Suspicious Minds

The Panic of 1873 is one of those events that was important at the time, but gets little discussion today. One reason is it does not fit modern narratives, as the villains and victims are not familiar today. It is one of those events that just seemed to happen and all of these years later it is not clear why it happened. There are lots of possible causes, but not one obvious cause. The resulting decades long depression, however, setup the 20th century and the two great industrial wars.

Another important event that gets little attention these days is the Great Fear that preceded the French Revolution. This was a period of panic, fear and conspiracy theories that swept rural France. Rumors circulated about various plots by the King and the aristocratic classes. For reasons no one has been able to explain, the peasants became increasingly sure the First Estate was about to overthrow the Third Estate, which eventually led to the revolution.

One of the many interesting things about the Bolshevik Resolution is the parallels between it and the French Revolution. Lenin was supposedly a student of the latter, so the lessons of it informed his decisions. Whether this is true or not is like so much else about our history. No one can say for sure now. One clear parallel, however, was the fear and panic preceding the February revolution. Suddenly, no one could trust anyone, so everyone was willing to believe the most outlandish tales.

The one thread that runs through economic panics, periods of civil unrest and great social upheavals like revolutions is the collapse in trust. It is not just the trust in individuals like a king or rich people. Human societies have been dealing with dishonest rulers for a long time. Monarchs come and go and people quickly adjust. When everyone knows the problem is a man or group of men, the solution to the problem is always at hand. No man, no more problems.

Panics are different. The fear is driven by the sense that nothing can be trusted, even one’s own assessment of events. In the case of economic panics, when a big powerful bank fails, impoverishing its clients, how can one trust anything about the financial system at that point? If all of a sudden the currency loses a big chunk of its value, how can anyone trust the economic system itself? In times when the foundations of the system lose credibility, no one can trust anything in the system.

A simple example makes this clear. If in your place of work, the software system used by the company suddenly produces errors, everyone raises an alarm. Work stops until the people in charge of the software either explain why the unexpected result is, in fact, correct or they find the cause and repair it. The software system holds the business rules of the company, so when those rules appear to be to failing, the logic of the business is called into question. The users begin to panic.

The reason people panic is that trust is built on predictability and predictability relies on rules and the orderly enforcement of those rules. When the rules stop making sense or their enforcement becomes arbitrary, it becomes impossible to predict the outcome of one’s actions. When you cannot trust the rules, you cannot trust the results of your own decisions, which means you cannot trust even yourself. When people can trust nothing they are willing to believe anything.

America appears to be in one of those moments when the people are suddenly thrust into a world in which they can no longer trust anything. The extraordinary events of the last election have caused tens of millions to question the system itself. Even those who voted for Biden are coming around to the idea that it was not on the level. Now we are seeing wild claims rocketing around the internet about what is happening to various people and what is happening behind the scenes.

The new rumors and claims are a bit nutty, but the fact is this has been building for a while, going back to before the prior election. Think back and there were all sorts of rumors about Hillary Clinton. People were willing to believe them because she is a terribly corrupt person and a notorious liar. You cannot trust anything that is said by her, her associates or anyone aligned with her. Today, everyone views the system the same way we have viewed Hillary Clinton for decades.

Another interesting aspect to this time of rumor and panic is the fact that the political class has not learned from the economic class. The lesson the bankers learned from the depression of 1929 is that one tool in their arsenal had to be a form of shock and awe as they addressed the crisis. The display of power by the central bank would fill the void of trust and quell the panic. This has proven to be highly effective, as we saw with the mortgage crisis in 2008. Everyone trusted the Fed.

Looking back at the French and Russian revolutions, there were points when the ruling class could have restored some trust in themselves and the system. They had opportunities to change the dynamic and bring people back into a political process they could trust. They failed to do so, often choosing a path that further eroded what little trust the people had in them. We’re seeing similar failures today, as the ruling class carries on as if nothing is happening outside their mansions.

This is how suspicious minds become radical minds. When people get suspicious over something like the election anomalies, they are looking for an explanation from a source they want to trust. When that natural authority mocks or dismisses their suspicion, that becomes part of a new narrative to explain both the anomalies and the unexpected reaction to it. That why the rumors are flying. Suddenly, tens of millions are in the market for a new narrative to explain what they are seeing.

Just as important, tens of millions of American are moving from a mode where they think the government has bad elements to a mode where the suspect the government itself is the bad element. When public trust in the system sharply declined a generation ago, the system had a solution. Reagan channeled that distrust into a reform effort that restored trust in the system. Today, the Pretender Biden and his coterie of flunkies and door holders is channeling that distrust into conspiracies.

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250 thoughts on “Suspicious Minds

  1. The simpler explanation tends to be the more correct one. Some people never seem to wonder why the republicans don’t seem to be overly concerned about voter fraud. Remember this is a system designed and built by sociopaths of both stripes. They’re busy cheating like crazy too. I’ll bet there hasn’t been an honest close election in over 50 years.
    The simple fact explaining it all might be the democrats were able to cheat more than the republicans, but the republicans were better at hiding it. Of course they’re not going to blow the whistle on the corrupt system that might expose themselves as well.

  2. One way to protest that they are going to feel is a wide spread tax revolt. What could be more American sounding to normies if the public faces for such an effort stuck to “no taxation without representation” rhetoric and emphasized the election fraud constitutes just that.

    • IRS too powerful to resist. They can take your home, take your bank account. The original Tea Partiers didn’t have to worry about electronic funds transfers. Better to go underground.

      • IRS is probably easiest to deal with actually. Just keep filing deferments, you can play that game for quite some time and it amounts to same thing as a tax revolt without inviting the hammer. Also, if millions are doing it they can’t actually bring the hammer. The logistics alone never mind the blow back would make it impossible. I’d expect them to do the usual tyrannical thing , try to cow the masses by making a select few public executions so to speak. If the effort was organized it would simple to support those few would be public victims.

  3. The left WANTS a panic. They want trust in our system ended. Makes it easier to destroy what is and replace it with what THEY want. A system THEY totally control and which benefits THEM. Not everything is simple but understanding the motivations of the left IS easy. They want total power and control. And they will do literally ANYTHING to achieve that goal.

    • This site needs a moderator. Not to censor offensive comments, but to censor mind numbingly predictable comments. My conspiracy theory is that many commenters here are trying to sink this site with deliberate mundanity.

  4. The jews are laughing all the way to the temple. The good goyim cattle are still voting, watching blackball and putting what;s left of their money in a bank. Wearing their obediance masks, shuffling around like old drunk losers. Oy, veh!, Our protocols are working!

  5. as a therapist, I am shocked at the massive delusions that peopled carry about what is happening. And what is weird, they are all original to the person. THey are like Frankenstein’s – a motley collection of ideas that make sense to them. I am also shocked by the obdurate nature with which people hold them, and the flimsiness of the evidence they use to support them.

  6. The michigan hearings are hilarious. Sure lots of fraud but also tons of nice white ladies that are shocked that blacks being blacks trying to run something and failing is indistinguishable from fraud.

  7. My fellow Americanus Rightwingus: Do not, do not focus on the Capitol, or any attempt to do anything but write it off.
    In our Federation the Capitol is simply the most important level of government among literally tens of thousands.
    In our Federation the Republic is mirrored every time you have a legislative, Judicial and Executive Branch, elections, and your own intrinsic force. If your city has alderman, Judges and a Mayor and your own police force you mirror the Republic.
    This is important, because DC is simply one rotten node in the Federation, and their writ can go no farther than they find either compliance bought or bullied – or believed – or enforced.
    And they cannot enforce their writ beyond Federal Buildings, as we saw in 2020. I don’t think the Pretender or his fetching Bindi Companion will get even that, they certainly won’t get the Army out plugging for them.
    Let them drink the Chalice they poisoned to the Dregs.
    You may have DC. We’ll take the Continent and the country, thank you. To each his own ~ literally.

    • Oh LOL. No evidence. Barr was very cagey, “The Justice Dept and FBI have found no evidence of widespread fraud.”
      It’s amazing what you won’t find if you’re looking at it and deny that it exists.
      I’ve been looking at the evidence in the sworn affidavits on court listener and it’s massive.
      Comprehensive Fraud. Massive. In your face.

      Barr is Trump’s John Dean, the inside Lawyer who sets up and betrays the Boss. He’s the one Pro the DS fielded into this entire mess. The rest were hysterical amateurs.

      My fellow Americans will you at last give up the Cult of Law?

  8. OT, except in the broadest sense. Hey Zman, what do you think of Peter Turchin’s Age of Discord? As a math-oriented guy who appreciates history, you propabably have some insight into this guy’s cliodynamics. Does his math just fit the narrative; or is it legit but prone to bias in the choice of input data?

  9. Ah, but the French too had a vacillating Executive – Louis XVI.

    As do we. Trump.

    The Pretender’s handlers will not vacillate but their more Draconian orders will not be enforced, indeed challenged outside DC.

  10. “In times when the foundations of the system lose credibility, no one can trust anything in the system.”

    The Z man’s important observation here makes me think of another dimension to this disaster. At the same time we are all bombarded with these manufactured crises and breathtaking lies, all that at one time inspired us is disappearing. Appreciate the beauty of the natural world and mankind’s technical innovation? No, you have to focus on the deadly “global warming”. Were you once inspired by athletic greatness and want to watch spectator sports? Sure, but you’ve got to agree to BLM propaganda. Are you inspired by architecture? Well, it now no longer has any inspirational appeal. Music? Admittedly I say this as an older person, but pop music seems to be nothing but negroes “rapping” about ho’s and murder. Inspired by religion/spirituality? That’s been deconstructed for generations now. Dream of travel to exotic locations? COVID will kill you. Excited about a promising future career? Might be problematic if you are a white male.
    Whatever force it is behind the dizzying fabric of lies we are forced to live with, have also been actively destroying everything that once inspired us.

    • The vitriol spewed at Melania on YT because she dares to put up Christmas trees at the White House when ‘there are people going hungry’ is the example du jour. None of us are allowed to enjoy or appreciate anything of beauty or tradition until we’re all the same level of miserable.

  11. It’s better to have a lack of trust where trust is unwarranted (as it has been for a while) than to have unwarranted trust.

  12. “Looking back at the French and Russian revolutions, there were points when the ruling class could have restored some trust in themselves and the system. They had opportunities to change the dynamic and bring people back into a political process they could trust. They failed to do so, often choosing a path that further eroded what little trust the people had in them. We’re seeing similar failures today, as the ruling class carries on as if nothing is happening outside their mansions.”

    Prior to French and Russian revolutions, ruling class was autocratic. Political power was limited to very small number of people (monarchy, retainers), 500 or so people in Russia, maybe more in France. Educated and wealthy UMC chafed at being outside political system. French and Russian monarchs periodically attempted to reform government and law to allow representation to outside groups. Reform efforts were stymied by retainers as any change to the existing system threatened retainer power. The UMC outside the political systems were the people that became the revolutionaries. They justify their revolutionary action as being conducted on the part of the people (peasants, farmers, proletariat etc) but the people have little agency and ultimately end up as tools of both sides in the revolutionary conflict. Interesting to consider why the people have little agency. Historically they were illiterate, had little money or connection to powerful people, were religious and typically culturally conservative.

    So, what are the parallels to our situation? Our autocracy are maybe our political dynasties: Kennedys, Bushes, Clintons and now Bidens. Their retainers are top echelon of deep state, court, Wall St and Silicon Valley, media, universities and NGOs. Our revolutionaries are the billionaires operating outside the system (Soros). The people are the huge bulk of US citizens. Dissidents such as ourselves, while well informed, lack the money and connections to make change inside or outside the existing system at this time. We are probably closer to the people than any of the other categories above.

  13. The new rumors and claims are a bit nutty, 

    Wait. So you are telling me there was NOT actually a shootout at a server farm in Germany where the CIA director was killed? Well I’ll be damned!

    • The alleged shootout is separate from the subsequent claims about the Haspel harridan and her alleged passing. They may have been floated to muddy the waters.

      Look, either election fraud happened or it didn’t. There is no in between. Certitude, absent. Vigilance, suggested.

  14. Dissolved trust at the local level certainly foments panic among the thinking, producing citizen. But panic’s antonyms, assurance / confidence, apply to the Orcs and Leftists. And they appear to be gaining. They gain confidence in their system (communism) as our “real” world comes apart.
    Somewhere in that valley between is where we Whites will stand. It’s the fight to get there that is knocking at all of our doors.

  15. The GOP legislators have time to step up and send Trump electors or deny Biden his electors. If they step up, then vote GOP in GA. If they don’t, then what’s the point.

    • Not holding my breath. In this State—pretty much evenly divided between Rep’s and Dem’s—the House and Senate Rep’s have about a 1 seat majority. This is never enough. Been 20 years now and if the Dem’s hold solid on just about any issue, like the budget, there are *always* 2-3 Rep’s who will side with them. I suspect the traitorous, spineless Rep’s here are little different than over there. Dem’s maintain Party discipline, the Rep’s rarely do—guess who’s winning?

  16. “One of the many interesting things about the Bolshevik Resolution is the parallels between it and the French Revolution. Lenin was supposedly a student of the latter, so the lessons of it informed his decisions. Whether this is true or not is like so much else about our history. No one can say for sure now.

    Russian revolutionaries saw the French revolution as a failure to create permanent political change (i.e., inability to prevent reactionary elements from restoring monarchy). Similarly they were aware of failure of 1848 revolutionary movements across Europe and also failure of Russian revolution of 1905. Lenin, Stalin and many others had had failed to overthrown Russian monarchy for 20 years prior to 2018. Conscious of these failures, when Communist leaders finally seized power they treated political opponents (external and intra-party) harshly to suppress reactionary elements that had stopped previous revolutions. We tend to attribute outcomes to individuals, but lessons of the past relating to revolutionary failure encouraged all revolutionary leaders to harshly consolidate political power after over throwing the existing political system. For more information read Simon Montefiore’s The Romanovs.

  17. There is no trust between ‘mainstream’ and us, there is no common frame or beliefs. There is no visible way in which any of these could be restored. What then but to part ways, or one must conquer the other.

  18. The Georgia senate runoffs offer a good opportunity to illustrate why we’re stuck, politically speaking, with a craven and feckless GOP. I’m certainly no fan of the GOP establishment, but I’ll be encouraging my family (all in Georgia) to vote Republican in both races, entirely because the prospect of a democrat controlled Congress risks cementing political obstacles that will prove impossible to fix later. Make no mistake, a democrat-controlled Congress will seek to ensure that a Trump-like figure never rises again, actually … that no opposition of any form rises again, and that will include not just court-packing, but DC statehood and a whole host of other nutty ideas. And the depressing thing is the GOP leadership knows that, and knows that being anti-democrat will be enough to motivate enough voters to come out for their candidates. And if I lived in Georgia, I’d hold my nose and vote for that ridiculous woman senator, sentiment which the GOP leadership is happy enough to cynically exploit.

    • “…a democrat-controlled Congress…”

      Based on breaking news in re ownership of Dominion, makes that “…a Chinese controlled Congress…”

      The situation is MUCH WORSE than we all thought.

        • Gee, I didn’t know it was pick your occupier week.

          How about we raise our eyes higher, and look to a future where all the 5th Columnists are driven out, instead of replaced.

          Eh, ‘Member’?

        • Israel is China’s second largest arms provider. In 2013 their MoD resigned after it turned out that he sold sensitive US military tech to the Chinese.

          • But Israel is our greatest ally. They are a democracy amidst despotic Arab states that want to destroy them. The cradle of judeo-christian values.
            God stands by those that stand by Israel. Just ask Trump.

    • With respect, I could not disagree more strongly. This is the hill on which the GOP either stands and fights or dies. It is within the power of the GOP establishment to stop the theft of this election, either in the state legislatures of PA,GA, MI, WI, AZ, and NV or in the House of Representative. If the party establishment fails act then it deserves to go the way of the Whigs.

      I’m a lifelong Republican voter, albeit frequently holding my nose and voting for the GOPe candidate because he/she was the least bad option. If the GOP stands by and allows this election to be stolen I will never vote GOP again. Better to have Democrats in office and accelerate the decline.

    • The only thing voting will do is deny them legitimacy when they steal it anyway. This is not insignificant but voting accomplishes nothing in of itself.
      Short version: NO, your vote DOESN’T COUNT…but at least this way you’ll admit it at last.
      Once we can admit our vote doesn’t count, and the laws do not apply except as lash upon our backs we can perhaps begin to solve the problem. Not by voting.

  19. Yes, the phenomenon described, using historical references, is, indeed, what’s going on today. All the human elements are the same throughout history. Only the technology changes. Modern media, including social media, is a force multiplier.

        • Hey hotshot, we’ll see now soon enough. I imagine you conducted a better investigation than our, cough, law enforcement agencies.

          You must be one smart person. Or a chinese national with good grammar.

          • actually a couple of deep state agents threw some bait for white nationalists to waste time chasing after, the same white nationalists who acted high and mighty when leftists believed russiagate conspiracy.
            seeing how china is militarily allied with iran i’m inclined to believe the people in charge are prepping a new gen of moronic whites to go on a new excursion TO SAVE DEMOCRACY.

        • Read “Hidden Hand” by Clive Hamilton. Chinese play the LONG game. Always have.

          The Biden family is exceptionally terrible at this.

  20. “So a high-ranking Republican in Georgia signed a contract with dominion that DIDN’T include the right to audit the software.” — Scott Adams

    …And these are (our) republicans! How can I do anything but laugh?

    • The failure was in using any system with proprietary software. We knew this in the department 20 years ago. The Black Hat types out there would have spotted and reported on any holes to be found long ago. That’s what they revel in. It’s their claim to status among peers.

    • For the 4 mins I could stand it I listened to Mark Steyn on Rush Limbaugh today. He found all this talk about voting fraud statistics so dry. He wanted to talk about the clogged toilet in GA [the only plumbing issue that night in GA].

      Software? passwords and logins in cleartext, the server domain names in china, belgrade, iran? that’s so dry.
      So boring.
      Let’s make clogged toilet jokes, etc.
      Boomers don’t do compooters and the GOP isn’t where talented right leaning folks go. We go into business, or the military, or yes perhaps the police, etc. Our side are morons. FFS the software has been flagged by Dems since 2006 and Stacey Abrams sued GA over it…this happens to be the standing for the current suit by Powell.
      Our side are phonies and Brony’s.

      The nerds and the men with balls, even if they are wearing dresses are with the dems. Pathetic.

  21. Actually, the Panic of 1873 was caused, in large part, by the Great Epizootic of 1872. During that year almost every horse in the US was infected with equine influenza. While not fatal, these horses were too sick to work and business in the country ground to a standstill. Groceries and beer couldn’t be delivered, fields weren’t plowed, fire engines couldn’t leave the station. Imagine if today no truck or tractor could be operational.

    • The truckers have been promising a nationwide strike since the so-called “election”, I have not heard much about that lately though. Imagine for a second a few hundred tractor-trailers blocking all traffic around the beltway, nobody going in or out.

  22. The macro and the micro. In a big picture sense, loss of societal trust breeds anxiety and awakens extreme amygdalin behaviors (fight or flight). And panic is just group hysteria, such as toilet paper hording and bank runs. At the individual level, some people whine for help, some people become preppers, and some people roll up their sleeves. At the root, prolonged affluence has made us soft and stupid, hence DC is a distillation of that dysfunction. The least painful solution to this vicious cycle of debasement is Simple, Secret, Solo, and Spontaneous. You can’t negotiate with a cancer cell. Ancient wisdom.

  23. When a plandemic destroys a multitude of small business, enriching techno oligarchs, people start to get a bit suspicious, especially when the meter on the deathometer stays stuck on the same average number.

    People with critical thinking skills will prepare for what comes next, distancing themselves from the people tweeting hieroglyphs of the sound of their feelings on the surveillance tool of social media.

    The kakistocracy lacks the IQ to win this one.

    • “…surveillance tool of social media.” I’m definitely using that line on normies. You get to easily share photos of your kids/vacations, and reconnect with old high school friends. The government and big tech get intelligence on everything about you.

      • They haven’t won yet. A lot can happen between now and the inauguration.

        I’m enjoying the contact high from the pleasure Sidney Powell is sublimating from the pain she’s inflicting on the lefties. At least there’s that.

        • This is true. Pain is being inflicted on them, legitimacy is being stripped away…really strip mined away.
          That in itself accomplishes nothing: their problem is they are then revealed as dumb frauds ..and they’ll regret getting DC this way.
          Conversely since he can’t action the fraud, at least Trump for his 3d act exposes them to the world.

  24. Hearing the rumors on the server raid in Germany and the current whereabouts of Gina Haspel, I have no idea what to believe. I do know that the election story the mainstream media wants me to believe is the least likely I’ve heard. I talk to other similarly minded people at the gym in actual meatspace – they too are trouble because nothing is believable and they are tired of being lied to.

    • It’s like crack, isn’t it? First the “Watermarked ballots”, then the “20,000 deputized poll workers”, the “Server Raid”, and now the “Blue-on-Blue/CIA director killed Server Raid”!!!!!!!

      Give me more, more, MORE!! It’s like a Call of Duty video game. Always another layer to the onion. Man, the Democratic Party is insanely competent and terrifyingly embedded everywhere!!

      It’s also stupid escapism. Hitting the gym every day and connecting with real people is a heck of a lot more productive than constantly hitting “refresh” at rumor central.

  25. The rumors on the server raid in Germany and Gina Haspel’s current whereabouts now sound like a Tom Clancy or Robert Ludlum novel. I have no idea what to believe, but I know the election story the mainstream trying to force feed me is the least likely scenario. The FBI, DOJ, CIA and just about every other government institution has discredited themselves. Wild times.

  26. It seems that the Left has trusted the system as long as they have controlled and could redefine it, which has been a long time. “The system”, by their definition, is what they claim it is at any given moment. So under the pretext of legitimacy, the Left has been able to arbitrarily assert its will. Yes, there have been speed bumps here and there but mostly the Left has proceeded unabated.
    What has changed is the Right has caught onto the grift. The events leading up to November 3, and the obviously fraudulent nature of the election, has stripped away any illusion of “muh Constitution” and faith in the system for the Right. Yes, it took a 2X4 to the head, but it has happened.
    So we have arrived at the point where the State controls perhaps a majority of the people against their will. Things can sputter along a while, and will, but probably not too long. It is likely “Biden” will attempt to impose a CAMP OF THE SAINTS solution to dilute the power of his outraged purported constituents, but this will be fought tooth and nail at the local level. I would advise “Biden” to throw filthy lucre at us and leave people alone, but the less rational in his camp won’t have it.
    The rest of the world is watching and is either afraid or laughing or perhaps both. There is a new shadow government in town, unorganized and ineffective for a bit, but ultimately that will be the center of power.

    • the obviously fraudulent nature of the election, has stripped away any illusion of “muh Constitution” and faith in the system for the Right. Yes, it took a 2X4 to the head, but it has happened.


  27. Very timely article.
    The reason I said that was, this morning, the rumor mill had it ,Gina Haspell was killed in a fire fight in Germany over an election server. The server was at a CIA facility. The Army special forces (aligned with Trump) went to seize the server as it was being used to flip votes from Trump to Biden. A firefight ensued and US army troops were killed.
    Everything is going to be revealed and Trump is going to win the election. The conspirators will be arrested and sent to Gitmo. Trust the plan.
    It’s like Q.
    All this isn’t helping our side at all. It’s obvious disinformation sent to pacify patriots, and it’s more than likely done by establishment figures who know how dangerous armed “dirt people” can be. Heaven forbid if the dirt people get organized. Of course we’re demoralized and we want to believe, that is why these rumors are so effective.

    • I just commented on those rumors – they’d all go away if Haspell just strolled down the street and into the the front door of the CIA building, but that apparently hasn’t happened for a while.

    • Right up there with the rumored 20,000+ current and ex military poll watchers who are part of a giant sting operation that has been planned for the last 2 years. And watermarks. Or something. It’s just nuts.

      I like Trump, but the guy isn’t exactly hyper-effective (wall, DACA expulsion, troop withdrawls, etc.). But somehow, on this? Nah.

      Ben Franklin comes to mind. “Three people can keep a secret, if two of them are dead.”

      “Deus Ex Machina” is a classical Greek play writing technique. Basically, the story ends with loose ends that need tidying up..a god appears from nowhere and declares them tied up, because [reasons, having nothing to do with the plot]. It’s considered poor storytelling today.

      So a “deus ex machina” is what you’re seeing now; people don’t want to accept what happened, so they’re clutching at crazy retcon plots and conspiracies that would have sounded literally insane a month ago.

    • Yes, memetic warfare is actively being used to diffuse anger among the plebs by creating an illusion of push-back and the seeds of hope. It’s purpose is to mitigate potential episodes of going postal that could further erode the legitimacy of the State. And Jackboots are especially good at dong two things, herding docile cows and ganging up on the macho malcontents. Don’t be a target. Go dark and stay under the radar.

  28. “…tens of millions of American are moving from a mode where they think the government has bad elements to a mode where the suspect the government itself is the bad element….”

    At this point, it’s hard to believe that anyone other than the most naive who are outside The Beltway System Inc., would not just ‘suspect’ the government itself is the bad element, but would be absolutely convinced that is the case. Furthermore, those inside the System must also know it’s corrupt, but are so invested in it that they’re highly motivated to perpetuate the scheme at any & all costs.

    • The Left adopted the tactic of “by any means necessary” as evidenced by the massive voter and election fraud just now perpetrated. That has to become a two-way street or we deserve the fate that they have in store for us.

      • Too many roadblocks for a two-way street. Pussy Repub politicians, too many Civnats, no media cover. Even if the Repubs could be pressured into cheating, our base is in small towns that make the kind of big city ballot stuffing impossible. The only solution I see is targeted violence (Comey, Brennan, Clapper, local ballot officials, etc. should need witness protection), but as a Christian I have a hard time advocating it.

      • Hi Zman this is the wrong thread on which to ask but I was watching Startrek TOS yesterday and it was one of those episodes in which the “Prime Directive” of non-interference was a major plot device. In some episodes the PD seems to be a mere suggestion or guideline but in this one it seemed like a violation merited capital punishment. Se2 #23 The Omega Glory.

        Your take on this doctrine of non-interference finding it’s way into popular culture when it did would be interesting. Jhm suggestion. Anon

  29. Of course that is the intent, Z-Man.
    The 2020 shitshow is part of a plan by the Deep State Govt and Outside Force (i.e globalists/Reds/CCP) to collapse the western order. They will do everything they can to sow distrust.
    Introduce strangers into your community
    publish damnable lies in the media
    censor the truth on social media
    prevent law enforcement form arresting criminals
    Pronounce the season’s flu as a great pandemic
    Steal an election
    Trust is gone. They are daring us to take them on. They may get their wish. Time will tell

    • What’s the end goal? After the collapse.

      But I do agree that they’re egging us on, or testing our reaction. Something is strange right now and I feel like a Guinea Pig.

      Ie. Many governors and mayors have been caught blatantly breaking their own lockdown rules. To me they’re fishing to see how people react, I don’t think they could be that stupid if they were actually trying to make people avoid the virus.

      • The goal after collapse is to rebuild society that conforms to intersectional neoliberalism. This is the only acceptable model. When antifa and BLM get too uppity, they will snuff them out like they did the alt right.

        • Yes, Build Back Better. The Great Reset. The little cartoon Kamala narrated about equity. They’re very open about what they want.

          • That cartoon was just advertising. There is nothing in Harris’ history that suggest she cares about anything but herself.

          • She is Pogo’s “Schmoo”. She’ll be whatever the beholder wants her to be. She’d happily have people lined up and shot if it gets her to the top of the greasy pole. And Lord knows, she’s an expert on greasy poles.

      • In a caste system the elite enforce a set of onerous rules on the lower castes, but not on themselves. It’s one of many ways they indulge their power hunger, while conveniently reminding the lower castes that they are powerless.

      • Many governors and mayors have been caught blatantly breaking their own lockdown rules.

        This has been one of the most underplayed hands in my arsenal, to be honest. It is very effective to point out to people, who trust our ‘leaders’, that perhaps it is only appropriate to believe there is a crisis when the leaders start acting like it.

        I have lost count of the number of health officials and ministers in Europe who have been caught ‘with the mask down’ , so to speak, not practicing what they preach. The dastardly wankers.

      • End goal is world-wide flattening (except for elites) to produce “equality”. Format is UN Agenda 2030 and WEF goals. US and Trump are major speed bump slow downs that must be removed.

      • TPTB are not that bright, but very venal, clever and self-important. The goal is largely the journey itself. In a world where even actual profit-making enterprises can barely see past the next quarter, the objective is not some point in the foggy future. The point is to be the hero in the present morality play, as the players strut about in their virtuous robes. The goal is to stamp out crimethink; there need not be a glorious future. Just a supremely woke present.

      • B125, IMO the governors and mayors are not fishing to see how people react, they are instead aping the behaviors of their “superiors”, as a sort of audition for membership in the club of elites. The politicians, the actors, and the media are all transactional grifters, and all seek to transact their way into the good graces of their elite overlords. The open snark to the rest of us is part of the audition.

    • The Elvis thing is starting to crack me up. I hadn’t thought of it until ppl started going crazy over it. Now I think it should be made into a campaign song lol

  30. Talk about synchronicity.. I was thinking very much along the same lines, how the public trust is waning… then I though what if the COVID vaccines turn out to be either fakes or to have serious side effects… that would really kill any remaining trust there might be left…

    PS: A fake vaccin would be a vaccin that does not really help at all. Either through vaccination effects being worse than covid effects (for most people) and/or because it only prevents mild cases which would not be deadly anyhow. I.e does not reduce the body count.

    • Draconian measures by the private and public sectors in enforcing receiving the vaccine will further the paranoia and distrust, and who can blame them? The trust will collapse regardless of effectiveness.
      From the looks of trials, the vaccine will probably be moderately useful for the COVID-19 strain, only to be useless for future Coronavirus strains, like the flu vaccine.

      • Most likely. And there is also the aspect of folks simply not getting the vaccine. CDC stat’s on flu vaccine effectiveness *average* 50% or a bit less across the decades due to strain mutation and simple neglect to vaccinate. The current COVID-19 virus has a couple of identified strains at last I saw, but the vaccine makers claim this is *not* important as they use other “parts” of the virus (whatever that means—there’s that trust issue again).

        The importance of the new Covid-19 vaccines will be 1) to enrich pharmaceutical companies, and 2) to give the government an excuse to pretend the epidemic is past us and drop it from the news cycle. Future cases will be handled as flu cases are handled now and the COVID-19 death occurrences accepted as are the flu deaths now.

        Should someone bring up COVID-19 deaths in the future, they will simply be passed off as the victim’s problem for not getting a shot, or that the victim was one of the small percentage that the shot did not work for. In short, the same as we hear for flu deaths today.

    • The vaccine is going to be the next major front in the public-private tyranny war. The government won’t have to roll out health passports because they’re going to get private companies to do it for them. Want to fly? Want to attend a concert? Want to set foot in your bank? Show us your papers. And the “muh private enterprise!” wing of Con Inc. will back this 100%.

      • Want to fly?

        Heh. Not particularly. Cramped seating, masks, fat stewardesses (and homoseckshalls). Treated like a criminal by mystery meat border enforcement.

        Want to attend a concert?

        Heh. Not particularly. Leftwing sympathies/ Globalist shill band members. Lecturing the audience. Boring me with new material when I just want to hear the classics. Extortionate ticket prices.

        Want to set foot in your bank?

        Heh. Actually, yes. You may have a point there, old son.

      • KGB: I don’t want to fly (not out of fear, but, out of distaste for the awfulness), I don’t want to attend a concert and prefer never to enter a bank branch, so, I’m good to go.

      • Don’t worry, our local Mexican document forgers will soon be selling “COVID passports” for $20 bucks. The fake IDs my kids got years ago for $75 bucks each were works of art.

    • The so-called vaccines will “mostly work” because the Wuflu itself is mostly fake. Now they are backtracking already, saying that the vaccine will “reduce symptoms” but may not inhibit transmission (gotta keep those masks on, keep distancing, and keep staying at home, forever).

      • TPTB and goodwhites will never let this virtue signaling witch trial hysteria go. Five years from now we will still be hearing about why masks are more important than ever.

        • People stopped listening to the climate scam. The COVID scam is an excellent replacement, especially for a selfish, atheist, and aging society that is generally terrified of death.

    • Was there ever a time you COULD trust the gov’t…?

      Wrong question, sir. The correct question is:

      Was there ever a time when the government consisted of reasonable, competent white men who didn’t believe that there were 1,838 different genders?
      We have entered quite the period of wokist lunacy. Whilst I think times are going to get tougher for YT, I do think that being so far removed from reality has costs that will make themselves known. Hopefully sooner rather than later.

      • The whole point is that government is always corrupted by the sorts of people who like to control and exploit others. The goal of the Founding Fathers was not “better” government, but “less” government, and government devolved down and answerable to the locals. George Washington was celebrated, at the time, because he was not a “typical” government functionary, and wasn’t particularly interested in milking the government cow.

        • Washington was a remarkable man, and the country was luckier still that it was run by a group of men who understood what they had in him and deferred to his strengths.

  31. Also, I should say that getting people to distrust one’s own sensory faculties is an even more insidious campaign. And it always tickles me to think how our rulers somehow believe they are themselves immune to this.

  32. Everywhere we have looked since Trump is one event after another filled with obvious corruption than no one in the system does anything about. Russian collusion, Ukraine bullshit, Kavanaugh bullshit, BLM riots, Antifa riots, attacks on statues….Now election bullshit and more anti white bullshit incoming.
    No one in any institution seems to be able to step forward and give an answer on any of it nor could they stop any of it at the time it was happening.
    So many of us are beginning to think like Joe DiGenova. Let’s start drawing and quartering.
    Lets wait for that guy.
    Why vote? Nothing changes in our current system.

    • These days keep remembering how my Dad’s Cuban business partners reacted to Pinochet…summed up: “boy we wish we had that guy instead of Batista”

  33. “The fear is driven by the sense that nothing can be trusted, even one’s own assessment of events.”

    That latter clause gets me every time I’m conversing with my ex-military buddies still clinging to Constitution and political reform. I respect those guys so I circle back to my “assessment of events”. But my reassessments run headlong into demographic reality, the governmental mafia, catastrophic failure of institutions (from academia to churches), the massive decline in productive capacity, and the ongoing cultural tornado. The reassessments are further refined by historical parallels, cataclysmic failures of the GOP to reform New Deal and Great Society programs, and of course Occam’s Razor.

    Then you do some word-definitions, as Z-man recently did with that misunderstood word – fascism. You do the obligatory etymology – see what the word has meant throughout history – and then take a clear-eyed view (i.e. gyno-fascism) of 21st century America. And you find that assessment is correct … even after a glass of whiskey … even after a good night’s sleep.

    I may occasionally distrust my own assessment of events, but it certainly doesn’t run me into the arms of civic nationalists who think we can still vote and/or reform our way out of this.

      • It’s hard for boomercons to admit that their whole life has basically been a lie. Boomers still don’t understand why Tyrone and Rajesh hate them even though they’re nice to them, and even invites them over to watch football. For young people like myself it’s easier.

        However I’m seeing more old guys who are “woke” now, still rare but some white guys just have a twinkle in their eye and that’s how I know they might “know” a bit more than they’re supposed to… I’ve often wondered if i have the same twinkle.

        • B125: That “twinkle in the eye” of which you write is the sign of a fully functioning BS detector.

          • I suppose the BS is so thick that the detector would be permanently beeping.

            I was in a highway rest stop. There was an attractive and well dressed white family. 60-something man and some kids in their late 20s and bfs/gfs. The old man had the strongest twinkle I’d ever seen. He looked straight at me and I saw right into his almost clear blue eyes. He was smiling without really moving his face. I probably was too.

            I don’t believe something like this is an accident, there ARE people out there who *know*. We can find each other.

        • As a boomer (hate generation labels), I look at almost every younger family member as relatively clueless as to what has transpired over the years and where we are today. Myself, son, and grandson feel like an island of reality in a crowd of people daydreaming with MSNBC droning in the background.

          • That’s a start. Hopefully your son some day will be writing about his son(s) and grandson(s) being on the right track.

          • That’s why Community is so important…You have no idea just how much inspiration and encouragement comes from sitting in a room full of guys and gals who believe like you do and want to same things for your Community and will fight for it as well…

    • Derbyshire one time said something along the lines of, “It’s remarkable how long we keep believing something even after we stop believing it.” I take it to mean the modes of thought and the mental tools for analyzing events remain unchanged even after we understand they are insufficient.

    • “the obviously fraudulent nature of the election, has stripped away any illusion of “muh Constitution” and faith in the system for the Right.”


  34. America appears to be in one of those moments when the people are suddenly thrust into a world in which they can no longer trust anything. The extraordinary events of the last election have caused tens of millions to question the system itself. 

    I think the mainstream Left trusts the system. They own it, after all. They may sputter about systemic racism, but they have faith it’ll purge the bad elements because of the arc of history etc. etc.
    The mainstream right has quibbles with it, but they still believe in “voting harder, praying harder” next time round, as Z says. Most normiecons think we’re in a bad spot but are hopeful America will prevail, if we have enough good judges and enough big flags on our houses.
    So it’s really just the dissidents on left and right who think the system is hopelessly broken. Is it tens of millions? Probably not. Z may be suggesting that the tens of millions of normiecons are open to our brain zapping, and he may be right. But I don’t think that 7 out of 10 normal Republican voters will ever think “democracy” and “liberalism” are bad words.

  35. Thanks, Mr. Z-Man. Now I’ll have Elvis crooning in my head all day… “We can’t go on together…”

  36. This brings to mind William James’s “Will to Believe” in which some propositions require belief before any evidence can be revealed for or against that proposition. The primary example used in that work relates to train car robberies. If everyone in the train believed first that all or most of the passengers would assist each other in thwarting the train robbers, then train robberies would cease to occur. But one can only believe such a thing if he reasonably believes in the system of mutual trust that underpins it.

    Nowadays, you cannot trust even your neighbor, for it is likely that you don’t know him well or that he has nothing in common with you, and hence you cannot know whether he shares any common goal with you.

    The erosion of public trust is the basis for the erosion of trust in institutions. Many Americans, despite knowing that such institutions are rife with corruption, still believe that they are “by the people.” If one doesn’t trust “the people” then his distrust of the relevant institutions will extend beyond that of the bad actors that occupy their respective offices.

    • To some extent that has happened with plane hijackings, at least in the US/Europe. After 9/11, what passenger is going to believe that if they just comply with the hijackers’ demands all will be well?

  37. Driving along the other day, it suddenly occurred to me that there was nothing left to place trust in. Organized religion? Sorry, that ship sailed off into politically correct waters decades ago. The medical/industrial complex has become arrogant and intrusive…and expensive. Fat, stupid nurses are not an encouraging sign. I wrote off education back in the eighties when I saw what government involvement was leading to. We all understand modern media and the fanatical Media Class that runs it. The military has become a catch basin for estrogen run amok and perverts in need of a support group. Bureaucracy is nothing more than a waiting game for the prize of early retirement. And politicians are viewed as the chess pieces of billionaires. Sane persons, when they are not wearing a mask, are asking questions.

    I’ve fallen back on my own internal resources to cope with this. More and more people I speak with are having similar issues. As the poet wrote, “the center cannot hold”. I have no idea where the center is.

    • You can trust:
      Dissident podcasts, videos, & alt-media, alt-Christians, books written before 1980, hopefully all your friends, and some family. Yeah, that stuff isn’t exactly blaring through your television screen, but I think our situation is far better than what the dissident Soviets did, for example. They only had samizdat and maybe some comrades they happened upon. There are a lot of alt-media sites popping up (and older ones getting stronger like Gab and BitChute) and communities are fairly easy to find if you know where to look. And all the J-lawyers in the world can’t stop it.

      • Marko,
        It is good to point out the positive. Optimism is Hope’s cousin. We also need to realize it will take time to build things we can believe in and people we can trust. We don’t expect a white knight to come in and save Our people and we certainly shouldn’t expect trusted institutions and people to spring up overnight.

        Community is the starting point in the long struggle. Physical locations and interpersonal relationships will take time to establish and we must begin now.

      • “Nothing in this world can you trust. Not gods, not men, not beasts…[points at sword] *This* you can trust.” Where’s Conan’s dad when we need him?

          • He meant it as a metaphor for the outisde world , the Sword and the Riddle standing in for Yourself and Tribe and a warning that occasionally even your Tribe will turn on you but you can always trust yourself.
            Also in the Hyborian age there were absolutely zero high trust cultures, not one. You could trust almost no one as everyone was out to eat your lunch.
            This is what the future will be since its what the past was and while a man can learn from his mistakes, men never do.

    • This AM, I was listening to the local radio station that plays Xmas music for the next month – you know, to try to get into the spirit of the season or at least try to lift my spirit. In between sets, the two dj’s were laughing about some sort of survey regarding the new work habits of the remoters. Such as 6 of 10 (or some such) work in whatever they slept in, if not worse. Showering every few days, not wearing deodorant, makeup etc. It’s not freaking funny, it’s freaking outrageous that this is what our insane, evil overlords are doing to millions of people. They’re just sucking the dignity and life from us. Why there would be a modicum of trust in them or the system beggars belief. It’s up to us to not let it happen as best we can, but it’s a tough slog at times.

      • This is what disturbs me the most. Make us weaker, deprive us of socialization, reduce us to data. It’s a horrible, horrible travesty that should never be forgotten. It amounts to a concentrated attack on our personhood — completely antithetical to the spirit of the founding fathers.

        • So? Its not like they think they’ll ever be punished for it.
          Hell our side isn’t even adaptable enough to accept that its not our job to conserve an economy or so called free markets but to have a system that build families however that works.
          This is our job build a system which men and women can get married, have children and pass on our values. If this means taking on the entire narrative arc of progress over everything else so be it.
          So that there is clarity, its critical enough that if we had to choose between Economic Communism ala Khrushchev with a homogeneous population or the Economic Free Dumb we had before COVID much less now, we’d be better off Red.They had a TFR or 2.8 well above replacement and we have before COVID Whites here 1.6.

      • They want us atomized and alone so we are easier to control or slaughter… Problem is even on our side we are making it easy for them when we remain inactive…

        • I cannot and will not urge you to break the law but its on YOU , not the other guy to act in the manner you see fit.
          Now I am doing my part its even legal for now by telling you to harden up and get some ideas and by explaining the situation as best I understand it . Maybe its not enough but its something and it fits “right now, on this public forum.” and as my idiot governor likes to say it “meets the moment.”
          For the future? Magic 8 Ball is Hazy. Ask again in 6 weeks or so,
          Usually on the Right we like to tell folks to lead, follow or get out of the way but the truth is waiting on the other guys to lead is a fail state or if you like “You snooze you loose.”
          Lead however you can or get out of the way, don’t bother following till there is an actual leader.

          • Already being done here in my AO Brother I was speaking in general terms for people who just want to bitch online and that’s all they do…Like I said above when you are in a room with a 100 like minded men and women with another 50 that couldn’t make it then it gives you a boost and maybe more here need that so they don’t have such a doom and gloom outlook…

    • You say that like it’s a bad thing.

      Northern European whites have been entirely too trusting for generations – hell it may be their defining characteristic. That trust opens them up to a never ending series of confidence frauds.

      • Here’s the history of the last half century in one sentence.

        The characteristics that make White societies so successful- Honesty, openness, trust, forbearance etc make them vulnerable to those who do not share them.

        • Good summary, Bile. Those aspects of Our race are a blessing and curse. They’ve made us the most successful and dynamic race to ever walk the earth. When we tried to apply them with openness to the rest of humanity they became Our Achilles’ heel. Going forward we can only retain them if we keep in mind that they can only be applied inhouse. How to keep future generations of Whites from slipping into the past miscalculation that imparting these gifts is a good idea… that’s the million dollar question.

      • When prosperous we are the pugs of the human race, overbred for domesticity.
        However there is wolf under all that cheery smiles and fat too and not a hundred and half years ago were were happily murdering and conquering other groups.
        A coupe of hundred years ago some of our more feral people killed the entire Tasmanian aborigine population for sport. That cruelty is in all of us and harnessed for good use and combined with our big brains is a blessing.
        Jung called it Wotan and its hard to put down once its awake as the entirety of WW2 shows.
        We just need to decide to wake it up.

    • Certain churches are trustworthy but they are few and far between. The Southern Baptist Convention is totally controlled by Soros.

      The only people I trust are those that I’ve met organically at various places, and developed trust with over time. ie. church might be kind of cucked but you still might run into one of our guys there…

      • Forget the larger Catholic Church as well. Soros doesn’t need to control the Vatican as long as the attention whore Francis sits there surrounded by his pedophiles and homosexuals.

        • The Catholic Church will be fine once Francis is gone. This follows Zman’s examples of saving an institution by removing the head. And don’t believe all the media hyperventilating about pedo priests. The percentage of abuse in the Catholic Church is the same as any other church, and less than the general population of adult males. Not to excuse it, but let’s keep it in perspective.

          • Francis is an abomination but I do not think the Church is fundamentally fine. I know the number of pedophiles is an exaggerated weapon used by its enemies (public school have a higher percentage in this regard). However, it isn’t the number of pedophiles and homesexuals that is the problem, it is their placement in the ranks of the Church hierarchy and their coddling of them within the clergy. I disagree that simply removing the head will bring the desired necessary change… but then again I don’t think it’s necessary to burn it down. A reformation/purge led by the likes of Archbishop Vigano and bolstered by promoting a takeover by the Society of Saint Pius X are the only long term cures.

          • Yes, the “percentage of pedophiles/practicing homosexuals” is a cop-out. The Catholic Church has a long history of hiding this stuff in plain sight, and sending potentially imminently outed priests to new places, to prey on their new, unsuspecting flocks all over again.

      • The bible is so full of logical contradictions and physical impossibilities that it is easy for a charlatan to come along and use it to control the sheep.

    • As a recovering CivNat, the last two institutions I had trust in were the military and the police. Now I say go ahead and defund the police in the inner cities. My township is safe, and if yours is not you need to move. Second, the SJW generals and their tranny armies can go fight the Iranians and Russians all they want. May they both lose.

      • I would like to see an alternative arise for decent young white men seeking adventure and service beside becoming fodder for an empire that hates them.

          • Agreed. There are options. Militias have a mixed result. You have to sort through nutters and feds from the truly community minded. National Guard units as a possibility? The English “Gentleman’s Club” is the model that shows some potential. Social, economic, and cultural nexus with a military bent. At least as a starter. Look up the Calcutta Light Horse.

        • That must be incredibly trying for you to endure.

          For better or worse, I have lost all patience with supporters of mass immigration, antifa, and BLM. I can’t even pretend to tolerate them. They are unambiguously my enemy. They may as well be pointing a gun at me and I react accordingly.

          This has caused familial problems, which I regret but cannot repair.

          • “Defund the police, they are standing in our way” can also be interpreted as they are preventing law-abiding citizens from defending themselves and are just enforcers for the local politicians.

      • The military and the police, along with voting and political parties, and even contesting this current election, are all copes for people looking for an answer, and who are refusing to accept the one staring right at them. Which is, no one or nothing will save you, except for yourself and the people you surround yourself with, and choose to depend on. All the other stuff can “go your way” and the same is still true, even if the wolf is backed a bit away from the door for a moment.

    • The center is the tribe you build. A network of families who support each other and back each other against all outsiders.
      This is easier for Celts and Italians than the overestimated North and West Europeans but the instinct is there. No matter what a dark age is coming, if not in a few years or decades than a few hundred.
      Most people will die and most of what we did will be lost. The Horace Smith version of Ozymandius

      In Egypt’s sandy silence, all alone,

      Stands a gigantic Leg, which far off throws

      The only shadow that the Desert knows:—

      “I am great OZYMANDIAS,” saith the stone,

      “The King of Kings; this mighty City shows

      The wonders of my hand.”— The City’s gone,—

      Naught but the Leg remaining to disclose

      The site of this forgotten Babylon.

      We wonder,—and some Hunter may express

      Wonder like ours, when thro’ the wilderness

      Where London stood, holding the Wolf in chace,

      He meets some fragment huge, and stops to guess

      What powerful but unrecorded race

      Once dwelt in that annihilated place

      Best you can do, long run is preserve your tribe and make what’s good about the West part of your customs.
      In the short run, consider you might be able to take back your country by any means necessary and give ita century or so more.

      • You might want to read about the current situation in Italy or Ireland before you start rhapsodizing about the Italians and Irish. If it wasn’t for the “overestimated” Germanic tribes Western Europe would have suffered the fate of Ozymandius’ polity long ago.
        The Germanics tolerate the other tribes’ existence.
        Be grateful!

        • The Irish endure and the Italians once ruled the world. Neither is terrible. Neither is in a great state right now but no developed nation, even in China truly is.
          Now I’m Prussian by extraction on my fathers side. So yeah. I’ve got some scary people on that side, God bless em.

  38. So it will be a pyrrhic victory for Biden and team sedition then? Of course it is as it’s going to be a rough ride even with a corrupt media helping him. The HR department has taken over the country, what could go wrong with that?

    As in the Godfather, it is time to go to the mattresses.

    • Biden would be such an unmitigated disaster I wouldn’t feel terribly about him getting in. Not machiavellian enough to want it, but it would be good for us in the end.

  39. I’m definitely seeing a lot of people in comment sections “why vote?” but it actually happened live here in Georgia where the some Republican politico was talking about the importance of voting in the runoffs and someone got up in the audience and said “why. It’s obvious the election was stolen why should we vote ever again?” There was a lot of support among the plebs. And those ate the people that showed up to see that person talk. I think voter turn outs going to be really bad. It’s dogma and ritual falling away and something will have to fill it

    • The fact that the election was stolen means that it still matters.

      White peoples’ tendency to stomp off at the first set back needs to be added to their pathological altruism and pathological honesty as reasons for their current and declining state.

      You don’t concede a fight as soon as your opponent lands the first punch.

      • I think the problem that white voters in GA are having is that they know the democrats hate them and are their enemy, but they do not know if the republicans are on their side.

        • It doesn’t matter if the Republicans are on their side or not. What matters is defeating the Democommie party and it’s minions of POC’s, illegals, queers and anti Americans.
          Unless they want a big fat black woman with an IQ of 80 as governor of Georgia they best VOTE.

          • Yep.

            A lot of time in life, the lesser of two evils is our only option.

            Petulant whiteys will jump into a fire rather than only get some of what they want.

          • But if you believe in the uniparty theory, then it doesn’t matter who wins. I believe the anti white stuff is all talk, for now… with a Republican Senate they would “block it” – with a Dem Senate the people in control will just tell them to talk about it but eventually squash the bill. Reparations and explicit anti white laws are coming in a decade but not planned for right now.

          • That basically is where I am at this point. All respect to Hoagie, but the “lessor of two evils” is a game that has been played my entire life. It’s boring. More than once, the lessor of two evils has been elected and then gone on to fulfill none of the promises made in the election. When the next election came about, the game was restarted and we were told “this” election—with the right guy—would be the game changer, the most important ever. Wash, rinse, repeat.

            Some folks never catch wise. You can’t win, you can’t break even—and if they make (corrupt) voting mandatory—you can’t even quite the game. But since, at this junction, you can quit—that’s what I’m doing.

            Nothing less than a sweeping reform of the current corrupt voting/tabulation process will entice me back, and even that’s doubtful. Let them crow about their “mandate from heaven” with less than 50% of the eligible population partaking.

          • Yea but until you aren’t ruled by someone else voting for you then all your doing is surrending…You don’t want to build something else which I have advocated for either so your only power is to vote against that which wants to kill you and if you don’t well then enjoy your chains or your coffin…Sorry to be harsh but hard times are coming…

          • Then what does it mean that the Treasury Department held hearing for months this year on slavery “reparations”? Are you completely oblivious to the Great Reset, too?

          • You are ignorant. Refusing to vote for republi-frauds is what is needed to try to force them to actually represent us. As long as they can shit in your face and have you still vote for them, they will continue to do it..

            You are cowardly because you are terrified of things getting worse in the short term. You do not want to sacrifice for a couple of years to try to get the republi-frauds to actually earn our votes in 2022.

          • I have no connection to Georgia, but was completely thrilled when Big Mama Jama was defeated. And yet, here we are with shenanigans and I am having a hard time seeing how, when it really matters, there is any difference in the outcome. Maybe someone from there could at least reassure me its been worth it on the local level, but this has been a shit test for this line of thinking, and it has failed, respectfully. And I bought into that line of thinking for a long time.

          • And what have the repukes in GA done besides certify their fraudulent election without auditing the ballots…They did the exact same thing the fat black commie would have done..

          • Yes it does. Regular people are not leaders. More importantly part of being a Conservative is showing respect to and operating from lawful authority,
            For the Left, its all temporary alliances anyway and someone turning on you is no big deal. Its expected as you will be turning on them as needed and sucking up to each other as needed.
            Conservatives do not work this way and betrayal by your own leaders is a body blow.
            This means you need hyper vetted new leadership that you have to build and that means putting aside the good life your are struggling to build to fill in that gap. Its a huge imposition and a monsterous burden that the Leave Me Alone Jim’s that make up so much of our side hate.
            As for voting. At absolute most it slightly slows the rot, The real fact is Dominion who runs the voting machines is 75% Chinese owned and you can’t outvote that level of fraud.
            Unless the election is reversed or President Trump declares martial law YOU must go to war or live your life being a slave to China and the Left.
            As WRSA says no one is coming to save you.
            So stop ghost dancing and hoping you Constitution will save you. It won’t stop bullets and for all the good it does might as well be 200 year old toilet paper for all the good its doing.

          • And why would their vote against the fat black woman be assessed any more fairly than their vote for Donald Trump? What if the only intelligent response is to conclude that voting means absolutely nothing, because you can have no epistemological certainty that your vote was even recorded? Remember; they had elections in the Soviet Union, too.

        • I guess you could think of it this way – in this stage drama, the Dems are the heroes and the GOP the villains. Everyone knows its fake, but the crowds are supposed to cheer the hero, boo the villain. Even so, if the crowd boos the hero and cheers the villain (or at least votes for him) that sends a message to the actors, writers and directors.

        • One big problem is that by the time it gets to Dem v GOP (the general election) it is too late. More emphasis needs to be put on the primaries.

      • I think what people are mad about is that the Republicans are either indifferent, or in on the steal, as appears to be the case with Kemp and Raffensberger.

        I don’t believe that accelerationism is good; but at the same time, there’s no point voting for a party that won’t support your interests. If the options were either piss on my face (R) or shit on my face (D) I would just walk away and try something else, even though the piss is preferable to shit.

        • There have been traitors in every fight that mattered throughout human history,

          You don’t preemptively surrender* because some son of a bitch is willing to make a buck selling you out.

          *scratch that, if your a YT in America that’s exactly what you do.

      • Don’t concede, but more voting in a rigged election is stupid on steroids and only reinforces the practice of election fraud. If the people propagating the fraud start having terrible accidents, then you will restore a healthy society in which a corrective feedback mechanism allows a return to normalcy. To date, the only casualty of massive election fraud is the death of the rule of law. All’s fair now, so make it a two-way street.

        • TomA has a point. Voting in a rigged system simply validates the legitimacy of the corrupt system. Your options are limited to two choices.

          You may continue voting in order to accumulate greater evidence of corrupt elections with the goal of persuading greater numbers to demand change.

          Or you may abstain in large numbers but must create alternative attacks against TPTB. Simply not voting plays into the system’s status quo and relieves them from the necessity of having to even rig elections. Pressure must be applied to those in charge running an ever increasing gamut from civil disobedience and economic warfare up to the level of actual violence.

          Either way, everything must be ratcheted up. The two hurdles to either strategy is whether or not the populace will see you as a legitimate movement and what actions are TPTB willing to take to deal with you.

          • I’m for voting because the alternative is giving the opposition what they want without a fight. But it can’t stop there. Fraud and corruption must be revealed at all levels. Start declassifying documents now, while it it’s still possible, to reveal the crooks, murderers and grifters. Pardon Assange and Snowden. It’s got to be broken open and bared for all to see.

          • Agreed on the declassification, indictments, pardons, etc.. but those are all things we are waiting for, hoping for, wishing for… others to do FOR us. Vote/don’t vote, either way, we will get none of what we want for Our race if we do nothing and wait for others to rescue us. Either way you come down on the franchise question, we have to be willing to apply pressure in ever increasing amounts to achieve anything. By us and for us.

          • Exactly Right Brother…Over a hundred on board with more coming together every day so things are definitely looking good where I’m at…I hope others are having some success also wherever they are trying to do the same…

        • Bingo.
          The Dens and RINOs killed the rule of law in this election and pretty much made any response by the plebes okay.
          Should we continue to vote? Yes at least in local elections which do matter quite a lot. The last thing any of us want is the Demonrats getting into all those local seats where they can make life hell for us.

        • Why is it a choice of one or the other?

          Voting doesn’t cost anyone anything. So keep doing it. And do the other stuff too.

      • This is true, if it weren’t worth stealing the election they wouldn’t have stolen it. Massive, in your face Brute Force Hack on all fronts: software, paper, people.
        I’ve been reading the affidavits. Massive brute force attack, nothing subtle.
        The vote was beginning to count again, so they stole it.
        And they have, ok? Deal with it.

      • “White peoples’ tendency to stomp off at the first set back…”
        It would seem that your statement is based on your experiences with cowards – which I assure you, are in every race. I would caution you to not paint your prejudice with too broad a brush. Some of the most courageous in history were white folks, some of the most vicious, too. And with your bias, your likelihood of meeting one or the other could be a wake up call.

    • I hope turnout for that runoff is very low for our team – that would be a sign people reject the legitimacy of the process. Why vote when the first election was stolen and the GOP doesn’t care to do anything about it? It isn’t much of a leap from there to tacit approval of various alternatives to electoral politics. We’ll see.

      • Yep putting black commies in power will show them reps.

        except it won’t. They’re insulate from the damage that will be done – are you?

        Beyond that the narrative will be that even Georgia loves communism and rejects white identity politics – which is the exact opposite of the message you want to send.

        • There is a strategic component to all this, right? If our position really is that we aren’t going to vote our way out of this, as I have reliably been informed, then I think that means we have to give up the idea of, well, voting our way out of this.

          If we are going to make the argument that the system is a corrupt tyranny and that corrupt tyrannies have no rights, then why would we spend a minute cooperating with the corrupt tyranny?

          We’ve been playing the “insulate from the worst damage” game long enough. You don’t live in a republic. Stop pretending you do.

          • Unless you are willing to go full Sicilian Mafia on the local Democratic honchos. You still should vote in local elections as those are the easiest to influence as so few participate.
            That said, we do need to hold the local dem shot callers responsible. Consider them the low hanging fruit.that is easily accessible for anyone with the drive and basic brainpower and planning.

        • Georgia is a “Black” State, let them collapse as have all the Black cities. Sorry, I mean no disrespect to Georgian Whites. Same is happening in my State, except by Hispanics. One needs to understand the consequences of demography. A bitter pill to be sure, but a process that will not be averted.

          • If you want a great awakening, wake yourself up.
            Cowardice wins nothing. When you wake them up which has been an ongoing thing all Whites do is flee as we’ve seen for fifty years.
            Elite Whites do the same move to gated communities and do not give a crap about anyone.
            This is going to be a dogfight to the end as as friend of mine likes to say, you running out of runway.
            Do not succeed your land to hostile people, don’t hope voting solves anything. If it did , it would be illegal.
            And note the one time it did after a fashion with President Trump, they made it defacto illegal via fraud.
            My advice is stop pretending history stops with prosperity
            If you don’t stop running away from it and get ready to fight, you’ll get to repeat the delightful 20th century experience of gulags and concentration camps first hand.
            If you embrace it, your side sets the rules or is eliminated and no longer has to worry about anything.
            And as a sweetener, imagine a much Whiter/Righter USA without immigration, to borrow from Lennon, its easy if you try.
            That is worth fighting for.

          • Have to be in a place that is conducive to getting ready to fight as you have found out you can’t fight alone which is what they want you to do so you will be easily overcome…

          • As always this is a public forum and I’m telling you to not to do anything stupid or illegal.
            However if more likley when it happens this war won’t be fought with armies but by serial killers, cleaners and crazies which can be a few guys or just one guy until it takes off.
            The German term for this is Auftragstaktik, roughly Mission Tactics which means

            The emphasis is on the outcome of a mission rather than the specific means of achieving it.

            The Left calls this BAMN By Any Means Necessary
            No Blues or Greys in ranks , you’ll just get droned with mini drones like the Armenians just did in the Nagorno-Karabakh conflict a couple of months ago. Instead use every weapon, piece of knowledge and dirty trick at your disposal.
            You name is Lineman? Cool. Think to yourself “if this were X scenario, how do I use that?”
            And yes keep building tribe, move where you can its needed but never forget you have options even as a solo. Hell especially as a singleton.
            As Francis Bacon wrote

            He that hath wife and children hath given hostages to fortune

            For now, till either President Trump wins and we go back to prepping , mid January at least we prep and wait .
            We may have to wait a while longer than even that which is fine too but take the time to get hard and to think “What can I do?”
            It might surprise you what you think of.
            Till then, if you are faithful, pray and build tribe as you can.

          • From a broader perspective, one needs to have an attitude of, and surround oneself with people who have the attitude of, “OK, ‘x’ just happened, or ‘y’ just got done to us, or ‘z’ got done to somebody somewhere. What can we do about it?”. Not the government, not the cops, not the guy down the street. What are “we” going to do? Figure it out, and do it. Depend on “we”, not anyone or anything else. That’s how you get to the other side.

          • Lol.

            Horrible strategy, you realize every city and every state is infested with either white libs or non-whites.

            “Let them have it” means you don’t have anything.

          • Exactly.
            Its just a repeat of the same White Flight that ceded some of the greatest cities is the world to what we have now.
            Stop running, stop worrying about your fucking prosperity and being left alone and instead start worrying about your posterity.
            Its your job to build the civilization fir the next generations or to ensure the next generations even get here.

          • We need our sorts in our sanctuary places, and also on the front lines, and in enemy territory. We need visible leadership, grey organizers, and invisible operatives. We need broad movements, small groups, and solos. We need thinkers, schemers, planners, fighters, and silent operatives. We need quiet anger, and also things to openly rally around. It’s all good, and when we have it all, it is much harder for all of it to be destroyed.

          • There is a difference between flight and regrouping. Staying in deep blue hellholes to play Leroy Jenkins is pointless. You aren’t going to build a civilization in your lonely little urban consumption pod. And I know you aren’t raising any safe, healthy progeny in one of those hellholes, so why are you staying?

          • Trying to run somewhere and build civilization is putting the proverbial cart before the horse. Until the Left is no longer a threat to us and removed from our AO entirely , we can’t build anything lasting,
            They’ll just tear it down by parachuting in or with mass non White immigration.
            Do keep in mind there are also more 3x more Trump supporters here in California than there are in all of Alabama or Indiana.
            Besides not everyone actually can live in or even likes living in the country. The nation is 80% urban for a reason.
            Our cities are poorly managed and need us to run them right but city living doesn’t have to be awful
            If you are like me an introvert with no progeny nor really any plans for any its quite fine. City life, maybe a country cabin for the occasional weekend.
            Not counting a strategic withdrawal here, More White Babies as policy is also not compatible with Going to the Country.
            Small town aren’t coming back until the tech base collapses since they serve little economic use and are often as poor places to live.
            There are reasons small towns hemorrhaged population well before the automation age, for a lot of people they suck.
            Fill the country up and its a city.
            Now the current situation does require a retrenchment, mine included but going back the country or exurbs where I grew up isn’t something to be desired. Its only by necessity and the fact I cannot live by lies and as such cannot be a Democrat or GOPe

        • Elections simply do not matter anymore. We must focus on extra-electoral strategies and acts.

    • It’s dogma and ritual falling away and something will have to fill it

      Wonderful summary. That’s a meme that many an article will be hung on, whether the writers realize it or not

    • I get it because they see the Republicans doing nothing about the presidential election. OTOH as a Pennsylvanian, we did our part and got robbed (Biden overcomes 3/4 mil deficit overnight yeah right), but the fact we did our job and people are still upset about it has forced the legislature to move.

      Who knows if it succeeds but it wouldn’t be happening if we didn’t vote in the first place. Honestly I’m ambivalent about the whole thing. Either elections are rigged or the lawyers decide them. Either way democracy as we know it looks dead to me.

      • The problem is that a majority of Republicans are clueless cowards and/or fools. Thus we see “the Republicans doing nothing about the presidential election.” The solution is replacing GOP idiots with fighters. But there’s no time for that: It’s now or never. You got to war with the army you have.

        • I’d bet they’d tell you they’re concerned about preserving the legitimacy of elections— even if it means taking the dirty L from time to time— but really they’re trying to keep their gravy train going.

        • How? The votes are rigged.
          In any case the Republicans are not motivated by being cowards or fools, they are outright disloyal. They only care about getting loot and serving the big money that pays their bills.

        • That’s by design. You don’t think either party wants principled candidates, do you? The donors would never put up with it. For most in the Legislative Branch, it’s the best job they’ll ever have. Defeated/retired party loyalists can always count on a hack job in their home state, or K-street, or a seat on a corporate board.

      • If Trump manages a victory through lawfare he cannot do the old “let’s heal” thing. He must continue the attack. People have to go to jail. A few puppet masters and as many plebe vote stuffers as possible.

        I doubt he has it in him to do so, but allowing such flagrant and massive corruption to go unpunished will only postpone the Leftists until the next go round. They must truly know fear, not the faux fear they’ve utilized to beat us into submission.

        Either way Trump needs to accept his legacy will be as tyrant. He loses and the victors write the history of how they sent the tyrant packing after four years. Or he corrects the system through retribution and is seen as a tyrant for doing so. He’ll have to be one of those figures that future historians will “reevaluate” as having actually been a wise ruler.

        He seems less like a legacy guy and more a revel in the moment of glory guy to me though.

        • He’s mercurial. I think his instinct is for greatness but too often he’s content simply stamping his name on things.

          • Mercurial, a showman, an “I wanna be bigger than life” kinda guy. Zman has pointed several times that he is a mushy civnat without any deep principles. The Left has defined and created him. He would have been happy being the benevolent Daddy Warbucks tweeking business deals for the country and cutting down on unnecessary importation of foreign labor coming in to the country.

            His unexpected win put the Left into an apoplectic fugue. His first reaction was to pinch their noses for fun.
            Then to reach out to compromise not realizing they were going to uncompromisingly cast him as second Hitler, then anger at not being treated like “a real President.”

            He’s vacillated between these various phases for years now. Will he cross the Rubicon? Doubt it, but if I were a little bird on his shoulder I’d be whispering crucial excerpts from Machiavelli into his ear.

        • Agreed about the “healing”. The patient is dead, he can’t be healed. What would I do if I were Trump? Probably first make sure I have some off the record chats with a wide array of military people. I would make sure to talk to all ranks too. Having a few generals is useless if their soldiers won’t obey orders. Once I felt certain of military support, I would move against the various Blue state governors and mayors in the areas with the most vote fraud. This could be done through a State of the Union address where some sort of proclamation was made to effectively suspend the governors’ and mayors’ offices and take direct federal control of them. All vote counting and recounting, real or pretend, would stop as the ballots and ballot machines were seized. At this point the President could announce that, incidentally, all Covid restrictions were lifted in those areas. While this would enrage the Karens, it would offer a signal to the large numbers of people in those states who don’t support the Covid cult that federal help is on the way. If all of this succeeded, the release from Covid jail could be made nationwide. Following this a “truth and reconciliation” committee could be put together. The purpose would be to make “reparations” to all those (mostly white of course) people who had lost jobs and businesses due to lockdowns, riots, and other nonsense. This would be a nice ironic slap in the face to BLM and their talk of anti-white reparations. Then we announce the discovery of a coordinated plot involving Democrat politicians, the media, and large corporations to overturn the economy and institute a socialist re-ordering of thing. Arrests are made, most notably, of people in the media. The media dragon is gradually tamed (taking a page from Putin here).

          The point would be to keep rolling out new initiatives, new arrests, new announcements and actions, all to keep the media and the Left off balance. Once the media was Trumped and Trumped good and hard, the “reconstruction” (another delightful irony and dog-whistle) could begin in Blue areas forcing “voting reform” that would of course include jerry-mandering to install a permanent Red majority in office as widely as possible.

          Of course, this is all a massive expansive of Executive power, yada, yada, and muh Constitution, etc… I’m not saying this is a great solution but it at least ends American fake democracy in a way favorable to us.

      • Democracy is the political arrangement by which a well-organized minority rules over an unorganized majority. What we are witnessing is the flowering of democracy. It is now bearing its true fruit. Harvest time has arrived at last. After this, winter. And death. Which is a good thing. Our time will finally come. Don’t forget that the first thing on Sun Tzu’s list of the rules for victory is, “Know when to fight, and know when not to fight.” It won’t be long now. 18 months max. When the time comes, you will know it. Be ready.

    • A large drop in voter turnout might be the first step in getting people to realize that voting is the problem and that the system is virtually impervious to our votes or what we want.
      Ryan Faulk did an article and video on the correlation between what the plebs vote for or want and the actual policy and found none. Meanwhile, what the alleged “elite” want and policy is a close match.

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