Oriental Managerialism

Saving face is a phrase we tend to associate with oriental cultures, but it is an expression used in the West. The idea is that one wants to avoid being publicly disrespected in order to maintain your dignity. This means either doing something in response to a slight or committing a ritual act when you fail. Famously, committing suicide is an act of saving face in order to avoid the shame of public humiliation for having failed in your duties.

Even though the concept is oriental it is not entirely alien to the West. In fact, face saving has become a cultural aspect of the managerial elite. We just saw this with Victoria Nuland resigning her post. She had failed to destroy the ancient enemy of her people, so she was allowed to resign and save face. If she had been fired, it would be a public acknowledgment that she had failed. Her standing and that of her cult would be lowered as a result, so she was allowed to save face and quit.

This idea of face saving is not entirely alien to the West, but it is not a natural thing the way we see it practiced by our elites. Western societies are moral societies, held together as much by a set of agreed upon codes, passed down from one generation to the next. Publicly shaming someone for his failure to live up to the prevailing moral code is part of reinforcing that code. Letting someone save face undermines this so it is not natural in Western societies. We punish the sinner.

This oriental idea of face saving is behind the phenomenon of failing up which has come to define the modern managerial class. Someone like Victoria Nuland, for example, has been a failure at every stop in her career, but at every stop she has been allowed to save face and move to some new position. You can be sure she will assume a spot at a think tank or university. If Trump wins in November, she will get a media gig to criticize his handling of Russia.

The norm for Western society, with regards to someone like Nuland, is she would have been flushed out of the system as a warning to others. Go back far enough and she may have been killed or exiled. Maybe after she had demonstrated enough contrition she would be rehabilitated to a limited degree. That would include publicly admitting to and accepting that she was a failure. This is now alien to the managerial elite, even though it remains the norm with the Dirt People.

This idea of face saving is behind the cancel culture stuff that soon became a pogrom against normal people who held normal opinions. For our elites, simply being exposed as having broken the new rules was enough to compel a self-imposed exile of some sort, in order to save face. The accused was allowed to depart and save face, without suffering more than a minor loss of social standing. This offered the hope of rehabilitation once everyone forgot about it.

Since this is alien to normal people, it did not work this way so tougher measures were rolled out to punish the hooligans and running dog obstructionists. Banning people from Twitter, for example, was viewed by the people we call the left as an extreme punishment, because the victim lost face. The fact that the victim just respawned as a new character was seen as proof of their evil, because good people wish to avoid losing face and would have accepted their punishment.

People have noted that the response of the West to the Ukraine war is a globalized version of the cancel culture and censorship pogroms. Most of what Western leaders did over the last two years was about “isolating” Putin. It was as if they thought excluding him from the cool kid table would humiliate him to the point where he would either resign or be deposed. It never occurred to them that he and his government did not understand what any of this meant.

The question is why has face saving crowded out the old, natural way of policing the ranks of the elites? Part of it, obviously, is the way in which the managerial elite now see themselves individually and as a group. Many still see themselves as a minority and they brought the minority viewpoint into the elite. Minorities are always aware of their standing with regard to the majority, so saving face is important. Many originate from face saving societies, so this comes naturally.

There is also the bourgeoise nature of the elites. Our ruling class is not filled with an aristocratic sense of position. Instead, they view themselves as having scored the better on the test, relative to others. In other words, they are a system dependent elite, while an aristocracy is an independent elite. The former are full of angst about their position in the system, so they obsess over it. The latter sees the system as an expression of their natural position atop their society.

Like all middle-class people, our bourgeoise managerial elite is riddled with self-doubt about their standing. As you see in any middle-class suburb, the primary obsession is with noticing what everyone else is doing in order to make sure you are seen as part of what everyone else is doing. Conformity is a defining feature of bourgeoise culture and is thus the defining feature of the managerial elite. The so-called “Karen culture” is a natural product of an elite harvested from the middle-class.

The formation of a middle-class is most likely a lagging indicator. The independent farmer is something that arises late in an agrarian society. The urban middle-class was a late development in the industrial age. Our bourgeoise managerial elite with its oriental outlook probably signals a late stage of managerialism. The committee mentality and face saving are all part of a general decline in competence, which also suggests we are in the late stages of managerialism.


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Hokkoda
Member
3 months ago

Five important things happened this week that are related. 1. Trump won 9-0 at SCOTUS. And their ruling was really quite devastating AND SHORT. We may see a rapid end of the J6 and Documents cases. 5-4? Well, maybe presidents aren’t immune. 9-0 in a direct attempt to interfere in an election? Red alert. 2. Michelle Obama let it be known she is not running for POTUS, after #1 was announced. The timing was not an accident which leads me to… 3. Trump destroyed Nikki Haley 99-3 on Super Tuesday. The Sea Island Billionaire strategy to defeat Trump is dead.… Read more »

The Wild Geese Howard
The Wild Geese Howard
3 months ago

OT:

NYC telegraphs the plan to declare martial law in the near future by deploying 750 National Guard troops to the NYC subway system:

https://www.zerohedge.com/political/terror-threat-nyc-mobilizing-1000-national-guard-troops-subways

Prep accordingly.

Guest
Guest
Reply to  The Wild Geese Howard
3 months ago

Yes, this is why they are letting all these migrants into the country. They are not an army. They are agents of chaos that will be used to justify violating posse comitatus laws. Americans will be begging for a military presence on the streets. Then it will be turned against us.

YMAN
YMAN
3 months ago

inferior people elect inferior ruler
I’m not saying that white people are inferior rather than white people choose to be inferior people

it’s shouldn’t happen to this mess, but it is because white people choose material comfort and dump all greatness that born with them

Martok's Eyepatch
Martok's Eyepatch
3 months ago

Shortly before the 2019 election in the UK, I read a random comment from a Twitter user under a post about the old Labour Party. His father had been from a solidly working class background in the north of England, and was the first in his family to to go to university. After passing the Eleven Plus exam, he went to a Grammar School and eventually got into Cambridge. Anyway, having a strong regional accent (and this being a time when class divides were more pronounced) he was understandably self-conscious. He would tell his son that the posher the person,… Read more »

Neerav Jones
Neerav Jones
Reply to  Martok's Eyepatch
3 months ago

Excellent. Thank you.

Paul Gottfried
Paul Gottfried
3 months ago

Hot off the press –

“Tchaikovsky Street in Kyiv will be renamed Victoria Nuland Street. This order was signed by mayor Klitschko.”

https://twitter.com/Sprinter99800/status/1765420563558777127

Darien Lavov
Darien Lavov
Reply to  Paul Gottfried
3 months ago

Well, one look at her cracks yer nutz.

PubliusII
PubliusII
3 months ago

Managers who pay no penalty for making serious errors have no “skin in the game,” as the saying goes.

That practice should be ended, and some kind of verbal abasement for one’s error(s) isn’t really enough. Maybe the loss of a finger or ear might be sufficient.

In any case, I’m sure that some penalty scale can be devised.

Templar
Templar
3 months ago

Il est bon de tuer de temps en temps un amiral pour encourager les autres…

Zaphod
Zaphod
Reply to  Templar
3 months ago

Byngo!

An excellent policy back when and one which the RN of 2024 might benefit from.

mmack
mmack
3 months ago

If it’s Oriental Managerialism, can’t we make these people permanently wear “Ribbons of Shame” and scream their shortcomings, like in Gung Ho?

Michael Keaton to Gedde Watanabe: “Hey, these are nice ribbons.”
Assan Motors Training Exec: “Those are Ribbons of SHAME!” 😡
Michael Keaton to Gedde Watanabe: “I’d wear ’em on the inside if I were you.”

Jack Dodson
Jack Dodson
3 months ago

I doubt Nuland gravitates to MSNBC or CNN or any other national security state propaganda organ since that is uncomfortably visible. Less than three percent of Americans know who she is, and that likely is double the number before the cluster catastrophe in Ukraine. She is bailing before it implodes and her name comes up very much. Even marginal public presence is problematic. War criminals like to keep low profiles, so she’ll likely become a visiting professor at Big Ivy or work with her husband Bob at the in-flight magazine of the Regime, Foreign Affairs, where she can exult the… Read more »

JerseyJeffersonian
JerseyJeffersonian
Reply to  Jack Dodson
3 months ago

In-flight magazine of the Regime…
Heh. Perfect.

Hokkoda
Member
Reply to  Jack Dodson
3 months ago

Trump would do well to give a foreign policy speech that unambiguously states that the people responsible for this catastrophe, and complicit in the deaths of 500,000 Ukrainian soldiers, will be investigated and if crimes are found, prosecuted. Money laundering would be a great place to start.

Let’s find out where that money went, and to whom.

3g4me
3g4me
3 months ago

Off topic – albeit tangentially related to yesterday’s post – I take breaks from dreary and depressing world trends doing various things, both useful and useless. One of my time wasters is indulging in online card games (free cell and pyramid). Since I won’t pay, I have to watch ads. Since I try to avoid the most obnoxious of the DEI ads (Adobe) I often end up watching 15-30 second ads for online games, and a lot of online gambling. The two names that show up repeatedly are BagelCode and Murka Games. I finally looked into both this morning. Murka… Read more »

Tired Citizen
Tired Citizen
Reply to  3g4me
3 months ago

Every. Single. Time.

Ostei Kozelskii
Member
Reply to  3g4me
3 months ago

Bagelcode–geez, not terribly subtle there…

KGB
KGB
Reply to  Ostei Kozelskii
3 months ago

Change that ‘o’ to an ‘i’ and you’d have the ADL issue a fatwa faster than you could say Sandy Koufax.

JerseyJeffersonian
JerseyJeffersonian
Reply to  3g4me
3 months ago

A nice seque to yesterday’s post and the comments elicited thereby.

Alex
Alex
3 months ago

When your rulers have been feminized to the degree ours have, the worst punishment in the world for them is to be told to go to time out.

Wangweilin
Wangweilin
3 months ago

Zeeman… a little gratuitous David French bashing since he has no face on most issues. Ran across this in a similar vein:

https://donsurber.substack.com/p/david-french-fried?publication_id=1115457&post_id=142330242&isFreemail=true&r=ch1ue&triedRedirect=true

Jack Dodson
Jack Dodson
Reply to  Wangweilin
3 months ago

French’s wife Nancy has just penned a book, GHOSTED, about not being properly being treated as the Deep State martyr she is. It likely is inadvertently hilarious.

Xman
Xman
3 months ago

I don’t think Nuland is being “allowed” to resign due to failure. The ruling class is never punished for failure. They just simply move into other positions where they can continue the grift. When they lose elections, they get appointed to bureaucratic positions or get hired as lobbyists making quadruple the money. You see this a lot in the education business. There is a whole class of college and public school administrators that move from one high-paying position to another like a game of musical chairs no matter what their actual record of accomplishment or failure actually is. Look at… Read more »

usNthem
usNthem
Reply to  Xman
3 months ago

Kinda like NFL head coaches – they just move around from one team to the next when they get canned – maybe not as the top dog, but some other well paying gig nonetheless. Total incestuous joke.

Ostei Kozelskii
Member
Reply to  usNthem
3 months ago

Kliff Kingsbury is the classic example of a football coach who consistently fails upward. And he’s not even a nuggra, although his sexual orientation is open to grave question.

Jeffrey Zoar
Jeffrey Zoar
Reply to  Ostei Kozelskii
3 months ago

Mike Shula still coaches in the NFL

Ostei Kozelskii
Member
Reply to  Jeffrey Zoar
3 months ago

If the Shula fits…

Vinnyvette
Vinnyvette
Reply to  Xman
3 months ago

Add ton that the revolving door of corporate CEO’s and board members who crash and burn banks and companies to the ground, get a nice parachute severance package, always in the millions of dollars with stock options, only to re-emerge with another company, wash rinse repeat. I cannot fathom how western civilization which was built on merit and competence, evolved into a system of “failure is to be rewarded.” These people cause stockholders to lose money, employees to lose jobs, and in many cases tax payers to cover the asses of these incompetents in the form of govt bailouts, and… Read more »

Ostei Kozelskii
Member
Reply to  Xman
3 months ago

There’s nothing more anti-meritocratic than academia in AINO. Is it any wonder it’s a goofy farce?

Popcorn
Popcorn
3 months ago

It was pretty stupid of the west to try mean girls tactics against a elite like Russia has. Those men know what death is.

ray
ray
Reply to  Popcorn
3 months ago

Right on the button. It’s a female nation vs a masculine nation. The West is feminist and the East ain’t.

The hard men of Russia and China don’t care about one-upping, gotchas, and junior high school exclusion tactics. Such tactics derive from a feminine mind and society.

Robbo
Robbo
Reply to  Popcorn
3 months ago

Yep. Zman wrote that they tried to isolate Putin. What in fact happened is that our “elite” found THEMSELVES isolated. They really don’t get the new reality that the RoW – Rest of the World – doesn’t give a damn what they think. And they still haven’t grasped the fact.

ray
ray
Reply to  Robbo
3 months ago

As Z has mentioned repeatedly, these people live in a Bubble from childhood through adulthood. Tho most never actually become adults.

Thus I can sit here and know when the war began it was unwinnable. But they see only their agenda, and/or their bank accounts.

miforest
miforest
3 months ago

I think the reading of the nuland thing wrong. Ick Vic is being promoted for a job very well done. She is moving from the “working ” class of elites to the “managerial ” class of elites. she no longer has to be in the public eye and working on “projects” . the plant manager at GM has a hard job of running operations . when he is promoted to E suite , life gets easier for him. state dept is a “plant ” , one of many for her superiors. Nuland is moving to the E suite. Her list… Read more »

Lineman
Lineman
Reply to  miforest
3 months ago

Yea agree with this assessment way more than the original article… The jew can’t be shamed…

DaBears
DaBears
Reply to  Lineman
3 months ago

Actually, they can be shamed. They view life as a book and the entry of “shame” into their life bothers them tremendously. jews are self-delusional and non-self-aware. But you can indeed “shame” them by using the word three times, say what you will. “SHAME ON YOU! SHAME ON YOU! S-H-A-M-E ON YOU AND YOURS!!!” I guarantee this works with most jews even at the highest levels. They will take great offense, and possibly seek retribution, but they will internalize the mantra you should learn. Try it out for any reason and especially for no reason like a petty offense. It… Read more »

Mike
Mike
Reply to  miforest
3 months ago

You’re assuming the West will win in the Ukraine, nothing you say is valid if Russia wins. Do you think Russia will let Blackrock and the rest keep the farmland and be involved in reconstruction? Russia, I think, will make sure the land is brought back and the people taken care of well. Look at what they’ve done in the parts they have already annexed.

Pozymandias
Reply to  Mike
3 months ago

Exactly what I thought. Russia will undoubtedly spread the word about the failure of yet another financial scam initiated in the West by those who don’t understand that not everything is a money game.

Ostei Kozelskii
Member
Reply to  Mike
3 months ago

I’d love to see those rascally Finkels take a major haircut.

Jeffrey Zoar
Jeffrey Zoar
Reply to  Mike
3 months ago

Can anyone really win “in Ukraine”? I have a hard time picturing it. Neither side can walk away.

miforest
miforest
Reply to  Jeffrey Zoar
3 months ago

read my whole post. the people winning ukraine are NOT ukrainians. the , shall we say western elites are already winning ukraine. they have the deals made, the workd bank has approved funding . Putin will get his part. and he will benefit enormously from heigher grain prices . russia is a big grain exporter. so putin will definately win. do not believe the western proppaganda media , the russ are killing ukes at a 10 to 1 ratio. sad as that is , it means russia is not sufferint anywhere near as much as ukraine.

miforest
miforest
Reply to  Mike
3 months ago

The error in your thinking is that you think russia wants ALL of ukraine and they don’t. they want the donbass , maybe with a russia controlled buffer zone up to the dneiper river . they will take their part of ukraine and leve the rest to blackrock. poland wants a piiece of ukraine that used to be poland , I think the area is called galacia. it’s the western side of ukraine.

Robbo
Robbo
Reply to  miforest
3 months ago

Disagree on that one. Her one job was to destroy Russia. Not only did she fail, but Russia is stronger now than it has been since 1991. It has the world’s most combat-experienced army and has forged extremely close relations with the neocons’ other great enemies, Iran and China. If that’s not failure, I don’t know what is. And if you still don’t agree, look at this evil witch’s face: does that look like someone who is happy at her own boundless success?

miforest
miforest
Reply to  Robbo
3 months ago

getting a huge windfall and killing 50K to 100K russians at no cost to yout own people is not a win for a russia hater?

DLS
DLS
3 months ago

The idea of elites saving face is what turned me off from AB InBev products forever. The horse-faced Jewess that ran Budweiser marketing decided it would be good for business to insult her customers and cater to perverts who don’t drink beer. But instead of being fired for costing her company billions of dollars, she was suspended, no doubt until the flyover rubes forgot the whole thing. Had they simply apologized and fired her immediately, I probably would be back to drinking their watered down piss by now. Calling me a fratty homophobe was bad enough, but doubling down and… Read more »

Jannie
Jannie
Reply to  DLS
3 months ago

You should be ashamed for drinking that urine-flavored soda when there are so many great American beers on the market.

Xman
Xman
Reply to  Jannie
3 months ago

Better yet, imported German beers. If you’ve never had a Bitburger, Franziskaner, Paulaner or Warsteiner you’ve never had a real beer.

Mr. Generic
Mr. Generic
Reply to  Xman
3 months ago

> Better yet, imported German beers. If you’ve never had a Bitburger, Franziskaner, Paulaner or Warsteiner you’ve never had a real beer.

Those are all “gateways” to the real German beers. Weihenstephaner, Veltins, and others make Warsteiner and Bitburger look like Budweiser and Coors by comparison.

Ostei Kozelskii
Member
Reply to  Xman
3 months ago

Definitely. I have no interest in AINObrau unless I can be sure the brewery isn’t pozzed. The vast majority of them are.

Jeffrey Zoar
Jeffrey Zoar
Reply to  Ostei Kozelskii
3 months ago

There is virtually no corporate product you can purchase in AINO today without supporting some kind of poz

DLS
DLS
Reply to  Jannie
3 months ago

I am. I’m from St. Louis and it was an easy default. It has been a great awakening to move on to much better beer. But AB owns a lot of those too, so I still choose carefully, lest a message of retribution not be sent.

Lineman
Lineman
Reply to  DLS
3 months ago

Quit drinking beer altogether makes you fat and makes your body produce estrogen…

ProZNoV
ProZNoV
Reply to  Lineman
3 months ago

When I was young, I thought coffee was the grown up drink.

As a teen, I thought beer was the grown up drink.

As an adult…water. Water is the grown up drink.

Steve
Steve
Reply to  DLS
3 months ago

Calling me a fratty homophobe was bad enough, but doubling down and calling me stupid was the final straw.

This is exactly why it’s not a great idea to do the same thing to DR-curious. Insult them, then double down, you’ve lost them. Possibly forever.

Alex
Alex
Reply to  Steve
3 months ago

Exactly. Some of our more Spergy friends have no idea how humans work.

Robbo
Robbo
Reply to  DLS
3 months ago

Well, there’s always Doritos. Oh, wait…

ray
ray
3 months ago

This isn’t oriental managerialism. No need for pretty new concepts. This is just what a nation looks like when its women take over. And are enabled and funded in their empowerment by weak men and selfish daddies. ‘The so-called “Karen culture” is a natural product of an elite harvested from the middle-class.’ The Raging Karens that run New Amerika are a product of centuries of mass, intense brainwashing for feminism and gynocentric culture. They’re drawn largely from both the middle and elite classes. Queen Victoria Nuland makes an excellent example of why placing females in charge of everything — and… Read more »

Lineman
Lineman
Reply to  ray
3 months ago

That only happens if White Men Tribe Up…

ray
ray
Reply to  Lineman
3 months ago

A masculine, largely Christian, revival is still possible in the U.S. Because God will back that one up. White men forming a Tribe? I can’t see that happening in America. White men are not tribal and you need a remedy, now. There is no spiritual impetus for ‘white men’ tribing up, but there is a huge amount of such impetus already extant (and quickly building) in the U.S. and elsewhere in the West. Do not imagine the powers have not noticed. Such an authentic spiritual transformation is always led by men, never women. Women are made from this Earth and… Read more »

flashing red
flashing red
Reply to  ray
3 months ago

A POCs on both their houses!

Rando
Rando
3 months ago

Perhaps the saving face culture is just a result of the formation of managerial systems? After all, China was one of the first nations to establish a bureaucracy based on exams and meeting established standards rather than personal connections and privilege. Western societies begin creating similar bureaucracies and suddenly we see the same type of behavior.

Paintersforms
Paintersforms
Reply to  Rando
3 months ago

Ah, Mother Civilization, the Asiatic Thing.

Jeffrey Zoar
Jeffrey Zoar
3 months ago

It’s hard to see how or why Nuland’s “retirement” has anything to do with failure, since the GAE braintrust has admitted no failure, neither publicly nor probably to itself either, and its efforts in Ukraine are purely, nobly motivated, on the side of the angels, resisting the great evil of the orange man loving Putler and his unprovoked invasion. The narrative has not changed. This has always been, still is, portrayed as the great geopolitical struggle of our time for which our loins must be girded, so why, pray tell, would she need to be punished for it, and what… Read more »

miforest
miforest
Reply to  Jeffrey Zoar
3 months ago

her “project” led to the deaths of cauc nominally Christian men ad the wounding/crippleing of 1.5 mil more. she turned up to 10 million into refugees, and a couple of hundred thou are missing. in some circles this is not going to be seen in a bad light .

Alzaebo
Alzaebo
3 months ago

This is another deep dive on social organization, hats off to the Z. As Citizen notes, the institutions are now dedicated to preventing any White competitor elite from forming. There must not be any Rebel generals like George Washington allowed to live. Dissident groups are trying to rally- note figures like Padraig Martin (Dixie Identity) and Ken Paxton (Lone Star Republic). Do we have enough time to form a Grange, a coalition of the productive fringes? Wherein will arise a new and natural aristocracy, or do we have to wait for the Federal Reserve to fail first? How else to… Read more »

KGB
KGB
Reply to  Alzaebo
3 months ago

This week I’ve been reading a book on the growth of party and machine in the United States, authored during the Wilson administration. The history of Tammany is one that could serve as fertile ground for dissidents; lessons both positive and negative abound. It sprung up immediately after the Revolutionary War to fill the vacuum that had been previously filled by now-obsolete groups like the Sons Of Liberty. Noted political schemer Aaron Burr was heavily involved in its initial development. Now, the amount of graft its sachems indulged in is staggering, even by today’s dollar figures they were spectacularly corrupt… Read more »

Lineman
Lineman
Reply to  KGB
3 months ago

True power comes from will and numbers.

Yet the DR still hasn’t come to grips with that…

Steve
Steve
Reply to  KGB
3 months ago

Tammany didn’t really die. It just moved to Chicago, where they perfected it. That’s why any of us have even heard of Obama.

ProZNoV
ProZNoV
Reply to  KGB
3 months ago

Exceptional post.

What’s the book?

KGB
KGB
Reply to  ProZNoV
3 months ago

The Boss And The Machine by Samuel Orth, part of “The Chronicles of America Series”, from 1919. It’s a dusty hard cover I picked up from my local library years ago as they were clearing out older stock. The last time it had been checked out was 1968!

Steve
Steve
Reply to  Alzaebo
3 months ago

Right. But don’t forget, “Local, local, local.” Or any of the other formulations you see over at WRSA. It should be possible to build a confederation of local units, allies and trading partners you can trust, but anyone who thinks he can form a top-down White Christian Nation anytime in the next few generations is fooling himself.

JR Wirth
JR Wirth
3 months ago

You can see this in the ebb and flow of empires. In modern times Stalin was the builder and master operator of the Soviet machine. The machine existed for him and to serve him. Once he was gone the machine was left operating by its various parts. FDR created the American version of this machine. It was much more nuanced and complex as it involved the public believing that they were still free (we haven’t been) and could get a fair shake. Once FDR left the scene it became an apparatus of its moving parts. One of these machines broke… Read more »

Winter
Winter
3 months ago

Part of the reason Nuland was allowed to “fail up” was because the dead and mangled bodies weren’t of her own tribe. If she had caused the deaths of hundreds of thousands of her own people, there would have been serious consequences.

It’s the same with financial swindles. Cheat the goy, and you get a slap on the wrist. Cheat the chosen, and you’re in big trouble, mister.

Mr. Generic
Mr. Generic
Reply to  Winter
3 months ago

> Cheat the chosen, and you’re in big trouble, mister.

This was Bernie Madoff’s big mistake.

Jeffrey Zoar
Jeffrey Zoar
Reply to  Mr. Generic
3 months ago

And Elizabeth Holmes. But John Corzine, on the other hand…..

Melissa
Melissa
Reply to  Mr. Generic
3 months ago

It’s difficult not to have a tiny soft spot in the heart for Madoff after learning of his connection to Eli Weasel. Weasel compared it to the most horrific event to have ever occurred which somehow also turned him into a bazillionaire.

Geo. Orwell
Geo. Orwell
Reply to  Winter
3 months ago

Failing up? Check! Who is replacing Vampire Vicky? A guy named Bass… who oversaw the withdrawal from Afghanistan. If only the rest of us could be rewarded for making bloody and colossal fuckups.

Jannie
Jannie
Reply to  Geo. Orwell
3 months ago

Yeah, nobody ever resigned over the Afghanistan debacle. Biden, Blinken, Austin and Milley still sucking insolently on their fat thumbs with their hands in the cookie jar.

Maxda
Maxda
Reply to  Geo. Orwell
3 months ago

I had to laugh when I heard that one. He’s an absolute idiot who might be trusted to collect trash unsupervised.

My Comment
My Comment
3 months ago

The idea that a devastating punishment for Putin and Russia was to ban them from the cool kids table is an important one. However, the cool kids are increasingly seen as the crazy kids and leaders from other countries are increasingly picking up their trays and moving to other tables. Your see this with BRIC+ and a variety of other acronym groups such as SCO. Because the Western Jewish and white cool kids live in a bubble they have no idea how their cherished beliefs are seen as repugnant by most of the world. Do what we say or we… Read more »

Mr. Generic
Mr. Generic
Reply to  My Comment
3 months ago

> The idea that a devastating punishment for Putin and Russia was to ban them from the cool kids table is an important one.

This is a female-centric view and the direct result of putting women into positions of authority. Today’s essay might as well have been titled, “Female Managerialism”.

My Comment
My Comment
Reply to  Mr. Generic
3 months ago

I imagine that the politically active elite Rasmussen found to have particularly crazy views is primarily Jews and white women.

It is sad the way that Jewish and female values have come to dominate the views of the elite and managerial class

KGB
KGB
Reply to  My Comment
3 months ago

In the 80’s it became a popular trope in TV shows and movies to depict the alpha crowd as both vicious and ineffectual. It was going to be Revenge of the Nerds from there on out. Show after show, movie after movie since then has depicted the neurotic, impulsive, slightly intelligent types as always being on the top of the food chain. What group embodies those traits, again? The same group that was writing and producing that schlock. Sometimes real life doesn’t work quite like the Early Life crowd would have us believe. Sometimes the cool kid table comes out… Read more »

ray
ray
Reply to  Mr. Generic
3 months ago

Mr. Generic —

Exactly. It is quintessentially female social behavior. Girls exclude from the Cool Kids Table, not boys. Girls and women use group-exclusion and shaming to achieve their ends. Not men.

You can’t just toss your men outta education and employment for forty years, plug your daughters in, and expect everything to go just spiffily. Yes yes I know she’s your Precious Perfect Punkin’, but she is destroying Western Civilization.

Nothing to do with orientalism, everything to do with feminism.

Lineman
Lineman
Reply to  ray
3 months ago

Feminism is just a symptom of kikism…

ray
ray
Reply to  Lineman
3 months ago

Nonsense. Feminism existed almost from the beginning of humanity. Whatever kikism is, it came along a lot later.

Ostei Kozelskii
Member
Reply to  My Comment
3 months ago

I hope it makes them a lot more dead.

Robbo
Robbo
Reply to  My Comment
3 months ago

The cool kids these days are all to the East of Europe. They are building a whole new world, for better or worse. We in the West have no idea. Despite all our talk about diversity and respecting other cultures, we still think that the whole world follows our lead. Nothing could be further from the truth. I was listening to a program yesterday about the new Arctic sea trade route between China and Russia. While we are squabbling about pronouns, the BRICS+ are going into overdrive. The West is a doomed, and I never thought I’d ever live to… Read more »

TomA
TomA
3 months ago

The lack of an accountability feedback mechanism in any society is a serious pathology. Without it, error is reinforced rather than corrected, and it always leads to an eventual larger failure and ultimately collapse. In the context of governments, we delude ourselves with the belief that voting is a remedy to the problem of failed politicians. Yet incumbency is >97% and most of these actors are genuinely stupid, evil, and/or corrupt. And its getting worse faster. The best indicator of this decline is the growth of sovereign debt all across the West. We’ve been eating the seed corn for decades… Read more »

Lineman
Lineman
Reply to  TomA
3 months ago

Best have Tribe also Brother…It’s ironic to me that we have so much more knowledge at our fingertips than anytime in history, we can see the blueprint of what they have planned for us because we can see it played out again and again throughout history and yet we seem to be destined to repeat it…Does no one else have any sense of duty towards our people or are they just hoping against hope that somehow the enemy will skip over them…

trackback
3 months ago

[…] ZMan notes some anomalies. […]

Celt Darnell
Member
3 months ago

Re: “ The so-called “Karen culture” is a natural product of an elite harvested from the middle-class.”

I don’t know. It seems to me that 90% of Karens are just white, middle-class women who are angry that nothing is working as it is supposed to. Poor dears don’t realize things are never going to work properly again.

I doubt the canary in the coal mine is especially charming either.

Steve
Steve
Reply to  Celt Darnell
3 months ago

Pretty sure that was Zman’s point. Just written in a way to keep the essay to 1,000 words or so.

Robbo
Robbo
Reply to  Celt Darnell
3 months ago

They bought all the 60s feminism crap from Steinem et al and now they are alone, angry and bitter. Meanwhile, the new generation of women are even angrier and stupider. Men are either gay or disgusted by them. They’ll have an even worse future than their predecessors. I see many cats in their futures.

Paul Gottfried
Paul Gottfried
3 months ago

In the old-fashioned business books written prior to 1990s, failure was often presented as bad. People mortgaged their own house to fund the company. So, failing meant losing house. If the business was funded by a bank loan, failure also meant bank never giving loan to the person for another business. Modern Silicon Valley business culture sees failure as experience and wisdom. San Bankman-Fried will likely be treated as hero if he tries to raise money for another cryptocurrency startup. The WeWork guy definitely is, because the VCs are now paying him for another similar startup for apartment rental. Victoria… Read more »

mmack
mmack
Reply to  Paul Gottfried
3 months ago

In the old-fashioned business books written prior to 1990s, failure was often presented as bad. Agreed. I’ve pointed out before that the General Manager in charge of the late, unlamented Edsel division of Ford Motor Company, Richard E. Krafve, was shown the door when the division was closed. Losing $250 Million of 1960 money ($2.5 Billion in BidenBucks) can do that for a fellow. That said, he did surface later in the 1960s at Raytheon so a bit of what Z says was going on with Managerialism way back when. Failure is inevitable at some point, but there’s a difference… Read more »

Tars Tarkas
Member
Reply to  mmack
3 months ago

The thing is, Edsel didn’t fail because it was poorly run. The Edsel was a pretty good car and the division wasn’t especially run into the ground by management. The Edsel just didn’t sell well.

Your point about A/B is a good one. Now that is a dept that needs cleaning out starting with the head woman and everyone who works with her.

mmack
mmack
Reply to  Tars Tarkas
3 months ago

Edsel didn’t fail because it was poorly run. The Edsel was a pretty good car and the division wasn’t especially run into the ground by management. Not to make this Car Chat, but “Edsel was a pretty good car”, not really. Quality wise the models, at least for 1958, had some measure of poor quality. Ford based the lower two models on Ford platforms, and the upper two models on Mercury platforms. Then ran them down the same lines as Ford or Mercury cars. To quote La Wiki: The 1958 Edsels were assembled in both Mercury and Ford factories. The… Read more »

Alzaebo
Alzaebo
Reply to  mmack
3 months ago

Managerial class: “Just the kind of guys we need to run Vietnam!”

Compsci
Compsci
Reply to  mmack
3 months ago

The above is the kind of stuff that makes this comment section. Thanks. When I was young, the neighbors had an Edsel. What I remember was that it was “strange”—especially the push button transmission. Still hate it, but it’s now part of the wife’s new Lincoln. The more things change….

Tars Tarkas
Member
Reply to  mmack
3 months ago

But how much of this was planned and how much was it a workaround for the poor sales? Had the Edsel taken off, it would have had its own production line. I like the push-button transmission. The Fury had it too and that was Mopar. The mechanism was a bit complicated though on the Edsel. To be fair, I see the Edsel with modern eyes on a vintage car. I wasn’t even alive at the time, let alone buying a new or slightly used car as an adult in the 50s. So it is somewhat difficult to see it as… Read more »

Mr. Generic
Mr. Generic
Reply to  Paul Gottfried
3 months ago

> Modern Silicon Valley business culture sees failure as experience and wisdom. San Bankman-Fried will likely be treated as hero if he tries to raise money for another cryptocurrency startup. The WeWork guy definitely is, because the VCs are now paying him for another similar startup for apartment rental. Not to try to dig up a can of hornets from yesterday’s discussion, but it is not “Silicon Valley business culture” that sees obvious frauds like SBF and Neumann continue to get funding and opportunity despite a track record of “failure”. Chinese, Indian, American, European, Japanese, Latin American, African, and Arab… Read more »

Paintersforms
Paintersforms
Reply to  Mr. Generic
3 months ago

Failure is experience and wisdom— if you pay the price for it. These guys don’t seem to, so they don’t learn the lesson.

Plus, isn’t the idea basically a pump and dump? Get the hype for your startup and sell at a profit before the shine’s off the turd?

Jeffrey Zoar
Jeffrey Zoar
Reply to  Paintersforms
3 months ago

Failing with someone else’s money doesn’t impart the same lessons as failing with your own, and leads to this zeitgeist of failure being framed as a positive. Nobody who failed with their own money talks about how great it was, unless they subsequently went on to success, and usually much later.

Ostei Kozelskii
Member
Reply to  Mr. Generic
3 months ago

You just had to open up a nest o’ worms, didn’t you? (-;

Tars Tarkas
Member
Reply to  Mr. Generic
3 months ago

There is some African I think from Nigeria that just ran flat out scams on investors. He was literally ripping pics off of random websites promoting his very special banking for the “un-banked” scheme via an app. His multi-billion dollar valuated company had like 129 Dollars in the bank. He’s not in jail and is still being promoted.

RealityRules
RealityRules
Reply to  Paul Gottfried
3 months ago

I think there is an interpretation layer about failure that needs to be understood. In the fiat regime, novelty creates opportunity for the unproductive and more buzzwords for midwits. The SV ethos around failure in the healthy part is not a celebration of failure. It is a process of building something in order to learn if it is technically feasible and/or a market for it exists. It is done to gather information and to avoid destroying capital by drawing out and extending failed experiments longer than needed to know that they failed. Now, the midwits take this and turn it… Read more »

Paintersforms
Paintersforms
Reply to  Paul Gottfried
3 months ago

We need business (or at least accounting) books that don’t count lines of credit as assets and count debts owed as liabilities.

Dumb about this stuff, but neither represents actual value, so both are inflationary and present a picture potentially dangerously out of touch with reality, right?

Steve
Steve
Reply to  Paintersforms
3 months ago

Yes, that’s what “we” need. It’s just not what “they” need, which, in this case, are the people writing the IRS regs. Used to be saving for retirement (like in my dad’s day) was trivial. Buy a stock, they write you a check quarterly for dividends, you invest that elsewhere, or skip the check and just have it reinvested (usually at a discount, or even free) if you want a larger position. That’s it. Problem is that does not generate churn, so does not generate tax. Capital gains, where you can impute “asset value” to things like “customer sentiment” and… Read more »

ProZNoV
ProZNoV
3 months ago

Elon musk showed the only way to deal with this problem with his Twitter purchase: fire 70% immediately and clean up with another 10% in the second culling.

This doesn’t seem remotely possible under our current managerial system of sinecures and military/industrial/think tank/congressional complex.

Still, what can’t go on, won’t. $35 trillion in the hole and an additional $1 trillion spent ever 100 days doesn’t bode well.

Alzaebo
Alzaebo
3 months ago

Victoria Nu-land. Family name in Galicia Ukraine, Nudelman. Chrystia Free-land. Family name in Galicia Ukraine, Komyak. A short article noted their names are code names. Like the Sikh are trying to do with Kashmir, or as the Rothschilds did with Palestina Israel, this sub-tribe’s vision is to recapture a historic homeland, Khazaria,* lost to them since 965 and 1027 AD by the Rus princes. (That, in itself, is a retelling of the Jerusalem narrative, taken in 70 and 135 AD. Just as the American narrative is a continuation of the War ofThree Kingdoms.) I read the Bible as this narrative… Read more »

Alzaebo
Alzaebo
Reply to  Alzaebo
3 months ago

Wotan’s Return…RETVRN!

anon
anon
Reply to  Alzaebo
3 months ago

Small factual correction re : “Like the Sikh are trying to do with Kashmir”.

The area the Sikhs are trying to recapture is the Indian part of Punjab, not Kashmir.

Allegations have been made that the Indian government has knocked off a leader or two of the separatist movement, much to the annoyance of the alleged son of Castro who heads the Canadian government.

DaBears
DaBears
3 months ago

I attend company board meetings. My wife attends Fortune 50 and Big Banks board meetings, some virtual which makes me a fly on the wall sometimes. Almost to a board member and c-level, these are toadies who have mastered the great game of sucking up. Somewhat above average g IQ, not all, they are almost exclusively driven by their imperative to maximize personal compensation. I have become a small hat hater, due to exposure, but majority of the board members are white folks and nominal Christians. One hundred years ago majority of our elites were actually elite in comparison with… Read more »

Alzaebo
Alzaebo
Reply to  DaBears
3 months ago

Let’s rhyme some history here.
If Baron daBears and some of the other exiled aristos were to take power in the Yooper Nation, I’d strap on my war mukluks and volunteer for the the front lines in their assault on the Cook County Democratic People’s Republic.
Eisenhower didn’t build the I-94 for nuthin’, ya know…Convoyyyy!!

DLS
DLS
Reply to  DaBears
3 months ago

My experience has been that many VP/C-level execs have high verbal IQs, and can get their peers nodding their heads without actually taking a hard position on anything. But when they are put in charge of actual operations, they fail miserably.

Chet Rollins
Chet Rollins
3 months ago

> The accused was allowed to depart and save face, without suffering more than a minor loss of social standing. It’s very common in corporations to give higher-ups an out when they screw up, either by telling them ahead of time they are getting axed so they can resign, or giving them a phony-baloney do-nothing job that gives them enough time to find another opportunity with another company. One time an upper management type got smashed at a holiday party and did or said something that simply couldn’t get pushed under the rug. The next day an email expressed how… Read more »

DaBears
DaBears
Reply to  Chet Rollins
3 months ago

Sometimes they rally. My sponsor at the second BigLaw firm I practiced with, the guy who also served as the chief pilot of the firm’s first jet on the side, was caught out in the firm’s drinking culture when a half dozen partners walked in on him and a paralegal while they were having sexual relations on top of a copying machine, both were married with family at the time. He was immediately demoted to “of counsel” for a few years but then ascended back up the ranks to firmwide executive committee. They just never let him fly the plane… Read more »

The Wild Geese Howard
The Wild Geese Howard
Reply to  DaBears
3 months ago

Isn’t it generally understood that, for various reasons, pilots tend to do quite well with the ladies?

Also, I bet the paralegal was hot, which would weigh in the pilot’s favor as well as a clandestine high-five or two after the dust had settled.

Zaphod
Zaphod
Reply to  DaBears
3 months ago

There’s a good alternate universe Silicon Valley hiring interview question buried in there somewhere: involving copier cycle rate, the Nyquist-Shannon sampling theorem, aliasing, flip-book animations, and ownership of non job description related IP.

mmack
mmack
Reply to  Chet Rollins
3 months ago

It’s very common in corporations to give higher-ups an out when they screw up, either by telling them ahead of time they are getting axed so they can resign, or giving them a phony-baloney do-nothing job that gives them enough time to find another opportunity with another company.

In sports, this is known as the coach “Stepping down to spend more time with my family” speech.

Pro Tip for any Pro Coaches in Z’s readership: When management says they have “Complete confidence” in you, brush up the old resume.

Compsci
Compsci
Reply to  Chet Rollins
3 months ago

“One time an upper management type got smashed at a holiday party and did or said something that simply couldn’t get pushed under the rug. The next day an email expressed how he found “an exciting new opportunity” and was leaving.” What I can’t get my head around is how these people find future employment—often at positions equal to or higher than they left. My experience is in academia and at the university level. I remember my last university president. She had several other presidencies, all being of short duration 3-5 years. This is indicative of simple failure and repeated… Read more »

miforest
miforest
Reply to  Compsci
3 months ago

it’s called the Agee effect . once you are in the club, you are aways in the club.

Jeffrey Zoar
Jeffrey Zoar
Reply to  Compsci
3 months ago

“We made sure to hire someone with ‘executive experience,’ so it’s not our fault he failed.”

steve w
steve w
Reply to  Jeffrey Zoar
3 months ago

Every damned one of the last several City school superintendents hired in my nearby BRC has been vetted, naturally, after a nationwide “talent search”. They are always geniuses, with the salaries to prove it, yet end up after 3 years or so getting run out of town on a rail. Our local city has about 200,000 inhabitants (330,000 back when it was not a BRC). Two noteworthy failures at their task went on, respectively, to run the schools in Boston and in DC. Hardly demotions.

So yeah, the Agee effect, as miforest put it. There’s no other explanation.

steve w
steve w
Reply to  steve w
3 months ago

Footnote to “my” city. In the 1980s, briefly, the teacher’s union landed the highest-paying contract in the USA. Argument: You want quality schools, you have to hire quality people, and quality people don’t come cheap.

This particular district is now dead last in the state at all meaningful measures.

Presbyter
Presbyter
3 months ago

One notices the use of the female form of the French borrow word “bourgeois”. Deliberate perhaps ? Clever if so.

The Wild Geese Howard
The Wild Geese Howard
3 months ago

Gateway Pundit is claiming their FOIA about Nuland’s involvement with Gonzalo Lira is what prompted the resignation:

https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2024/03/ding-dong-victoria-nuland-steps-down-after-gateway/

Bannon is on the War Room telling Nuland his gang is coming after her.

This is what 30+ years of doing evil does to you:

https://twitter.com/martyrmade/status/1765053324477538738

Chet Rollins
Chet Rollins
Reply to  The Wild Geese Howard
3 months ago

You can notice it’s not just the weight and age. She could have easily turned into a nice grandma who was a looker in her early years. There are plenty of elderly women whose looks have faded, but still have that warm, plump grandma look every grandchild warmly remembers. That woman, on the other hand, is Gingerbread House levels of evil.

Evil corrupts inside and out.

Alzaebo
Alzaebo
Reply to  Chet Rollins
3 months ago

And that voice! Even on the infamous phone call, “and eff the EU”, her voice is lovely. It must’ve sounded like honey when she was young, and quite the Ukrainian looker.

mikebravo
mikebravo
Reply to  The Wild Geese Howard
3 months ago

I was hoping for sudden diagnosis of turbo cancer as the reason. Oh well!

Compsci
Compsci
Reply to  The Wild Geese Howard
3 months ago

Shades of Dorian Gray…except there is no portrait of her in a locked bedroom to take the hit.

sentry
sentry
3 months ago

holodomor famine is j-ish fault, no one blames the js, they blame the russians.

Ukraine war is a j-ish project, no one blames the js, they blame the ukrainian nazis.

Zelenski & Nuland get to break dance to Hava Nagila till they reach 100, like kissinger, whilst ukrainians get their numbers culled every 100 years.

In a hundred years Ukraine will suffer the same fate. Why?

Cause they never learn their lesson, no one does.

The infiltration never ends.

Citizen of a Silly Country
Citizen of a Silly Country
3 months ago

Exclusion has been the go-to tool for the ruling class for some time because for them, it’s what they fear most. They also attack any attempt by others to form their own groups, again because that would reduce the power of their exclusion. As Z notes, it’s a sign of who are the elite and their culture. The managerial class is very feminine and exclusion is definitely what women fear the most. But the ruling class is Jewish, who also fear exclusion as they can’t survive on their own. Confident men don’t fear exclusion. They form new groups and build… Read more »

DLS
DLS
Reply to  Citizen of a Silly Country
3 months ago

What a crazy upside down world. If you had told me 20 years ago I would be rooting for former enemy countries not known for their freedoms, in order to maintain my own freedoms, I would have thought you were mentally ill.

RealityRules
RealityRules
3 months ago

In a very short time the ACM went from a top CS/SE association where the top focus was achievement and knowledge accumulation and dissemination to having DIE departments. Here is a featured person this week: acm.org/articles/people-of-acm/2024/diedre-mulligan Look at the resume. Her research focuses on, “protecting values including privacy, equity and freedom of expression.” Uh. None of those are values. They are states – desired states or outcomes that managers want. Why do they want them? Well, it is a veil of sad-sack virtues that justify sinecures that grant an idle life of enjoying affluence and status. Managerialism seems to be… Read more »

Mr. Dark
Reply to  RealityRules
3 months ago

Exactly. It’s all about the bucks. And, having mastered her (useless) position, she’ll proceed to “mentor” others in how to rig the game.

DaBears
DaBears
Reply to  RealityRules
3 months ago

Former IEEE and ACM active member here. The rot in these and similar organizations set in well more than a decade ago. Most members are passivists, a social justice warrior will steamroll them every time. Members are conditioned to the abuse and willingly embrace it as just another environmental variable to contend with. These folks will not be the cavalry riding to our rescue, trust me.

OrangeFrog
OrangeFrog
Reply to  DaBears
3 months ago

You hit on a very good point about the members of these sorts of institutions – their passive natures. It is no wonder they’ll be steamrollered. It is a great shame about the ACM, but totally predictable of course. Fellows don’t even know they’re in a battle. The oddest thing though, is that research into these fields, as well as correspondence and organization could still easily happen if the key members all wanted it to. If you want to speak to others about some new theories in compiler construction, just reach out and find them. Cut out the leftists and… Read more »

Steve
Steve
Reply to  OrangeFrog
3 months ago

It’s a bit more subtle than that. To most, they are not under attack. Currently, because of the company I’m running (selling), I’m most familiar with NACE. The real one, Corrosion Engineers.

There are plenty of high quality papers there, and plenty of at least moderately decent research. All you have to do is skip over the occasional crap. Like you have to do with junk mail and spam anyway. Until it reaches some critical mass, it’s just business as usual.

Robbo
Robbo
Reply to  Steve
3 months ago

Corrosion engineers: that’s what comes of living in a Low Rust Society. Sorry. Hard day.

imbroglio
imbroglio
3 months ago

I don’t see the face saving. It sounds like she lost an in-fight to become Deputy Secretary of State. So she resigns and gets to keep her benefits. Or maybe she got fired and gets to keep her benefits. Same thing. And she’s got the connections to go somewhere else. No she suffers no real loss. The larger point is that a true elite doesn’t need to save face. The aristocratic class sets the norm and rules accordingly. The rest know their place. In this halcyon state of biological/cultural homogeneity based on common ancestry (both of which are likely myths,)… Read more »

Arshad Ali
Arshad Ali
3 months ago

“It never occurred to them that he and his government did not understand what any of this meant.” They probably did know and recognised it as one more attempt to ostracise Russia. But these days it’s not longer cool to be part of a losing coalition and the Western bloc is on its way down. Russia+China and the satellites around them is where the action is. It’s turning out that the USA and its thralls are succeeding in getting themselves ostracised. “Instead, they view themselves as having scored the better on the test, relative to others.” For sure the system… Read more »

Hemid
Hemid
Reply to  Arshad Ali
3 months ago

Being Jewish is definitely among the secret (in a sense) qualifications for membership in the “meritocratic elite.” Unz has the chart. But it’s not enough. I don’t think a list could be made. I think everyone is tested individually, according to the preference(s) of the tester(s). In my case, I’d probably be some kind of intelligence director now if not for rejecting a single sexual advance when I was 16. No “opportunities for advancement” *of any kind* ever followed. Can’t blame boomer greed, The Economy, reversion to the mean, etc., for my being poorer than my parents. I failed a… Read more »

Mr. Dark
3 months ago

The elites play a game called “Who Gets To Be The Greater Victim?” Female is better than male, because women are ever-suffering saints who have it so rough (even though as long as she retains a shred of looks she’ll be living on Easy Street). Black is better than white, because blacks are an oppressed underclass (even though there are fine jobs available as tokens across the world if you can act White). The “elites” are a bunch of petulant, ungrateful whiners who need to be forced to work in the Private Sector (at reduced pay) until they can see… Read more »

Citizen of a Silly Country
Citizen of a Silly Country
Reply to  Mr. Dark
3 months ago

You’re leaving out the biggest victim of all.

Mr. Dark
Reply to  Citizen of a Silly Country
3 months ago

*sighs* Oh, there’s so many. Who can keep track?

Citizen of a Silly Country
Citizen of a Silly Country
Reply to  Mr. Dark
3 months ago

There are many victim groups, but there is one victim group to rule them all – and they never let us forget it.

Lineman
Lineman
Reply to  Citizen of a Silly Country
3 months ago

Yea some are trying their darndest to get us to focus somewhere else…It’s all so tiresome…

Robbo
Robbo
Reply to  Citizen of a Silly Country
3 months ago

I know, right? Bloody French!

Natureboi
Natureboi
3 months ago

Great post. I hadn’t thought of that. A difference in cultures where “saving face” is a thing is that the party in question will still be disciplined behind the scenes by a personal ingroup. Usually the family or tribe. This is what happens in East Asian cultures, the political boss who screws up and commits too much graft will be allowed to resign and retire, but then later on it will turn out that his son, who has seniority, for some reason is not going to inherit control of the family business. So the question would be are Nuland and… Read more »

george 1
george 1
Reply to  Natureboi
3 months ago

In the case of people like Nuland, no. She will not pay any price, unless you count going to a think tank and “earning” a seven figure salary is punishment.

She will get paid huge sums to produce useless research and articles in which she comes to the wrong conclusions. Those conclusions will be what is thought to be good for her tribe.

DLS
DLS
Reply to  george 1
3 months ago

She won’t be able to kill anyone, so it’s still a win for humanity.

Lineman
Lineman
Reply to  DLS
3 months ago

Wouldn’t count on it…

anon
anon
Reply to  DLS
3 months ago

She could be given a senior position in the WEF where she would produce “research agreed upon by the majority of scientists” that claims that killing 90% of the earth’s population is a Great Idea™.

Robbo
Robbo
Reply to  Natureboi
3 months ago

Again, I disagree. This woman has spent ten key years of her miserable existence on a project that has not just failed but backfired massively. It will haunt her the rest of her days.

Ostei Kozelskii
Member
Reply to  Robbo
3 months ago

Haunt how? Certainly not her conscience because she doesn’t have one.

Jeffrey Zoar
Jeffrey Zoar
Reply to  Ostei Kozelskii
3 months ago

Her failure will haunt her. Not that she’ll ever publicly own up to it

usNthem
usNthem
3 months ago

I’m not sure who she’s been saving face from. Everyone in her circle knows she screwed the pooch (or was screwed by the pooch if it could stand it). I doubt one in a million normal people would even know who “Torie” nuland is, so they couldn’t care less. Of course, self introspection among these elite turds is all but nonexistent. But yeah, I’m sure her ugly mug will show up somewhere to pontificate on and elucidate us as to how Trump or Putin is destroying muh democracy. CH’s (now nillas with attitude) gabsite had a pic of her back… Read more »

Natureboi
Natureboi
Reply to  usNthem
3 months ago

That’s not what “saving face” means in Oriental cultures.

Panzernutter
Panzernutter
Reply to  usNthem
3 months ago

I was thinking the same thing, when I mention nuland to foaming at the mouth Ukraine zombies, they have no idea who I’m talking about. They do know what kind of lip Baum ms. Swift wears or how much weight Lizo has lost. We should be able to use this kind of ignorance to our advantage eventually.

Evil Sandmich
Evil Sandmich
Reply to  usNthem
3 months ago

self introspection among these elite turds is all but nonexistent

The characterization of Dracula not being able to see his reflection did not come from nowhere (nor his hated of Christianity, or obsession over shiksas, er, non-Dracula women, etc.).

ChrisZ
ChrisZ
Reply to  Evil Sandmich
3 months ago

Brilliant insight into the reflection thing. I’ve never thought of it that way, but of course it fits with the other attributes that make “vampiric” a meaningful descriptor for our time.

Steve
Steve
Reply to  Evil Sandmich
3 months ago

Interesting thought. ‘Course it applies pretty broadly to people across cultures, but it strikes me that “vampires” is probably a socially-acceptable characterization, particularly because it applies to most (all?) of our ruling class.

Ought to get past the censorship algos, and at least for a while, the LLMs, too.

Jeffrey Zoar
Jeffrey Zoar
Reply to  Evil Sandmich
3 months ago

The one on Sesame Street sure did have a big nose

Ostei Kozelskii
Member
Reply to  Jeffrey Zoar
3 months ago

Perhaps Count von Count was fabricated in the image of his Hebraic creator, Norman Stiles.

SouthPoll
SouthPoll
Reply to  Evil Sandmich
3 months ago

I did not ever connect Bram Stoker’s vampires with “anti-semitism” but it’s indeed a thing and makes sense particularly given the time it was written. But this all changed 20+ years ago with Buffy and the glamorization of vampires (no I have never watched that nonsense!). Gone is the roughly Jewish image, the aversion to the cross and love of money. They are apparently caring creatures nowadays. What do you all make of that?

Jeffrey Zoar
Jeffrey Zoar
Reply to  SouthPoll
3 months ago

I’d say Anne Rice did the most to change it, with Buffy and others the lower brow versions in her wake

Robbo
Robbo
Reply to  usNthem
3 months ago

I hope she is saving face – for the next horror movie.

JG
JG
3 months ago

Maybe I’m wrong, but after reading, I am reminded of how the “elite” or famous people or whatever insist on doubling down on lying. Moreso over something trivial. Tell another lie and they can save face and maybe people move on. I thought about Jussie and Bill C. when reading this article. They are incapable of admitting they f-ed up or was wrong. The lies become bigger and more ridiculous, but as long as there is no -mea culpa- they remain unstained and clean.

Hoagie
Hoagie
Reply to  JG
3 months ago

Hell, Biden does that every day. It’s like his MO.

Major Hoople
Major Hoople
Member
3 months ago

Nuland has caused the death of a million people ballpark in the Ukraine. I know on the Hitler Scale, this only hits a one out of six, but still. Yes, I know this is an antisemitism, but it doesn’t even amount to a penny’s worth on the HS. I’ve come to the conclusion that the tribe should not be allowed in government. Doctors, yes. Physicists and mathematicians, absolutely. Comedians? Perfection! But government only gets the not so smart Jews with a grudge. Not a good thing.

ChrisZ
ChrisZ
Reply to  Major Hoople
3 months ago

Interesting observation, Major. It suggests that some people, maybe some groups, can have value in the advisory role, but are unfit for the command role. I can see precedents for this in history and culture. A key distinction between the two roles would be accountability, which is a theme of Zman’s column today.

Of course, that would make our current regime—a rule by supposed experts—is a tremendous folly. And a lethally destructive one, as you note, and as we have seen.

Alzaebo
Alzaebo
Reply to  Major Hoople
3 months ago

One Eastern European state, I forget which one, was powerful, successful, and lasting because of one simple law: no Jews allowed in government, law, finance, or academia.

On second thought, this might be why the shtetls are so single-mindedly bent on vengeance: reduced to farming and cobbling!! and then the Amish came in, also settlers as poor as they, and kicked their ass in out-farming them.

Mike
Mike
Reply to  Major Hoople
3 months ago

My perfect world would be none in the professions except medicine, none in teaching and none in government elected appointed or employed in any way. They would become a tradesman only class if they are capable of it. Also no citizenship, no voting, lobbying and donating. In short, guests here at our sufference.

Lineman
Lineman
Reply to  Mike
3 months ago

Perfect world would not have them in it at all…Whites are more than sufficient at handling anything…