would still struggle.

    • Do you work for a business with an HR Dept? It was a harsh wake up call for me to realize that if I made fun of Bruce Jenner for pretending to be a chick at my office that my position might be in jeopardy.

      This is the usefulness of Ben Shapiro and Jordan Peterson, who are otherwise not so useful. They are willing to say in public the obviously true things that most people believe but saying would get them fired.

      • If they were really that useful, would we still be walking on eggshells around the HR scolds?

  44. I don’t follow Shapiro and only saw a snippet of the interview you write about — it’s clear he is a hypocrite re Zionism (big supporter) and American nationalism (not so much) — also that he is an establishment figure — re your contention that he’s an overrated fraud: can you name an establishment figure or politician who isn’t?

    • Shapiro wears a yarmulke in nearly every single thing I’ve seen him in so if he wasn’t completely in the Zionism tank, that would shock me to my core

      Problem is with the Establishment Conservative lot, its not so much hypocrisy or ethnic nepotism though there is plenty of that.

      What it is people in the political class who should know better being able to delude ourselves that Israeli interests and American interests are always exactly the same . Sometimes? Sure. But as much as these guys do, that requires a special kind of stupid

  45. Shapiro sounded like a squirrel caught in the claws of a hawk. But he doesn’t have to worry about being “de-platformed.” He’s an approved performing minstrel selling “conservative” bullshit in service to the GOPe/Media/Deep State cabal.

    To use your boxing metaphor, you won’t see Shapiro selling gas grills on cable TV any time soon.

    • There has been a lot of chatter recently about Fox using the littlest squirrel to replace Tucker C.

      They will still replace TC, but they now need a new stalking horse. Maybe.

        • Murdoch’s kids are woke as f*ck. The minute he checks out that place will turn into CNN.

      • Little Benji’s implosion is proof that God still smiles on us occasionally, even in this degraded state

        • I wouldn’t go that far. The enemy stomped on Shapiro and added to the canon of the witless: These ‘conservatives’ are losers and our rulers know what’s best. I hope God would not smile on disasters like this.

          It’s curious that a man like Theodore Dalrymple isn’t grilled in these interviews. A wordless, bemused look from his eyes would win half the battle. Unllike Shapiro he’s a man who has lived, learned, read, and contemplated. I would say the same of Peter Hitchens, even if he’s rather a dick about Trump. But he knows all about these BBC stooges and their slaughter pens, and never loses his cool when dealing with them.

          Shapiro has no cool to lose – he’s a baby among hardened and cynical people who know who they work for, what is required, and how to cut the jugular vein. That’s what they are paid to do, and they’re good at it.

  46. Shapiro is desperately trying to roll it back by admitting fault and apologizing to just about anyone who will listen. The part of the Milli Vanilli epitaph that you left out is the half of the duo who shot himself in despair.

    • Yeah, I thought that might be a bit mean to mention.

      What’s incredible about the performance is the questions were softballs. The one on abortion was a perfect setup to point out the immorality of the practice. But Shapiro panicked and fell apart.

      • I watched it twice because the first time I couldn’t believe what I was seeing. Shapiro appears to have fallen into the trap of believing his own bullshit. It’s as if Milli Vanilli actually started to think that it really was them singing all those songs. For Shapiro, yesterday before that interview he really was certain that he was the brilliant debater that nobody in the world could touch, hence his arrogance.

        Pride cometh before the fall and all that.

      • Panicked is right. Shapiro was right to take umbrage at the terms applied to a few States’ regimes as barbaric and a return to the Dark Ages, but he flailed and then fled the matter. He should have really nailed his interrogator’s characterizations and demanded to know in what universe the prevention of the murder of unborn children is barbaric or a Dark Age? But his adversary was wily, indeed, and deflected him easily pretending he was simply being an interviewer whose adjectives didn’t really matter and wouldn’t be questioned about them. I’ve heard Hugh Hewitt pull this tactic in asking a loaded question (fair enough) but when pushed back on it says, “This is an interview, not a debate (or discussion). You don’t get to ask the questions.” People go along with that because they want the airtime even though it’s a setup and the outcome is rigged. There’s no excuse for not being prepared, though.

      • He is also used to saying ” Hamas” and having everyone fall back and concede. He kept using that talismanic word and it had no effect. You could see mixed confusion and anger.

    • No way! I never heard that part. Thing is, that was probably true of half the industry. It’s probably three crusty old frog looking corporate musicians cranking out hits for all these boy bands.

      • No it was ruled an accidental overdose. That member fell into a pattern of drug abuse and crime, not unlike many similar pro sports athletes. It wasn’t directly bc of the lip sink controversy

      • Circle the wagons, Conservative Inc! Your water boy showed his ass! Down the memory hole it goes. Ben shall remain, in the official dramatis personae,, a peerless paladin of debating prowess. After all, there’s an agenda to be pushed, and those points aren’t gonna talk themselves!

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